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Mortal Kombat & Injustice Net Play Rant

Tony at Home

Tony at Home

Noob
It's not just netcode, but it's the way the game is designed that allows/disallows it to deal with lag.

So Street Fighter for example, it has better netcode than Injustice- yet at the same time, there's much less tolerance for lag. 2 frames of lag will cause most combos to drop unless the player compensates for it. In Injustice, lag tolerance is much higher because of input buffer.

One thing that would help is to add buffer to the recovery of moves on attack. Similarly to how the game assists with reversals by allowing you to input a command while you are in the latter stages of block-stun and have it come out after: to ensure you can punish a -7 move with a 6 framer every single time, they should also have this at the recovery of attack moves. So if you have a move that is +1 on hit, you can dam sure make sure your next move comes out on the first available frame and take advantage of that advantage on hit.

I think Injustice had this to an extent (hard to tell) but it wasn't much. Once in a blue moon I'll still miss my B3 after a MB Grav Pull because of a severe lag spike, and I'm not allowed to buffer in my B3 until about the last possible moment.

An option to add recovery-buffer in addition to good netcode would make lag feel almost completely non-existent. You might as well be controlling your character completely by thought.
 
TheSpore

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
I may not always agree with you and I know I have had issues with you, but what is said is the honest truth. I totally agree with you and I never even play IGAU or MK9 online ever just due to input delay.
 
Backfire

Backfire

Noob
Injustice was pretty good online, the only problem i had was that i had to use different combos with Harley as b3 after cartwheel was hard to connect if there was a little bit of lag. But i generally enjoyed online and never got too annoyed with the lag.
 
Dizzy

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
LtLuthor said:
It's not just netcode, but it's the way the game is designed that allows/disallows it to deal with lag.

So Street Fighter for example, it has better netcode than Injustice- yet at the same time, there's much less tolerance for lag. 2 frames of lag will cause most combos to drop unless the player compensates for it. In Injustice, lag tolerance is much higher because of input buffer.

One thing that would help is to add buffer to the recovery of moves on attack. Similarly to how the game assists with reversals by allowing you to input a command while you are in the latter stages of block-stun and have it come out after: to ensure you can punish a -7 move with a 6 framer every single time, they should also have this at the recovery of attack moves. So if you have a move that is +1 on hit, you can dam sure make sure your next move comes out on the first available frame and take advantage of that advantage on hit.

I think Injustice had this to an extent (hard to tell) but it wasn't much. Once in a blue moon I'll still miss my B3 after a MB Grav Pull because of a severe lag spike, and I'm not allowed to buffer in my B3 until about the last possible moment.

An option to add recovery-buffer in addition to good netcode would make lag feel almost completely non-existent. You might as well be controlling your character completely by thought.
Click to expand...
Injustice has a buffer for special moves. No buffer for normals, like B3, though.

Also, online will never match up to offline, you can hope to close the gap a bit though. NRS netcode has a lot of room to improve still in that regard.
 
EndofGameBoss

EndofGameBoss

That's about right.
Having a solid net code is beneficial for everyone involved. It helps the seasoned veteran player learn match ups and get practice in before a tournament and it would also make it easier for a online warrior to adjust to the feel of offline play. Going to a tournament for the first time after playing a game like MK9 online can be devastating if you thought you were good because of online play. The only fighting game I play that I think has a solid net code is SF. If you find someone with green bars the match feels good otherwise, it's pointless. It's sad a game that is 4-5 years older than Injustice has better online play. Also, this is like the 10 thousandth person to praise KI's net code.
 
Cossner

Cossner

King of the Jobbers 2015
Administrator
If you guys think "landing combos" is the issue with online you're lost.

The issue, as PL mentions, is the fact that movement gets reduced, you cannot counter anything from jump ins to cross ups, you can't block mix ups properly, and you can't keep a momentum going.

Online, Green Lantern's B13 becomes the safest string in the world, Black Adam's divekick becomes unpunishable, Doomsday's saltshaker becomes unblockable, Deathstroke's sword flip is a safe wake up, all of Flash's specials are safe, Ares can suddenly telexxd1 like online Raidens used to do, MMH oh tele becomes unpunishable, and Batgirl's cartwheel becomes an infinite, just to name a few.

How can you even get decent practice in that environment? As Tom Brady once said at Dallas, there is no knowledge online.
 
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Euphoric

Euphoric

MKX
Cossner said:
If you guys think "landing combos" is the issue with online you're lost.

The issue, as PL mentiones, is the fact that movement gets reduced, you cannot counter anything, from jump ins or cross ups, you can't block mix ups properly, and you can't keep a momentum going.

Online, Green Lantern's B13 becomes the safest string in the world, Black Adam's divekick becomes unpunishable, Doomsday's saltshaker becomes unblockable, Deathstroke's sword flip is a safe wake up, all of Flash's specials are safe, Ares can suddenly telexxd1 like online Raidens used to do, MMH oh tele becomes unpunishable, and Batgirl's cartwheel becomes an infinite, just to name a few.

How can you even get decent practice in that environment? As Tom Brady once said at Dallas, there is no knowledge online.
Click to expand...
80% of the people that play IGAU believe combos are everything.

:eek:
 
Eric The Scruffy

Eric The Scruffy

Noob
I remember back when I used to think the online netcode in this game was pretty decent. In retrospect I'm not sure how much of that was the game being undeveloped and how much it was me just being a plain old online scrub. I agree completely though....the game has evolved to a point where I think you could easily make the case that online versus offline is as significant a difference as Vanilla and 1.06.

Hell, most characters are basically psuedo versions of their offline counterparts at this point, like Cossner already mentioned. To add onto what he's already said, Batman's J2 is effectively impossible to antiair even with Aquaman. Aquaman's B2 is a super fast barely reactable overhead combo starter. Scorpion might not actually be the worst character in the game. Edit: also, Superman's zoning pressure is straightup overwhelming.

I'd give anything for an offline scene so I could learn to actually play the real IGAU rather than the poor imitation I'm stuck with.
 
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E

Eldriken

Guest
Karried said:
80% of the people that play IGAU believe combos are everything.

:eek:
Click to expand...
THIS. OH MY GOD.

So many people online are all, "Y U NO COMBO SCRUB? U SPAM SEAM MVOE AL TIME GIT GUD SCRBU." Then, when you tell them that the game isn't only about combos and there's more depth to it than that, they just write you off as if you're ignorant to the game entirely...all while you're beating them senseless.

@Cossner "Doomsday's saltshaker" HAHAHAHAHA. That's what I'm gonna start calling it from now on. Thanks!

"d1~Salt Shake" "raw Salt Shake"
 
Crathen

Crathen

Death is my business
A good netcode is a must in 2015 , better if GGPO based , the delay netcode might look better but it's infuriating to play when it lags.

That said , online will never be as good as offline for the time being , even the better netcodes like TTT2 and KI do not reflect the game as it's played offline in the best possible conditions.
 
IrishMantis

IrishMantis

Most humble shit talker ever!!!
Well the step from MK9 to Injustice was a huge step imo
still not there there yet

its a new Gen so i give them my trust

but PS4 Online better not be region locked, there is no excuses NRS that will be piss me off

i wanna play some of the US Guys here so dont be foolish NRS
 
Rodrigue

Rodrigue

Spongerod
Eldriken said:
THIS. OH MY GOD.

So many people online are all, "Y U NO COMBO SCRUB? U SPAM SEAM MVOE AL TIME GIT GUD SCRBU." Then, when you tell them that the game isn't only about combos and there's more depth to it than that, they just write you off as if you're ignorant to the game entirely...all while you're beating them senseless.

@Cossner "Doomsday's saltshaker" HAHAHAHAHA. That's what I'm gonna start calling it from now on. Thanks!

"d1~Salt Shake" "raw Salt Shake"
Click to expand...
Doomsday can actually do some pretty decent combos with a background bounce! I'm labbing with him right now. Damn! Guess I'm gonna give him a shot!
 
Tony at Home

Tony at Home

Noob
The answer is GGPO.

KI net play, when both players have a good connection, is frighteningly good. I get manuals that have a 2 or even 1 frame margin-of-error at about 80% of the rate I get those manuals offline.
 
MrSoloLobo

MrSoloLobo

I have a keen eye for all things broken.
Cossner said:
Online, Green Lantern's B13 becomes the safest string in the world, Black Adam's divekick becomes unpunishable, Doomsday's saltshaker becomes unblockable, Deathstroke's sword flip is a safe wake up, all of Flash's specials are safe, Ares can suddenly telexxd1 like online Raidens used to do, MMH oh tele becomes unpunishable, and Batgirl's cartwheel becomes an infinite, just to name a few.
Click to expand...
BA foot dive is so dumb online lol. And don't even get me started on Doomsday online. Dude is a beast!
 
EdFig81

EdFig81

Original OBS mbr/VSM/G4S
1 can only hope online net code for mkx is as good as ki3 (when it works & doesn't glitch or desync) . Maybe xbone , ps4 & pc mkx online will be great. I fear the ps3 and 360 versions being nrs isn't making them and just look at the past online net code for those games. I have faith in nrs though I believe and hope :)
 
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