Kombo Help or Advice PRZ!

[Justice]

I'm trying to step up my game a little and pulled out the strategy guide for some new combos to try out. I came across one that caught my eye because I started to figure it out on my own.

The combo starts with Back 2, 1, Toward 2. This is the launcher. I think the guide calls it "Mess Hall". Anyway, I was trying out different things to see how much damage I could get and other effects, when I thought "Hey! A Kartwheel would go awesome right now!" So I tried and tried and tried, but I couldn't connect with the Kartwheel. So that's when I looked in the guide and low and behold, there's a combo in there that starts "Mess Hall" > "Kartwheel" and I'm just peaking at this point.

So my question is, how do I konnect with the Kartwheel after the launcher? Any advice or timing tips that anyone could give me?

 

[Poto2222]

Well, I'm looking at the Sonya guide now, but I can't see any of those containing ~Kartwheel. I can see that there are some combos using the first two strings of this combo cancelling it to a Kartwheel l~kartwheel), but none of them launching your enemy and then doing the Kartwheel.
Also, I don't think it would work, since Sonya would do the move under your enemy while he is still in the air, resulting in a completely whiffed move. But I have never tested it.

Could you be more specific?


PS: Best thing you can do after succesfully lauching your opponent with is a Neutral Jump Punch, followed by a Quick Forward Dash and then the Kiss. At this point, it's very likely you'll get a good followup resulting in a 45%+ meterless combo.

 

[MortySeinfeld]

You can probably link the cartwheel as they're on their way down after the b21f2, but I think there are more effective ways to maximize damage.

At the very least after the b21f2, if you do a stand 1 to stagger them in the air the cartwheel should be easier to link afterwards.

As poto has mentioned however, if you actually get the b21f2 you are probably best off using this combo:

b21f2, NJP, step forward kiss, dive kick, 21 xx cartwheel, b21 ms f1 xx leg grab (48% or 51% if you use JIP before the b21f2).

The fact of the matter is (at least in my experience), the b21f2 string is actually very difficult to land as a combo starter. so you are better off using the 114 string after a jump in punch (since they are forced to stand), or the dive kick 21 string (better punish, higher damage).

 

[Justice]

Thanks so much for the advice guys! It gives me much to ponder

I didn't mean the guide here, Poto. I meant the Prima strategy guide. But after I started connecting with the Kartwheel occasionally, I looked back to see what the next move was so I could practice that but I couldn't find the kombo either. I'm not sure what I saw the first time, but it wasn't there the second. *cue Twilight Zone music*

I would categorize myself as a high-level beginner or a low-level intermediate player. I still can't even get "Mess Hall" > "Uppercut" off 100%. Hell, I was ecstatic that I could even get off a 4-hit combo, much less one that does 24% damage! I was just happy that I was able to come up with something all my own and kinda choking it to death given my level of skill.

On that note, as I mentioned, I was able to connect with the Kartwheel occasionally on the downside which caused a 2-hit ground slam. The problem is, the bounce isn't very high. I was able to connect with either a standing or a crouching 1 to continue the juggle, but I wasn't able to repeat it so I'm not sure which it was.

I'm looking at this as more of a psychological kombo as opposed to a high-damage kombo. It's very timing restrictive but bizarre enough to make your opponent not sure when or if he should Breaker it.

 

[Poto2222]

Hmm, I see. Well, it's a nice concept of a combo, actually! That "psychological" thing of your combo might work afterall. Let me know if you have any luck doing it online! :horse:

 

[Justice]

Thanks so much Poto! My guess is, unless the match up is close, it won't work online since the Kartwheel is really hard (for me anyway) to hit. Besides, I still gotta get it to work in Practice mode ant2:

 

[Slego]

114MS should be your default poke, the reason for this is that on hit it pops up the enemy just long enough for you to pull a b2 launcher all in one combo. On block it chips and sets you up in a perfect position for dash punches/tackle, since you're instantly in MS after the chip.

I typically try and use:
114db2b2->b21f2->114db22 (28% 31%/w jp) Knocks forward
114db2b2->b21f2->1bf4 (28% 31%/w jp) Throws back
(EX) 114db2b2->b21f2->1(ex)bf4 (30% 33%/w jp) Throws back
Sacrifices a small amount of bnb damage for a guaranteed mixup on block, well worth it.

A nice dive kick starter:
J->d421df3->dash in->b21f2->114db22 (35% 38%/w jp) Knocks forward
J->d421df3->dash in->b21f2->1bf4 (35% 38%/w jp) Throws back
(EX) j->d421df3->dash in->b21f2->1(ex)bf4 (37% 40%/w jp) Throws back

EX cartwheels your best bet as a wake up, then go into b21f2...etc etc

Oh, and try and chain MS into all your low pokes for added pressure (d4db2f1df3, d1db2b2, etc)

The name of the game with sonya is to constantly keep them guessing which angle your gonna hit him with next. Pressure pressure pressure, try and 112 reset at the end of your combos in the corner.

Learn to love MS, its what makes sonya one of the best mixup artists in the game.

 

[Justice]

Thanks so much for all the info Slego! Thanks to you guys, I have many new kombos to practice

I just wanna keep working on mine because it's mine and I've never been able to come up with one on my very own.

 

[Justice]

I was wondering if anyone had any tips on how to get the 114 MS off? I'm having a hard time getting MS off fast enough to do the follow-up :'(

 

[Poto2222]

I was wondering if anyone had any tips on how to get the 114 MS off? I'm having a hard time getting MS off fast enough to do the follow-up :'(

Well... I don't have much to say, this kind of thing is hard to explain.
All I can say is that you have to cancel your last kick bk) into the Military Stance, and then follow up with the launcher l). This way Sonya will be on her MS instantly after sending your enemy flying away, so I don't understand exactly how you can't get MS fast enough. =/

 

[Justice]

The button inputs. I'm not used to playing at this level and am unpracticed at things like cancels and such. Like, my bnb kombo right now is Mess Hall > Uppercut 24%. And I can't even pull that off 100% of the time because I press toward to early and end up with just b2f1. I've also learned some bad habits over the years. The worst is I doubletap buttons for simple moves. Like to do a sweep, I'll hit 4 2x "just to make sure it goes off".

Just to give you an idea of what you're getting yourself into when you help me. I know I'm a scrub, but I really love this game and don't want to stay a scrub forever.

 

[D_Matt_Ma]

The difficulty is due to the button combination more so than difficulty. You just need to practice. I'm having the same problems too for Sonya, but there is no shortcut.

 

[Poto2222]

The button inputs. I'm not used to playing at this level and am unpracticed at things like cancels and such. Like, my bnb kombo right now is Mess Hall > Uppercut 24%. And I can't even pull that off 100% of the time because I press toward to early and end up with just b2f1. I've also learned some bad habits over the years. The worst is I doubletap buttons for simple moves. Like to do a sweep, I'll hit 4 2x "just to make sure it goes off".

Just to give you an idea of what you're getting yourself into when you help me. I know I'm a scrub, but I really love this game and don't want to stay a scrub forever.

Oh, I see. Well, it wasn't that easy to me to when I did it for the first time, it took me some practice to land it successfuly. Even now I mess up the inputs and Sonya end up doing that stupid Shoulder Charge! LOL

But unfortunately there isn't anything we can do to help you out in this case. All you can do is practice, practice, practice. Yeah, sounds boring as hell, but after some time you'll see the results!
Oh, and make sure you post here when you're able to do it more frequently! :weightlifter:

 

[Justice]

Well, I've been practicing and I can get the 114 MSb2 off pretty consistently So far I just end it there with an uppercut. It's like learning a new piece of music: one bar at a time. I'm so excited! I've never gotten this far in a game before

Any tips on how to time the next section, the b21f2? I've always been horrible at timing juggles :'(

On a side note, this is the first fighting game where I've noticed that you can't just hold a direction and keep using those moves. Like for MSb2 you have to release back and press it again for the uppercut.

 

[BenGmanUk]

Any tips on how to time the next section, the b21f2? I've always been horrible at timing juggles :'(

Just break it down mate. Do the MS, b2 on its own, then the b2 on its own. Experiment with the timing until you're happy with it and then add the rest.

I've just picked up Sonya and am having to do the same. One step at a time. For the record you haven't picked an easy character at all imo. Stick with it though if you enjoy her.

 

[Justice]

Just break it down mate. Do the MS, b2 on its own, then the b2 on its own. Experiment with the timing until you're happy with it and then add the rest.

I've just picked up Sonya and am having to do the same. One step at a time. For the record you haven't picked an easy character at all imo. Stick with it though if you enjoy her.

That's what I'm doing. After some more practice, I can now get up to the end of b21f2 about 50-60% of the time but after the f2 Freddy doesn't bounce as high. It seems like he gets to about even with my head then get sucked to the ground extremely fast. By the time I can get the next 1 out, he's already back on the ground.

Yeah, I have a habit of picking the harder characters to learn cuz "they looked so badass in the trailers". Like I main Ivy in Soul Caliber. She has to be the hardest character I've ever tried to play. But I usually only go so far in games. Like I'll buy a game, play the heck out of it for a month or two, then leave it on the shelf while I rinse and repeat with another game.

 

[Slego]

That's what I'm doing. After some more practice, I can now get up to the end of b21f2 about 50-60% of the time but after the f2 Freddy doesn't bounce as high. It seems like he gets to about even with my head then get sucked to the ground extremely fast. By the time I can get the next 1 out, he's already back on the ground.

Yeah, I have a habit of picking the harder characters to learn cuz "they looked so badass in the trailers". Like I main Ivy in Soul Caliber. She has to be the hardest character I've ever tried to play. But I usually only go so far in games. Like I'll buy a game, play the heck out of it for a month or two, then leave it on the shelf while I rinse and repeat with another game.

just remember that 1 and d1 are pretty much the only options you have after the second b21f2 popup. You can either do a 1bf4, a 114ms2, or a 112 reset. the reset is desireable, but you have to make sure you get close in before the b21f2 or else the reset will whiff, and the rest is a bit harder to time right. just make sure you do NOT slur your inputs together for b21f2, negative edge will whiff it into a ring in a heartbeat.

 

[Justice]

Yeah, I have this really annoying habit of pressing f1 instead of 1 in the middle of Mess Hall. It's really disturbing to see the left cross then the rings come out. Not as disturbing as doing that damned shoulder block in MS though...

 

[Justice]

A quick update: I have almost completed the first kombo that Slego gave me a couple of times I get to the second 114 and can't seem to get the knee off. Still practicing tho!

BTW, I wanted to make sure that I understood. In the third kombo of each set of Slego's post, he puts an (EX) at the beginning. What does this mean?

 

[Poto2222]

A quick update: I have almost completed the first kombo that Slego gave me a couple of times I get to the second 114 and can't seem to get the knee off. Still practicing tho!

BTW, I wanted to make sure that I understood. In the third kombo of each set of Slego's post, he puts an (EX) at the beginning. What does this mean?

It means that you have to do the :ennchanced version of the Special Move!

 

[Justice]

It means that you have to do the :ennchanced version of the Special Move!

There is an EX1 or an EXj or am I missing something?

 

[Slego]

There is an EX1 or an EXj or am I missing something?

Bf4 is leg grab, enhanced leg grab tacks a few more percent damage and looks kewl.

 

[Justice]

Oh! My apologies. I was asking about the big one at the very beginning of the line. After looking at it again, I think you put that there to let the reader know that an EX move is used in the string. I was trying to figure out how to enhance a standing 1 or a jump

 

[aj1701]

On a side note, this is the first fighting game where I've noticed that you can't just hold a direction and keep using those moves. Like for MSb2 you have to release back and press it again for the uppercut.

At least its not just me. I've started going to the lab with Sonya next (even though I still have a lot to learn about Kitty), and this is by far the toughest thing for me. I can get it so if i just do MS, B2 I can do it consistently, but as soon as I add the 114 before it, it throws me off and that damn shoulder charge comes out. Really wish you could just hold back instead of letting it go and hitting again.

 

[Spez_80]

If you get irratated with the performing the launcher after a kartwheel F2, 2 is much easier but roughly 3% less dmg. You can still juggle with 1,1,1 into, 112 MS reset. I end all combos with 112 military stance cause it leaves opponent standing with no wakeup attack and advantage.