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General/Other - Jason Voorhees [Patched] Unstoppable Jason 27% throw bug and more.

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@GGA N1k0lasss knows how much I love Unstoppable Jason, and he was kind enough to run a tech session with me yesterday which was awesome. We found another Jason bug yesterday, but at least this latest bug helps Jason!

Here is the list of the 4 Jason bugs I have found so far.

1. Unstoppable Jason throw bug.
With Punishment (d,d, 3) buff on Jason gets a 1.3 damage multiplier. So Jason's 12% throw should do 15.6% damage, it does 20%.

With Rampant (d,d, MB 3) buff on Jason gets a 1.5 damage multiplier. So his throw should do 18% damage, it does 27%! This looks similar to the Pyro Tanya throw bug. Either that or it is accidentally getting a 2.25 damage multiplier.

2. Unstoppable Rise and Corpse Walk bug.
Rise is the 5% heal over 6.5 real seconds buff that Jason gets. His ex version Corpse walk heals the same amount of health over the same amount of time. A complete waste of meter.

3. Unstoppable Resurrection bug.
When Jason dies and Resurrects with 1 bar he rez's with 10% health.
With 2 bars that 2nd bar adds 6% health for a total of 16%.
With 3 bars that 3rd bar adds 9.5% health for a total of 25.5%.
What is going on here? Is the first bar correct and each bar is supposed to heal for 10%? Or is the 2 bars scenario correct and each bar is supposed to heal for 8%?
Also Jason mains beware. You get ZERO credit for incomplete meter. So if you have 2 bars and your 3rd bar is 99% full, you still only heal for 16%! So you are basically rezzing spending 3 bars and only getting 16% out of it!

4. Relentless passive damage bug.
Relentless damage stack does not increase to 50% extra damage until you are AT 3% health or Lower. So the 33% extra damage is through the health values of 10%-4%.

Well that is all the bugs I have found so far. I will keep you guys posted if I find anymore. I really, really love the Relentless and Unstoppable design NRS has come up with. I can't wait till the next patch and hopefully we get the fixes and buffs us Jason mains need and deserve.

@colt
@16 Bit
 
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Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
I honestly don't think #2 and #3 are bugs. Corpse walk has faster startup, so it's safer. Ressurection health numbers are likely intentional for balance purposes.

Good find on #1 though! That's a nice glitch in Jason's favor.
 
I honestly don't think #2 and #3 are bugs. Corpse walk has faster startup, so it's safer. Ressurection health numbers are likely intentional for balance purposes.

Good find on #1 though! That's a nice glitch in Jason's favor.
Don't think for 1 second that spending a bar of meter for the exact same effect and it only starts up an extremely minimal amount faster is what NRS intended for that move.

Rez bug is a bug too because the numbers are so random. 10, 6, 9.5. That has to be a bug too. You honestly think NRS was like "yeah that 3rd bar should have a fraction in it.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
Don't think for 1 second that spending a bar of meter for the exact same effect and it only starts up an extremely minimal amount faster is what NRS intended for that move.
It lets him activate it in more situations where he normally couldn't. That's how spending the bar becomes beneficial.

Rez bug is a bug too because the numbers are so random. 10, 6, 9.5. That has to be a bug too. You honestly think NRS was like "yeah that 3rd bar should have a fraction in it.
Lot's of moves do fractional damage so why not?
 
It lets him activate it in more situations where he normally couldn't. That's how spending the bar becomes beneficial.?
So you are saying it is not bugged because it comes out a couple frames faster on a long startup move? Regular Rise comes out in 46 frames, and ex Rise comes out in 38 frames and that justifies a bar of meter for 0% more health gain? What if Ex Rise came out in 45 frames instead of 46. That would be faster. Therefore in some situations you would get benefit on the move coming out 1 frame faster so because you get a benefit it is not a bug?

This design would be the equivalent of Tremor's ex ground pound move that guarantees 13% OTG damage to "guys spend a bar of meter and the regular one will come out a couple frames faster but it won't otg!" I'm sure we could find a use for that move.

Or I got one. Quan Chi's EX rune trap. Let's take away, the +14 frames you get. Oh also let's take away the launcher you get as well. Let's make it exactly the same as the regular rune which is full combo punish on block. But its OK because the 2nd rune will come out a little faster now.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
So you are saying it is not bugged because it comes out a couple frames faster on a long startup move? Regular Rise comes out in 46 frames, and ex Rise comes out in 38 frames and that justifies a bar of meter for 0% more health gain? What if Ex Rise came out in 45 frames instead of 46. That would be faster. Therefore in some situations you would get benefit on the move coming out 1 frame faster so because you get a benefit it is not a bug?
False equivalency. 1 frame does not equal 8 frames. 38 frames is much faster than 46. He gets the benefit of activating a buff after a njk connects.

This design would be the equivalent of Tremor's ex ground pound move that guarantees 13% OTG damage to "guys spend a bar of meter and the regular one will come out a couple frames faster but it won't otg!" I'm sure we could find a use for that move.
Logical fallacy. Jason buffs don't lose anything by doing the ex version, only gain something.

Or I got one. Quan Chi's EX rune trap. Let's take away, the +14 frames you get. Oh also let's take away the launcher you get as well. Let's make it exactly the same as the regular rune which is full combo punish on block. But its OK because the 2nd rune will come out a little faster now.
Again, logical fallacy. The move is improved by doing the ex version, nothing is taken away as you suggest in these examples. A better example would have been Tremor's summon boulder move, which comes out faster than summon crystal. Nothing else changes about the move. This is consistent with NRS design, i.e., not a bug.
 
Logical fallacy. Jason buffs don't lose anything by doing the ex version, only gain something.
WRONG. EX moves START with whatever the regular version was and then they ADD things to the EX version. If they don't ADD something to an EX move then it is a waste of meter. Tremor's EX ground pound gets ADDED properties like the OTG. Jason's Rise move never had anything ADDED to it. If your gonna tell me that 8 frames faster on a 40+ frame move is a fine addition and what the developers intended for EX Rise, then we will just never agree.

I can only hope you would be in charge of EX moves on the top tier characters and stay far away from my Unstoppable Jason.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
WRONG. EX moves START with whatever the regular version was and then they ADD things to the EX version. If they don't ADD something to an EX move then it is a waste of meter. Tremor's EX ground pound gets ADDED properties like the OTG. Jason's Rise move never had anything ADDED to it. If your gonna tell me that 8 frames faster on a 40+ frame move is a fine addition and what the developers intended for EX Rise, then we will just never agree.

I can only hope you would be in charge of EX moves on the top tier characters and stay far away from my Unstoppable Jason.
There is a difference between a bug and poor balancing. I agree that EX Rise could have more health gain or something but faster startup is technically ADDING something. It's not much but to call it a bug just because you deem it a waste does not make it so.
 
There is a difference between a bug and poor balancing. I agree that EX Rise could have more health gain or something but faster startup is technically ADDING something. It's not much but to call it a bug just because you deem it a waste does not make it so.
The final point this is a bug. Let's look at Unstoppable Jason himself to prove the point.

D,D, 3. Is 46 frame startup, the same as D,D, 4.
The Ex D,D, 3 is 38 frame startup, just like D,D, 3.

EX D,D, 3 ADDS a .2 damage multiplier over the regular D,D, 3 as well as the extra frame startup. This shows NRS intention (because they aren't idiots and justifying a very slightly faster startup as enough reason for using an entire bar of meter! They add extra damage to EX D,D, 3.)
EX D,D, 4 adds nothing extra.

You can call it whatever you want to call it. But the community and video game testers would call this a bug. I'm done arguing at this point, because anything further in this area is just arguing about the definition of a bug and who cares about that.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
The final point this is a bug. Let's look at Unstoppable Jason himself to prove the point.

D,D, 3. Is 46 frame startup, the same as D,D, 4.
The Ex D,D, 3 is 38 frame startup, just like D,D, 3.

EX D,D, 3 ADDS a .2 damage multiplier over the regular D,D, 3 as well as the extra frame startup. This shows NRS intention (because they aren't idiots and justifying a very slightly faster startup as enough reason for using an entire bar of meter! They add extra damage to EX D,D, 3.)
EX D,D, 4 adds nothing extra.

You can call it whatever you want to call it. But the community and video game testers would call this a bug. I'm done arguing at this point, because anything further in this area is just arguing about the definition of a bug and who cares about that.
This whole argument has been about the definition of a bug, lol.

The health is guaranteed, whereas you are not guaranteed anything for activating the damage buff if you don't land a hit within 5 seconds. That's the difference.
 

Hidan

''Re file min ton vareseis'' "Ekkkssso re mlkaaa''
This whole argument has been about the definition of a bug, lol.

The health is guaranteed, whereas you are not guaranteed anything for activating the damage buff if you don't land a hit within 5 seconds. That's the difference.
Torn, the point is, it needs fixing. Why arguing when something is so bad?

Also
False equivalency. 1 frame does not equal 8 frames. 38 frames is much faster than 46. He gets the benefit of activating a buff after a njk connects.
regular rise is free too after njk on hit. And generally 46 frames are ok for a buff. Unstoppable NEEDS bars for other things like armor and res.
 
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Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
Torn, the point is, it needs fixing. Why arguing when something is so bad?

Also

regular rise is free too after njk on hit. And generally 46 frames are ok for a buff. Unstoppable NEEDS bars for other things like armor and res.
Sorry, I was basing it off the first post in this thread: http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/unstoppable-tech-and-strategy-discussion.51699/

All I said was that I disagree with points #2 and points #3 being bugs, and I still do. Just because a move doesn't do what you think it should do, doesn't make it a bug. Ultimately, I could care less whether it's a bug or not, but to proclaim things like this a bug and tag the game's designer and QA tester is a bit presumptuous. You could bring it to their attention and say, "Hey, these healing values on resurrection look a little off, and these ex moves seem under-powered". Or we could discuss it first, before making claims and requests to the designer.
 

Hidan

''Re file min ton vareseis'' "Ekkkssso re mlkaaa''
Sorry, I was basing it off the first post in this thread: http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/unstoppable-tech-and-strategy-discussion.51699/

All I said was that I disagree with points #2 and points #3 being bugs, and I still do. Just because a move doesn't do what you think it should do, doesn't make it a bug. Ultimately, I could care less whether it's a bug or not, but to proclaim things like this a bug and tag the game's designer and QA tester is a bit presumptuous. You could bring it to their attention and say, "Hey, these healing values on resurrection look a little off, and these ex moves seem under-powered". Or we could discuss it first, before making claims and requests to the designer.
Well, if you put it that way, tagging is a bit excessive yes. Yet again, none had an arguement with what Jeremiah was saying about these things for some time now, so there was no discussion till this point.

I get what you mean. I believe he does to, but he maybe is tired from the Jason struggle
 
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