What's new

Video/Tutorial Raven's BGB trait mixup

MsMiharo

Kuff Bano
Basically I've been working on Raven's interactable usage and how to incorporate trait activation without b23. So after a BGB you get a free trait activation and a mixup with the ability to beat out most wakeups. Once they respect your options you can really start fucking with their heads.

1: Basic setup to beat out alot of wakeups
2-4 Options on non wakeup.
5: b23 is throw immune so walking up will fake a throw and put the opponent at full screen
6-9 At the right distance j2 will crossup but j1 won't. You can also play games with j3.
10: This is really gimmicky but when they start respecting your ability to teleport behind them you can fake a crossup teleport and stay on the same side and combo.
11: The window is tight but teleport will avoid 6f wakeus.
12-13: Punishing wakeups that move the opponent away
14-15: Jumping and delaying the teleport will get you a 50/50 j2/3 chance
16: Shazam's teleport makes her Behind Dark Transmission place her in a non-crossup state which can be confusing for the opponent

I'm new so help me tag people please @Blind_Ducky @Sami
 

Sami

Noob
More awesome stuff. Thoughts:

1) Instant nj1~interactable could work if you wanted to escape out (yay acrobatics...) or dive kick (depends on the stage).

2) Rather than cancelling into trait immediately, jump forward and trait above where you expect them to land. Can cause reversed inputs for wake-ups, will make a lot of wake-ups wiff, allows you to follow with air teleport front/back, or to come down with an ambigious j2/j3. A lot will depend on frame advantage - things like corps charge might end up catching you.

3) To bait wake-ups, jump back and then trait low to the ground (on the way up rather than coming down). You should have the frame advantage for the low jump-trait-land to still block afterwards.

4) Will bgb->trait->forward dash reverse wake-ups without exposing you to a punish?


As for the combos, 1 bar + bgb for 45-50% should be the standard for optimum combos. Generally speaking Raven gets to replace 2 bar combo with 1 bar + BGB for the same damage and 2 bar combos should be pushing 50%. It's weird - she has terrible 0 and 2+ bar damage but her 1 bar is really good. Getting the extra 5-6% or so from the 2nd bar by using a B2B is always nice :)
 

MsMiharo

Kuff Bano
More awesome stuff. Thoughts:

1) Instant nj1~interactable could work if you wanted to escape out (yay acrobatics...) or dive kick (depends on the stage).

2) Rather than cancelling into trait immediately, jump forward and trait above where you expect them to land. Can cause reversed inputs for wake-ups, will make a lot of wake-ups wiff, allows you to follow with air teleport front/back, or to come down with an ambigious j2/j3. A lot will depend on frame advantage - things like corps charge might end up catching you.

3) To bait wake-ups, jump back and then trait low to the ground (on the way up rather than coming down). You should have the frame advantage for the low jump-trait-land to still block afterwards.

4) Will bgb->trait->forward dash reverse wake-ups without exposing you to a punish?


As for the combos, 1 bar + bgb for 45-50% should be the standard for optimum combos. Generally speaking Raven gets to replace 2 bar combo with 1 bar + BGB for the same damage and 2 bar combos should be pushing 50%. It's weird - she has terrible 0 and 2+ bar damage but her 1 bar is really good. Getting the extra 5-6% or so from the 2nd bar by using a B2B is always nice :)
Thanks!

1) I'm not really sure what you mean. Could you elaborate?

2) Hm this might work, but I'm afraid d2's might stuff it?

3) I'll test this later

4) The timing to teleport against corps charge is strict so I'm guessing no. Maybe against characters with slow wakeups.

It's true but I've seen a lot of sub optimal BGB-combos used when you can get 43% or so meterless and 50% with 1 bar.
 

Sami

Noob
1) Neutral jump 1 (and 2 with great timing) will hit people standing up even if they're holding down as for a couple of frames they have a much taller hitbox than crouching. So, after the trait you do the nj1 to put them into hit/block stun and/or avoid horizontal wake-ups and then use an aerial interactable to finish off. If you're above a dive-kick one then it will combo, or things like the big long bar in the middle of atlantis will give you some distance/etc. Depending on where you end up you might be able to nj1 and then teleport to reach a more damaging interactable.

2) D2 might stuff it, but then it can also stuff some of your jump-in setups too.

Also - derailing slightly - does the BGB on Themyscira give you enough advantage (no trait) to set them on fire afterwards?
 

MsMiharo

Kuff Bano
1) Which stage does have a bgb and a dive.kick int though?

2) Testing this out atm.

Tbh traiting above their head is so-so because it gives them so much time to react. It does work for causing input errors but that's about it. HOWEVER if you have trait out (for instance if you do this setup then juggle them back into BGB) you can jump over them to mess up wakeups and tele back being safe from a reversed WU.
1) Neutral jump 1 (and 2 with great timing) will hit people standing up even if they're holding down as for a couple of frames they have a much taller hitbox than crouching. So, after the trait you do the nj1 to put them into hit/block stun and/or avoid horizontal wake-ups and then use an aerial interactable to finish off. If you're above a dive-kick one then it will combo, or things like the big long bar in the middle of atlantis will give you some distance/etc. Depending on where you end up you might be able to nj1 and then teleport to reach a more damaging interactable.

2) D2 might stuff it, but then it can also stuff some of your jump-in setups too.

Also - derailing slightly - does the BGB on Themyscira give you enough advantage (no trait) to set them on fire afterwards?
 

MsMiharo

Kuff Bano
The canisters in the middle slam the opponet to the background and back. Like I said: not a normal background bounce. Not sure if it can be comboed off anyway - just brainstorming :)
Nah the recovery is horrible. You can however absorb someone throwing them and full combo punish which is awesome