Reptile - How to deal with him

[THTB]

An idea of a thread I had that I think other good players should do, to get the info out there how to deal with their specific characters. I know...why teach people how to beat you? Simple...getting the knowledge about weaknesses of various characters out there so that not only do people get better at the matchup, but options open up that can extend over to other characters. In other words, it can help you learn about what your character excels at as well, their weaknesses, and what you can apply to help understand your character better. If you haven't noticed...characters like Kung Lao, Ermac, Cyrax, Raiden, etc, get so much flock because they are good and people just don't understand the weaknesses of said character...or wanna learn to. Well...might as well get it all out in the open.

Okay, let's get started. Obviously, Reptile is a great character. Great projectiles, good damage, relatively safe, great tricks and mind games, great mobility...just all-around a good character. How do you deal with this?

Answer is...you really can't. LOL I'm kidding, but seriously, Reptile is not without his flaws.

Projectiles - Obviously, you know about spit and forceballs. All very good. Spit travels fast, forceballs force the opponent to defend in some way or get hit for a combo. Really useful tools...if Reptile gets them on screen that is. One of the biggest issues with Reptile's projectiles are the startup. They are not that fast. If this were SF and projectiles clashed, it wouldn't be that bad...but since projectiles trade instead, this can cause issues. Because of this, it gets difficult to keep up in projectile wars if Reptile doesn't play it smart. Oftentimes, Reptile has to sacrifice life to get ahead in the zoning game...meaning he'll have to risk an unfavorable trade to get you to block so he can throw out his projectile before you. So, if you can play the keepaway game smart, you can really mess with Reptile.

Back to Corner - Yes, Reptile has EX dash. Little secret...Reptile's EX dash is not 100% safe on block. There is a small window after the first hit where, if you're crouch blocking, you can uppercut him. I'm not 100% sure if this works with everyone, but I know for certain Nightwolf, Kung Lao, Liu Kang, Johnny Cage, and whoever else has a fast uppercut pretty much stuffs him during it. This doesn't help that Reptile's normal dashes are so slow and lack range. So, in a sense, Reptile sorta has some trouble getting out of a corner without losing life. Add in the fact that it has no extra properties, and this is why getting cornered vs Sub-Zero SUCKS.

Wakeup - Reptile's wakeup consists of really only 1 option...slide. No, dash is not a wakeup attack. You will get stuffed for attempting it. But anyway, slide is his best option at wakeup...obviously it's unsafe as hell. Full combo on block from anyone. And if you do attempt to use EX dash and it doesn't get stuffed, crouch block STILL deals with it.

Air Control - Reptile cannot control the air all that well. Aside from well-placed projectiles and a pretty meh uppercut, characters who can play the air game give him trouble. Notable character is Cyber Sub-Zero.

Mobility - Reptile's normal dashes are slow, as mentioned above. They don't really travel far either. This really hurts him when he wants to advance, because he really only has the elbow dash to get around the screen fast, and obviously it has to be spaced so that it whiffs, which means from wherever it hits, it can work against you, as it's a full combo if blocked. If you can make it difficult for Reptile to advance, you're doing a good job!

High/Low Mixups - Reptile does have them, and they're safe, but outside the corner, there's no damage. 1221/12b1 only gets you so far...21% for a correct guess doesn't really win anything, and if it's blocked properly, they're pushed back too far to keep anything going. Of course you can do 122 xx forceball instead of 1221, but yeah...have it blocked and tell me you'll do it again lol. Acid hand/slide mixups suck because of fuzzy guard. This is particularly why 321 is his most optimal string...it actually does something when it lands. A good Reptile will not want to apply high/low mixups because the reward is just not there. So this makes blocking Reptile's stuff much easier.

I hope some of this stuff helps you guys out. Yes, Reptile is good. Yes dash pisses you off. Yes, 321 is the pain train when it lands. But Reptile, like any other character, has his problems. Bottom line, Reptile doesn't want to get knocked down, because he struggles to get away once he's on his back, and if he goes down on life before getting back to a comfortable position, he can struggle to come back, despite his tools, because the best ways to do so just don't net any damage outside the corner. Now that you know this...hopefully you guys can come up with better ways to handle him.

 

[PunchYaFace]

When I fight him I try to keep my distance and spam fast projectiles. Then if my character has a good anti air use it when needed. I don't care if reptile uses EXs to get through. Make em burn meter I say. He is really good up close in my opinion so I like to wear em down from afar if possible.

 

[DaiHuu]

Very very good stuff, now I wanna make a how to deal with Nightwolf thread.

 

[CitizenSnips]

I agree with what you said about Reptile's relatively weak mixup game.

The best I can do with mixups is to get a slide in when opponents over commit to blocking the mid combos.

On the otherhand, Mileena and Liu Kang have far better mixups that launch low and overhead. I think Reptile also can't really frustrate with comboing nonstop like Liu Kang and Johny Cage. So it is kind of easy to stay blocking and not take so much chip damage compared to Kang, Kung etc.

I actually think getting in Reptile's face can be a good way to beat him, because like I said his mixup game is weak compared to others. The only thing you need to be careful is that sweep range because there he can elbow dash.

 

[xxteefxx]

Alright i wanna say some stuff in general, wither they were mentioned before or not (if they were mentioned then i apologize). I also have some Pin points to prove that SO FAR! reptile is diffenatly Top tier if not Himself the top! (my opinion ofcourse).
I spent a week doin nothing but PLaying online and fighting good people either online or Offline. Simple Reptile is amazing due to his ability to answer ANYTHING.
ofcourse am still practicing and people are as well that the game is fairly new! though so far, reptile is simply amazingly good char
Edit: so far the only chars that gave me hard time are Good scorpions (due to incenerate and spear max range mind game and in close mix ups), Quan chi unblockable spams can be annoying sometimes, Raiden b,f+3 anti all reptiles fireballs, Turtle Kabal and good nightwolve.

01-his d,b+2 is COMPLETELY safe as well as his Main pressure point. Amazing in corner for Juggle, very Safe and mid screen EX d,b+2 causes juggle state with same safety. also the fact that u can 3x dahs elbow after this move Makes Reptile VERY mobile.
02-Cr+4 is really good. Wither later startup or not, cr+4 have a really far range and Stuff BASICALLY 75% of all char's special moves and EX wake up game. Combining cr+4 with d,b+2 is Deadly mix up due to the Nature of b,d+2 = medium.
this is by far the most abused Reptile move i use! wither cr+4 into EX or regular
03- His wake up game is very decent in my opinoin. yes his slide EX is not safe but it's Diffenatly anti Projectile spamming, bomb traps and cannot be stuffed in a lot of situations. as well that it lead to Elbow dash mix ups
04-EX Elbow dash. Amazing move where ur completely safe right after. Stuffing people with cr+4 after into d,b+2 is really worth it in mid screen wake up games! as well that in general it's very strong.
ps: it's safe against uppercut, simply hold down to avoid uppercut....or just stuff it in with cr+4 into d,b+2

(now into some stuff that i didnt see them bein posted here)
05- do anybody know bout the full screen mix ups when opponent is on the ground? basically lets give a quick example ; lets say ur far away from opponent, do a fast fire ball into EX regular. if fast fireball hit him u can simple 3x Dash elbow quick for complete saftey. if done right , the fireball will be considered as a cross over (doesnt matter if blocked of course, though if opponent blocked then u can mix up with d+4 into d,b+2...if done right u can cause a small unblockable hit period!)
that ofcourse if opponent didnt ex wake up....in that case, it all depend on the EX wake up move. some move will break the ball, some wont causing a free juggle for reptile. i shall do a small vid about this so people can understand quite better

06-not good in air control? hmm i think reptile has a VERY solid Anti air answers! his fireball traps are simply enough. as for Cyber subzero....hmm, the only case Cyber sub is controlling air against reptile is when he's Close range on reptile....if air kick hit reptile then cyber sub just reseted the distance! if it's blocked, then it's reptile Favour.
in general EX fireball are anti Cyborg sub Air kick, as well as elbow dash. even a regular jump in place into Punch is anti Cyborg sub air kick :S...so i really dont see any problem. it could be ofoucrse frustrating when spammed, though i dont see reptile having a dis advantage at all! (wither sonya or cyborg sub)
ohh i also forgot! d,f+1EX (EX spit) is really good anti air ...though cyborg sub and sonya can easily stuff it sometimes if done wrong

07- getting Cornered as reptile is aint a problem at all! as well as most of the cast...pokes are the key. for reptile when cornered, simply cr+4 or a fast poke into EX Elbow dahs to get out easily or cr+4 or any other poke into d,b+2. it's a universal problem!
for instance Kitana can annoy people with her Far ranged cr+1...though doesnt mean opponent cannot escape the corner. basically if u think reptile cannot escape corner, then ALL the cast cant escape corner in a lot of situations :S

08- the mix ups....i agree. though f+2, d,b+2 is very VERY decent....a simple High med mix up, completely safe and push's back opponent for safety. i guess reptile strongest mix up is his 321 with a safe chain of Regular or EX d,b+2.

09- The only Disadvantage that Reptile might have is his wakeup game if cornered or pressure....by means when he's down on the ground, SPECIALLY in corner! (due to the fact that EX elbow dash is not a wake up move so it can be stuffed)...so i will agree with this fact!

all i can say is reptile = the green hand and dash elbow! those are his main strength....and ofcourse a very safe zoner and outer due to the fireballs

 

[THTB]

I don't even think acid hand is 100% safe, really. I'm pretty sure Reptile, Raiden, Kung Lao, and maybe a couple others can punish him for it. It's definitely disadvantage on block...it wouldn't surprise me if it is punishable.

And EX dash isn't safe. Something I highlighted. Enough leeway between the first and second hits to tag him out of it...at least a 7-frame window on crouch block if Nightwolf can uppercut through it and he has one of the faster uppercuts and REO was doing it in lag. I know for sure fast uppercuts after crouch blocking it stop it. If uppercut works, then Kung's spin probably works. I think Reptile can answer back with dash. Raiden can probably superman it. I wouldn't be surprised if Sub can clone it. It's probably tricky, but armored moves like X-Rays can probably rape it. Cyber probably gets a free ice parry (along with Cage and Kang). So on, and so forth. Once people start realizing this, I think the move will become way worse than it is. Yeah, you can cancel to it from d4, but d4 xx EX dash is not a link, so if the opponent can see this, they'll still block and punish accordingly.

I'm not saying Reptile isn't good or not top tier...I still think he is, and if he's not, he'll be very close. I just wanted to highlight flaws with him...things people don't exploit vs me or any other Reptile. It's mainly just to help come up with ideas that could work with other characters as well.

 

[xxteefxx]

I don't even think acid hand is 100% safe, really. I'm pretty sure Reptile, Raiden, Kung Lao, and maybe a couple others can punish him for it. It's definitely disadvantage on block...it wouldn't surprise me if it is punishable.

And EX dash isn't safe. Something I highlighted. Enough leeway between the first and second hits to tag him out of it...at least a 7-frame window on crouch block if Nightwolf can uppercut through it and he has one of the faster uppercuts and REO was doing it in lag. I know for sure fast uppercuts after crouch blocking it stop it. If uppercut works, then Kung's spin probably works. I think Reptile can answer back with dash. Raiden can probably superman it. I wouldn't be surprised if Sub can clone it. It's probably tricky, but armored moves like X-Rays can probably rape it. Cyber probably gets a free ice parry (along with Cage and Kang). So on, and so forth. Once people start realizing this, I think the move will become way worse than it is. Yeah, you can cancel to it from d4, but d4 xx EX dash is not a link, so if the opponent can see this, they'll still block and punish accordingly.

I'm not saying Reptile isn't good or not top tier...I still think he is, and if he's not, he'll be very close. I just wanted to highlight flaws with him...things people don't exploit vs me or any other Reptile. It's mainly just to help come up with ideas that could work with other characters as well.

Hey THTB ,.... hmm wut version are u playing? am dominating with reptile here in Local Philly tournaments and friendly one as well as am tryin to attend this coming one on 29th of may! all using the newest version. thnx all to dash elbow EX and Acid hand....am not showing off, am simply stating a really over powered thing lol

so u dont get me wrong, i know and i understand your post which is VERy cool to be honest and very usefull....though i am 100% certain and positive. hit the practice lab and try them out urself!

-as for EX elbow dahs: you cannot uppercut, u cannot reverse it, u cannot x ray it! nothing....it's an active move that causes stagger to opponent reseting the Frames!
any other way u got reversed then that means it's lag...that's so far from all the matches i played offline wither locally or with friends....as well that so far i didnt get countered online. i am positive cause i tested it with People PLENTY of times on plenty long period or a week

-as for the Acid hand...completely SAFE!! ex or not both are COmpletely safe!
done after cr+4 COMPLETELY SAFE!! u cant punish Cr+4 with ANYTHIGN period!! wither X ray, fast pokes or Reversal!
Cr+4 i believe is the strongest footsie for reptile as well as in general in the game!! very fast active frames, and very long range ...as well as it LITERLLY stuff 85% of the wakeup games wither with roll or not

PS: both acid hand and Ex dash causes stagger on opponent when blocked...it's not visible but for sure it resets the situation to null, making it completely zero frames for both players to do active moves......
also non of them are reversable by any MOVE period cause u can simply block them*

please test em out again and check if am correct or not?
i just tested them with my friends AGAIN for like the 5th time using all the staggering situations, they are all safe (just to make sure)

Also to prove it to u, i would like u to be patient for today i will hopefully record and release a small vid about reptile concering New combos people didnt see so far, as well as the main focus Of reptile Guarenteed traps, tactics, Cr+4 stuff, acid hand properties as well as cr+4 counter attack into combos (like countering scorpion teleport with cr+4 into b,b+2 * connecting)

another thing, cr+4 into anything doesnt connect unless it's air* i didnt say they connect ....though u cannot do ANYTHING about the cr+4 if linked with Acid hand period!

thanks again for replying and reading man.....waiting for your reply or please wait for my vid later today or tomorrow hopefully

 

[THTB]

I'm playing the one that is recently updated. EX dash is not safe on block vs fast uppercuts when crouch blocked. The second hit does not come out That's at the very least. And it was like that before the hotfix, too. I haven't thoroughly tested it, but REO and I looked into it some when we last played. It is definitely possible to hit him during it. It does not cause any sort of special stagger. It works with Nightwolf...so it should work with a couple others.

About acid hand, I'm not 100% sure whether it's punishable, but the best way to see what I mean is doing acid hand then jumping at the same time. Reptile jumps last, meaning that the move is at least frame disadvantage when blocked. The stagger is very, very deceiving.

 

[xxteefxx]

I'm playing the one that is recently updated. EX dash is not safe on block vs fast uppercuts when crouch blocked. The second hit does not come out That's at the very least. And it was like that before the hotfix, too. I haven't thoroughly tested it, but REO and I looked into it some when we last played. It is definitely possible to hit him during it. It does not cause any sort of special stagger. It works with Nightwolf...so it should work with a couple others.

About acid hand, I'm not 100% sure whether it's punishable, but the best way to see what I mean is doing acid hand then jumping at the same time. Reptile jumps last, meaning that the move is at least frame disadvantage when blocked. The stagger is very, very deceiving.

hey man. thnx for replying....ahh you mean blocking the First hit and quickly Uppercut before reptile hit opponent with the second hit? alright i shall try it....even if it's not, i will AGAIN put it to the test. i will hit the shower right now and then work on it.

as for the acid hand, i will re put test on it AGAIN! ...gimmie 2 hours and i will make deeper analysis on them, my friend is here beside me so he will assist me by doin the reptile stuff.

 

[xxteefxx]

alright just tested it......first of before i say anything, i must say MK system is so weird and full of bugs!! here are some stuff i discovered so far

-Kill opponent with last hit with a fast fireball (while it mentions finish him) do an EX fireball slow COMPLETELY charged .....followed by another slow one! yes thats the weird thing, sometimes happens and sometimes not... if done correctly the slow regular fireball will cancel the EX slow fireball. in general something like that cannot happen cause simply u cannot cast two small fireball :S. this can be repeated 3 times only...u cannot do small regular fire ball followed by another slow fireball, one must be an EX fully charged to cancel the other

-Other bug i noticed is sometmies the FB disapears!! and whenever i hit opponent with anything he will be exploded! i guess this happens due to FB spam maybe?

to get into the subject anyways....tell now there's some stuff in the game that I dont REALLY get :S ...for example i just tried the Acid hand after a Cr+4....if both of us jumped at the same time right after opponent will land faster!
though here's somethign i discovered through out my play...there's nothing called Buffering while Blocking a special or being hit!! i tried it and doesnt work! once ur being hit wither blocked or not, and that u BLOCKed a sequence attack then u wont be able to reversal with a buffer special move after a block!
this game doesnt have the buffering system unless if it's Fatality? oldschool mk i guess (please check on this anyone who can.) beside that, the system have shortcut and Easy hit confirm if done on ground by previously buffering a NON BLOCKED special move (E.G: reptile 3,2,1~ dash...dash can be buffered a bit early....no need to hit confirm as if ur doin it in air juggle!)

i am not sure cause i dont know the terms in computer or frame languages, but that u can easily deduct and see from playing MK9 system..

the reason why i brought the subject is, u Cannot Reversal ANYTHING after a blocked move unless if the Move have a disadvantage Window after it's done. i will check reptile frame data, but again frames or not the system has a COMPLETE different play style from most of the fighting games (E.G SF)
so for the Acid hands, u cant Punish it with ANYTHING at all when it's blocked! and u cannot reverse or quickly hit anything to stuff in Acid hand after cr+4...apparently because of the pre buffer system that doesnt exists when being hit or blocked.

as for the EX dash...the SAME exact case! again tested for plenty of times with Different Players, and Different friends! completely safe when blocked and non punishable after or when the move is casted midway or while opponent being hit.


am releasing a video about it....as a shortcut response to this issue.....as well as other stuff i think people might find very usefull.

thnx again THTB for your reply man....please test them again or if anyone in here can do that, please feel free and report! a vid will also be very usefull

EDIT: as for the vid , i wont be able to release it today! if possible i will release it next friday because i have work + summer course! so please be patient if u wanna see this with your own eyes.

 

[xxteefxx]

Again to make sure. can other people help us in this? try it out and if u can please record it!

-simply let ur friend or anyone who can play with reptile. Get ex meteres with him and let him preform EX dash and after it's done let him either quickly spam or confirm input cr+4 or simply Block.
while reptile Doin EX dash simply block it st. or crouch block it and try to reverse after the EX dash. Also try to Interrupt it after First hit bein block, or second hit being block. you can do reversal of anything to test it out with, wither Fast uppercuts (Night wolf, cage and Kung Lao) or pokes to stuff in reptile.

From my test , the only logic explanation is That u cannot Pre buffer reverse when ur blocking wither standing or Crouching...hence frames are reseted to Zero due to the window gap after certain move
For example to prove it( while standing block: let opponent jump punch you mid way into a spammed Throw.....u cannot poke or stuff in anything after guarding the punch. your only solution will be to break the Grab/throw)

 

[THTB]

Once I can get someone to test it with me, I'll post a vid.

 

[Milk]

Reptile's most reliable reversals or comeback tools usually require meter, or an incredibly situational well placed combo, so, yeah, come back with Reptile can be a bit finnickey. Our wake up option is meh, and with our damage nerf, we have to work harder to get our kills. But, I still love the ugly guy, he's still amazing.

 

[Cr1ms0n]

After plenty of testing I don't really mind the damage nerf now. As long as that is all they do nerf I believe Reptile will be ok.

 

[Pagan]

Thanks for the reptile tips. This guy gives me more problems than anyone else.

Trying to keep it friendly here since I am in enemy territory coming to the Reptile forum and all

I feel, even post quick fix patch, Reptile is arguably in a tier all on his own at the top. He's not as popular as other characters and so we just didn't pay much attention to him during the first month but now word is getting around. I played against one at a tavern who was mediocre but forced me to use meter just to stay alive. If my execution wasn't perfect I wasn't taking the round. Then after watching that stream of master chef I feel more confident in my suspicions that Reptile is a one man army. If you can find the youtube of master chef it's worth watching.

 

[MKF30]

One move I noticed that seems to go not mentioned most of the time used often is his reverse acid hand move, that people I've noticed use in combo enders and as AA sometimes but not often I've noticed. Is this move not that good you think or only good for unique situations?

As far as dealing with Reptile, I have noticed that playing keep away works well. Do not let him get in close to you imo this tactic works well and anticipating his dash and countering helps. If you have a character that has fast, easily spammable projectiles this can work great against Reptile imo

 

[Samsung Crunchy]

The only thing is was truly worried about dealing with Reptile was Dash and Ex Dash. Thanks to THTB, I know now it's not as safe as it seems and can be punished.

 

[Milk]

One move I noticed that seems to go not mentioned most of the time used often is his reverse acid hand move, that people I've noticed use in combo enders and as AA sometimes but not often I've noticed. Is this move not that good you think or only good for unique situations?

As far as dealing with Reptile, I have noticed that playing keep away works well. Do not let him get in close to you imo this tactic works well and anticipating his dash and countering helps. If you have a character that has fast, easily spammable projectiles this can work great against Reptile imo

To hit the green hand as an AA, you'd have to do it pretty early into the jump for it to come out completely and AA. EX is an okay AA, but he's got a ton of better options, such as 1 xx fb. It's very situational, amazing for corner combos and to end a blocked 3 2 1 string.

Reptile can zone as well, so don't let that be your ENTIRE strategy, and he can jump between the projectiles and tag you with an elbow dash of some kind, but, it's not a terrible strategy. Not letting him get close though is good.

 

[xxteefxx]

no, again EX elbow dash is completely safe as well as cr+4 ~ acid hands..... only FEW chars in the game can break it with 1 frame window input poke(1 or 2) (like Kitana) due to her poke Range.

i am actually recording a video in DEPTH about it, though will require time due to the fact that it require a friend to help me with such a vid. the vid will be part of matches, training mode using all roaster with EX move, regular, x ray or even pokes to counter it and how this trap exactly works and understanding the idea of Block Series in MK9 (like the Kabal Block string Infinite)

here's a vid i also released today, some of the traps and the basic idea of the trap exsits there, enhanced as well with mix ups and wake up game...it's somehow different than this topic, though the same basic of any poke (non link) to acid hand bein completely safe as well as EX elbow dash on block.