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Question Mortal Kombat Stage Picking Ruleset

Big Pampering

Big Pampering

Master
EGP_Shoryuken said:
If we're talking about how stages favor a character, then why is it ok to ignore how player 1 has an advantage going into the match?

I don't think luck should have anything to do with who ends up with the most unfair advantage. As soon as you sit down in your seat the choices you have should be clear, and you shouldn't sit there praying that you get lucky. Just because a game has broken stuff to it doesn't mean the community can't take matters into their own hands and try to even things out. Like I said, it shouldn't be left to chance and you shouldn't have to wait to lose a match to have the choice of evening things out. Player 1 advantage is a fact, stage advantage is a fact, you can't ignore neither of those facts. players should have their choice of what they prefer and not both.
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but the player 1 advantage can be easily dealt with by switching sides, which does look stupid but the stage advantage like rooftop day is advantage on a whole other level compared to p1 advantage.
 
GGA HAN

GGA HAN

Galloping Ghost Arcade
A medium stage that doesn't lag should be used for all tournament matches. SF4 and other games have adopted rules like this, why can't we? Courtyard day/Shang Tsungs Gardens lag the least, IMHO.
 
EGP_Shoryuken

EGP_Shoryuken

Mortal
PerfectMindGame said:
but the player 1 advantage can be easily dealt with by switching sides (after you lose) , which does look stupid but the stage advantage like rooftop day is advantage on a whole other level compared to p1 advantage.
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When I'm fighting cage it doesn't seem like p 1 advantage doesn't matter, when I'm fighting kabal it doesn't seem like p 1 advantage doesn't matter. When those characters get in on me I forget what stage I was playing on and wish for 1st player advantage. I just think that 1st player getting the choice of random select might end up getting everything in his favor.
 
EGP Wonder_Chef

EGP Wonder_Chef

Official Quan Chi Nerf Demander™
Dizzy

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Elder God
NetherRealm Studios
EGP_Shoryuken

Player 1 advantage and Stage are not comparable though, they are completely different thing and they shouldn't be used as ways to try and balance out two things that are completely unrelated. I have no idea how "one person gets stage select, other gets player 1" even started but it doesn't make sense to me. It is comparing apples and oranges.

Furthermore, this system falls apart once two players both wish to have the same thing. (Either player 1 or stage selection) This would be have to be solved by either coin toss or rock, paper, scissors, same way as before, letting it fall to "luck" as you said. Either way you look at it, the decision will be left to luck regardless.

Bottom line, I think that in many matches being given the option of selecting stage is much too beneficial. There is a reason that games like Tekken and Soul Calibur do not allow stage selection under any circumstances and only random is allowed.
 
FrothyOmen

FrothyOmen

P!
Ok, but that isn't how columbus was run at all. I can't speak for the other MLG events though. Plus all majors I've been to followed that rule. :/
 
NRF CharlieMurphy

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
GGA Dizzy said:
EGP_Shoryuken

*snipped the awesome part cuz i agreed*

Bottom line, I think that in many matches being given the option of selecting stage is much too beneficial. There is a reason that games like Tekken and Soul Calibur do not allow stage selection under any circumstances and only random is allowed.
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Those games' stages don't eat inputs and all actually effect a match greatly. MK stages aren't nearly in the same category as these games.

You just complained he was comparing apples and oranges.... don't go down that road as well.
 
Big Pampering

Big Pampering

Master
EGP_Shoryuken said:
When I'm fighting cage it doesn't seem like p 1 advantage doesn't matter, when I'm fighting kabal it doesn't seem like p 1 advantage doesn't matter. When those characters get in on me I forget what stage I was playing on and wish for 1st player advantage. I just think that 1st player getting the choice of random select might end up getting everything in his favor.
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I cant think of any other way to make it more fair, its just in the game. stage select is a different issue and can be dealt with in other ways.
 
EGP_Shoryuken

EGP_Shoryuken

Mortal
GGA Dizzy said:
EGP_Shoryuken
It is comparing apples and oranges.
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I don't get why its apples and oranges. P1 favors the rush down character and big stages favor the zoner. Why should either of the 2 have both elements in their favor? This game isin't balanced to where you can just ignore one or the other, like other fighting games are.


GGA Dizzy said:
EGP_Shoryuken
Furthermore, this system falls apart once two players both wish to have the same thing. (Either player 1 or stage selection) This would be have to be solved by either coin toss or rock, paper, scissors, same way as before, letting it fall to "luck" as you said. Either way you look at it, the decision will be left to luck regardless.
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Yeah your right it will be left to luck "if that happens", but lets be real here. How many times have you seen anyone argue over who's going to end up on player 2 side in a tournament? I've seen coin tosses, players rushing to p1 side or just casually sitting down. All players want to have the advantage in close situations and you think its ok for them to possibly end up with everything in their favor? Thats the part I don't get. If p1 and p2 have their choices already laid out, then theres no way someone is going to end up with all the advantage.
 
Dizzy

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Elder God
NetherRealm Studios
STB CharlieMurphy said:
Those games' stages don't eat inputs and all actually effect a match greatly. MK stages aren't nearly in the same category as these games.

You just complained he was comparing apples and oranges.... don't go down that road as well.
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Well, obviously banned stages would still be disallowed. Believe me, I'm not saying to suddenly allow kratos stage.

Having a medium sized stage (Shangs throne room) would work fine for when the stage select screen showed that it landed on a banned one as random. That or just random again, yet the former would save time. It still coincides with my main point.
 
K7L33THA

K7L33THA

Grapple > Footsies
Courtyard day should be tournament default stage. Sure it might get boring to look at over and over, but its a neutral non lagging stage so no one can bitch. Don't other FG's do this? I always see that holodeck looking stage for Marvel etc.
 
GuamoKun

GuamoKun

I Break Hearts, Not Combos
Soul Chamber has least lag because the background is literally nothing besides that soul head thing.

It's one of the larger stages though.
 
MK Peanuts

MK Peanuts

afk
Perfect Legend said:
http://perfectlegend.wordpress.com/2013/01/23/mortal-kombat-stage-picking-ruleset/

I feel like this is a big issue in our competitive community and I think it needs a second look or at least should have a discussion.

Ok really this needs to be changed. Please read my article!
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I'm having trouble seeing how you reached your conclusion from your analysis. You start off saying some stages in Mortal Kombat can offer one character an advantage over another, which I agree with. Then you conclude saying that stages should always be selected randomly. In effect basically saying that stage advantage should be given out at random. There's enough randomness in the game already what with the player 1 advantage and all the various bugs and glitches; I don't agree with changing the ruleset to introduce another level of randomness.

You also mention that what you're proposing is the way it already works in other games, like Dead or Alive. You didn't really say why those games decided to do it that way, though. If anything I think DOA should use MK's system for selecting stages. As it is right now I could lose to a Helena and then for the next game get a stage like Home or something. I don't see why stage advantage should go to the Helena player when Helena won the last game, just because that's the way the dice happened to fall.
 
WayoftheFist

WayoftheFist

Cold day in hell...
I believe CDjr said once that if P2 was allowed to pick stage he would go to P2 every single time. Either Pl's idea of letting random select handle it or what Dizzy said about letting the loser select either a new stage or a new character. It's not a huge deal to me because I'm free anyway but I could see it really affecting top level play.
 
MK Peanuts

MK Peanuts

afk
K7L33THA said:
Courtyard day should be tournament default stage. Sure it might get boring to look at over and over, but its a neutral non lagging stage so no one can bitch. Don't other FG's do this? I always see that holodeck looking stage for Marvel etc.
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There's no stage advantage in Marvel. People pick the Training Room frequently because it's one of four stages in the game that's well lit and doesn't have a ton of distracting shit happening in the background (the others being Bonne Wonderland, Danger Room, and Shield Helicarrier (Day)).
 
Mikemetroid

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
Lead Moderator
I only normally pick average size stages.

Courtyard, Dead Pool, Armory, and the Subway.
 
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