Strategy Knowing Your Arsenal - A Deathstroke Move Analysis and Discussion

[Mikman360]

Introduction

Hello and welcome to my Deathstroke move analysis thread. Here, I hope to provide useful information of all of Deathstroke’s moves and combo strings to help improve the gameplay of any dedicated Deathstroke user. I will provide useful information about moves including statistics, uses, combos, and other little notes.

This thread isn’t just about me though. I want this to be a board discussion thread and a compilation of our knowledge and opinions. I am not claiming to be an all-knowing Deathstroke god in the slightest, so for the better of Deathstroke players, I’m counting on YOU fellow Deathstroke users to provide useful input. Got something to say about a move? Go ahead and say it! I don’t care if you disagree with me or not, in fact, you may enlighten me on how useful/not useful a move may be. I’ll quote your post and put it in the main post.

Here’s how the thread is going to work. I’ll start with one move and gradually add moves over a course of a few days. During this time, I’d like to see some prime discussion of the move if possible. So for the first set of days, I’ll be on the topic of the 3231. We can talk about 3231 and then move on to the next move once I put it up. And note that this movement does NOT limit discussion to the current move. If we’re on Sword Flip and you have a comment about Sword Spin, feel free to speak up!

I’m making this thread in hopes of a more in-depth look at Deathstroke’s moves and to promote discussion of his moves. Finally, this is NOT the combo thread. I list a few good combos for BnB’s, but for the most part, I will be listing the practical stuff that usually only costs 1 meter. If you’re looking for 4 meter swag combos of doom, visit the combo thread stickied in the Deathstroke forum.

So that’s enough rambling. Let’s get to what you came here for, right?

Current Move Discussion: B23F2

Change Log

5/3/13: 3231. Created thread.
5/5/13: Sword Flip. Updated BnB combo for 323, added a problem with using this move in the corner, and quoted Trini_Bwoi for useful input on 323. Also quoted TONY-T for input on Sword Flip combos. Added this change log. Small updates to the Terms and Notations.
5/9/13: F3. Added "Bounce Cancel" to terms and notations.
5/16/13: 132. Renamed "Relatively Unsafe" to "Somewhat Safe." Removed some pointless information on attack strings not completing without hitting the opponent. Added a Credits section.
5/29/13: J1. Added a fun fact for 132 as a projectile. Added a little on F3 as a crossup tool.
6/4/13: Sword Spin. Updated the wakeup properties of Sword Flip. Added "Unscaled Hard Knockdown" to terms and notations.
6/17/13: B1U2. Added the Wiki moveset link under the Move Listing section.
6/21/13: Machine Gun.
7/17/13: D2. Updated a note on projectile trades for Machine Gun. Added "Auto-Correct" to Terms and Notations.
8/21/13: B23F2. Cleaned up the description of 3231. Added a note about the pushback of B1U2 on block.

Terms and Notations

For all intents and purposes, I will be using notations for normal controls with no changes to the button layout. Also, all notations are based on Deathstroke being on the left side of the screen, facing right.

1 – Light Attack
2 – Medium Attack
3 – Hard Attack
F – Forward
B – Back
U – Up
D – Down
Ji –Jump in
MB – Meter Burn
xx – Special Cancel
+ – Press 2 commands at the same time (Example: 1+2)
Anti-Air (AA) – A move that can counter an aerial approach made by the opponent, or the process of doing so.
Auto-Correct – A moves latent ability to switch sides to target the opponent better.
Bounce Cancel – Use or MB to cancel a normal move into a bounce move
Chip – Damage dealt to blocking opponents
Crossup – A move that can be ambiguous as to which side it hits an opponent
"Hard Knockdown" (HKD) – A knockdown that cannot be rolled out of
"Unscaled Hard Knockdown" – Some HKDs leave the opponent down for less time depending on how long a combo before them was. Unscaled hard knockdowns keep the opponent downed for a set amount of time no matter what.
"Special Cancellable" – If a move is special cancellable can be cancelled into a special move, stage interactions, bounce cancel moves, your trait, and your super move.
Wakeup – After being knocked down, performing certain special moves as you get up with proper timing gives you invincibility frames.

(If there are any terms that confused you or you think I should add, please let me know)

Safety on Block Classifications

Completely Safe (-1 to positive frames) – Cannot be punished by Superman’s super, which is as far as I know, the fastest move in the game.

Safe (-2 to -6 frames) – Generally speaking, these moves are safe against most moves in the game. The only thing that I have found that could punish these moves is Superman’s super. Moves classified as safe cannot be punished by The Flash’s Flying Uppercut move, a 6 frame special move, the fastest possible reversal attack. Some characters have 6 frame D1s that lead into combos as well, such as Ares who can D1, Trait combo you.

Somewhat Safe (-7 frames to “Unsafe”) – These moves are only punishable on block by very fast moves and combo starters. While opponents might not be able to use a slow, more powerful starter, it’s still possible to take damage on block starting from here. For the most part though, you shouldn't have to worry about these moves getting blocked.

Unsafe (“Relatively Unsafe” to “Extremely Unsafe”) – This is where the enemy is able to punish you with full combos with a wider variety of moves that don’t even have to be considered fast.

Extremely Unsafe – The enemy has to be sleeping to not punish you for these moves if you use them incorrectly.

Move Listing

Here is the Injustice: Gods Among Us Wiki link containing all of Deathstroke's moves, inputs, and frames.

L = 1
M = 2
H = 3

http://testyourmight.com/wiki/index.php/Deathstroke

NOTE: Some of the frame data listed here has been found to be incorrect, while some other listing may be outdated. If you have any questions about frames, feel free to ask.

Single Normals

F3

Spoiler

Damage: Very High
Startup: Slow
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Overhead
Range: Extremely Good
Chip Damage: 1.38%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: No
Other Notes: This move is a universal bounce move, meaning you can charge it (no extra damage), MB it for 1 hit of armor, bounce cancel into it, stagger your opponent on block, and dash out of charging it. It also leaves Deathstroke airborne for the middle part of it.

Analysis: This is one of Deathstroke's best moves, and one of the best F3 moves in the entire game. There's just so much good about it. Out of all of Deathstroke's non-gun moves (and Sword Flip), it's got the biggest range. Its hitbox is HUGE. It also produces a strong combo on hit, is massively positive on block, hits overhead, and can armor through attacks for the cost of 1 meter.

This move can hit people jumping in the air too, but it's easily possible to get hit out of it. However, since Deathstroke is airborne during the flip, you're less vulnerable to damage. The pushback on this move is huge on block. F3 into F23 is a nice frame trap. Another cool thing is that Deathstroke bends down very low while charging this move, so you can sneak under some high hitting moves.

Combined with his low combo starter B1U2, you can establish a very powerful mixup game. Since he hops forwards, this move can even be used as a crossup, and this can be VERY ambiguous. Observe Trini_Bwoi's video in the "Other Players' Input" section. This stuff is REALLY good.

Here's my CoD Vortex video showcasing the brutality of F3 crossups.

One thing you've gotta watch out for though is the movement Deathstroke takes during this move. Sometimes it makes him move forward when you don't want to. For example, don't use this move to armor through Doomsday's MB Supernova. You'll flip forwards and miss. In cases like this, it's better to use B3.

Other Players’ Input:

Crossup shenanigans with F3

Just some notes...
Midscreen, you don't have enough time to dash forward after all hard knockdowns
It's way easier to do in the corner
The AI does wakeup attacks in the original direction

And IDK how useful it'll be lol so mess around with it the next time you're in the lab with DS.

You can even delay the F3 for a fake-out crossup.

Recommended Combos:

F3, Ji2, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 33%
F3, Ji2, 323, F23 xx MB Quick Fire = 37% (1 meter)

D2

Spoiler

Damage: Average
Startup: Avereage
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Range: Very Good
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: Yes
Other Notes: This move is a universal launch move. It auto-corrects opponents jumping over Deathstroke, and scales combos incredibly hard. It also keeps Deathstroke in a ducking stance.

Analysis: Incredibly potent AA as it is fast and safe. The damage it yields from a combo is very low due to D2 moves causing massive scaling.

This move does its job very well. It stops jump in assaults with ease, and has a hitbox above Deathstroke, and even hits behind him when it auto-corrects. It's not as amazing as Grundy and Aquaman's D2s, but it's still a good move in its own.

It's also used for certain combos, such as those utilizing a wall bounce.

This is also the only move that 100% safely cancels into Deathstroke's trait.

Before the universal buff to D2 moves, Sword Flip was the go-to AA. While D2 has become more viable, do not forget to use Sword Flip still. While it produces less damage in the end, it has a much larger, disjointed, and mobile hitbox. Use each as an AA wisely depending on the situation.

Other Players’ Input:

Here's something JokeStroke was discussing in his own D2 thread around the time of its buff.
http://testyourmight.com/threads/deathstroke-new-d2-discussion.35050/

Deathstroke's buffed D2 is something we should all be seriously looking at...

I was just shitting around in practice mode during my lunch break and noticed that his D2 can now beat or trade with Batman's J2 and Joker's crossup J3 and normal J3. It trades less often the higher they are in the jump arc when you hit them.

Recommended Combos:

D2, F3, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 25% (Grounded hit)
D2, B3, Ji3, 323, 12 xx Sword Flip = 28% (Anti-air)
D2 xx Trait = 5%

J1

Spoiler

Damage: Average
Startup: Extremely Fast
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Overhead
Range: Low
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: Yes

Analysis: Fast, great hitbox, potentially high damage combo.

If you find your opponent and yourself jumping at each other in the air, you can try to beat them to the punch with the swiftness of J1.

Like most J1s and J2s, you can add this to the beginning of most ground combos for more damage. You can ALWAYS combo into ANY of Deathstroke's normal moves from Ji1. The only time you can't is if you hit them on the way up from your jump.

Something that REALLY makes this move stand out is its silly hitbox. It's a wide half circle under Deathstroke that hits on both sides. It's somewhat like Ji3 with less range, but potentially more damage if you get a combo out of it. Great for crossups!

Here's my Flying Ninja Vortex video. Ji1 is a key move in this strategy, and you can observe Ji1's crossup capabilities.

Other Players’ Input:

Recommended Combos:

Ji1, 132, Ji2, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 35%
Ji1, B1U2, F3, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 33%
Ji1 (air-to-air), 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 28%

Combo Strings

132

Spoiler

Damage: Average
Total Chip: 0.39%

First Hit (1)
Startup: Fast
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: High
Range: Low
Chip Damage: 0.07%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: Yes

Second Hit (3)
On Block: Extremely Unsafe
Hit Range: Mid
Range: Full Screen
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: No
Other Notes: This move is a projectile. It is affected by Deathstroke's trait.

Third Hit (2)
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: No

Analysis: Safe, quick, powerful combo starter, only offset by its low range. Use it primarily as a punish, and it will serve you well. Did you just block one of Doomsday's shoulder charges? Bust out a 132 and open him up for a combo! It's faster than any of Deathstroke's other combo starters.

You can even use it to break out of certain strings since it comes out rather quickly.

Be careful with how 1 hits high though. This WILL miss on crouching opponents.

Also know that since he actually uses his gun in this string, the bullet WILL be unblockable if his trait is on (and miss if it's on cooldown). This means you can possibly have an unblockable combo starter with the trait up. As cool as that sounds, it's a bit difficult to implement in a game. Just know it's there if the opportunity arises.

Fun fact: As a projectile, 13 is safer than all of Deathstroke's specials >_>

Other Players’ Input:

I want to use TONY-T's anti-Doomsday video here as an example, as it showcases the potential of 132. Look at all of the moves you can punish with it!

Recommended Combos:

132, Ji2, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 33%
132, Ji2, 323, F23 xx MB Quick Fire = 36% (1 meter)

B1U2

Spoiler

Damage: Low
Total Chip: 0.3%
Other Notes: High combo damage scaling

First Hit (B1)
Startup: Moderate
On Block: Safe
Hit Range: Low
Range: Low
Chip Damage: 0.07%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: Yes

Second Hit (U2)
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Chip Damage: 0.27%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: No
Other Notes: Has hard pushback on block

Analysis: This combo is one of the reason's Deathstroke is so darn scary up close. It is a LOW combo starter, yielding decent damage. With a startup that's too short to block on reaction, this move makes a great mixup tool paired with Deathstroke's other overheads.

Sadly, this move scales combos a pretty good amount, and without the use of meter or stage interactables, you won't be netting any combos above the low 30s. The range isn't spectacular, but it's incredibly safe on block. Another good move in terms of risk/reward.

A popular strategy among Deathstroke players is to use a jump in attack followed by B1 for a overhead-low mixup. Just be aware that this combo string only produces an optimal juggle on grounded opponents.

And that's really all there is to it. This is a defining move for Deathstroke and should be regularly incorporated into your mixup game.

Other Players’ Input:

Recommended Combos:

B1U2, F3, 323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 32%
B1U2, F3, 1, 323, 12 xx MB Quick Fire = 35% (1 meter)

B23F2

Damage: Very High
Total Chip: 0.26%
Other Notes: This string will not complete unless Deathstroke is hitting the target.

First Hit (B2)
Startup: Moderate
On Block: Safe
Hit Range: Overhead
Range: Moderate
Chip Damage: 0.1%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: Yes

Second Hit (3)
On Block: Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: No

Third Hit (F2)
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: No
Other Notes: This move is a projectile

Analysis: B2 is Deathstroke's unreactable overhead. B23F2 and B222 can both be used for different reasons as a follow up. It is key to mix this up with his B1 low to establish a powerful mixup game. For what this string lacks in versatility, it makes up for it in power.

Simply put, you want to do B23F2 because it does a LOT of damage (more than any other string Deathstroke has alone). B222 has more versatile options, but the damage on this string can still make it worth using. Also, this string puts the opponents at a full screen distance, useful for reverting back to a keepaway game. Which string you use can be based on preference or the matchup.

Like 3231, this string will not complete unless Deathstroke is hitting his opponent. It will stop at B23, and leave you safe on block.

It has very little combo use, barring certain corner combos.

Other Players’ Input:

Recommended Combos:

3231

Spoiler

Damage: High
Total Chip: 0.26%
Other Notes: This string will not complete unless Deathstroke is hitting the target.

First Hit (1)
Startup: Moderate
On Block: Completely Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Range: Good
Chip Damage: 0.16%
Knockdown: None
Special Cancellable: Yes

Second Hit (2)
On Block: Safe
Hit Range: Mid
Chip Damage: 0.10%
Knockdown: Normal
Special Cancellable: Yes

Third Hit (3)
Special Cancellable: Yes
Knockdown: Normal
Other Notes: This move leaves Deathstroke slightly airborne.

Fourth Hit (1)
Special Cancellable: Yes
Knockdown: Normal
Other Notes: This move leaves Deathstroke high in the air. Since it’s special cancellable, he can even use stage interactions that require you to be in the air! An example is the hovercar on metropolis.

Analysis: This is Deathstroke's main juggle string, and pretty much the only good string that can be comboed after when used mid juggle. It has good range, does good damage, and plays a key role in almost all BnB combos.

You typically want to use JUST 323 for the sake of optimized combos. There’s very little reason to go for the full string most of the time as there are more damaging combos to be done. It often goes right in the middle of a combo, shortly after the launch. This move combos great after a Ji3. Avoid using it after a Ji1 or Ji2; there are more damaging options.

If you need a long range punish, use this move (just be wary of the startup). It's also useful for punishing airborne opponents for situations in which you cannot get a grounded attack off. It won’t net you the most damage on its own, but it does enough. On block or whiff, the string only goes to 32, which is safe enough for you to throw out there enough and not get punished. It’s overall a pretty nice move for Deathstroke, plus it looks cool.

Beware the corners though! 323 can sometimes cross under opponents if you juggle them too high, possibly ruining your combo.

Other Players’ Input:

The best non-meter I could find is 323, 12 xx Machine Gun (29%).

If your 32 is blocked maybe it's a good idea to xx Sword Spin against most the cast. Get that chip, extra meter, and push them back a bit.

Recommended Combos:

323, F23 xx Sword Flip = 26%
323, F23 xx MB Quick Fire = 31% (1 meter)
323, 12 xx Machine Gun = 29% (Only works on grounded opponents) *Credit to Trini_Bwoi*
323, 12 xx MB Machine Gun = 32% (1 meter, only works on grounded opponents)

Specials

Machine Gun ( 2)

Spoiler

Damage: High
Startup: Slow
On Block: Long Range - Unsafe
Close Range - Extremely Unsafe
Meter Burn: Yes
Wakeup Invincibility: None
Total Hits: 5 (on block it's 3)
Hit Range: Mid-Mid-Mid-Mid-Mid (on block it's Mid-Mid-Mid)
Range: Full Screen
Knockdown: None
Total Chip: 0.69%
Other Notes: This move is affected by Deathstroke's trait. Commonly abbreviated to MG or AR (Assault Rifle)

MB Machine Gun
Startup: Slow
On Block: Long Range - Safe*
Close Range - Somewhat Safe
Wakeup Invincibility: None
Total Hits: 6 (on block it's 4)
Hit Range: Mid-Mid-Mid-Mid-Mid-Overhead (on block it's Mid-Mid-Mid-Overhead)
Range: Full Screen
Knockdown: Normal
Total Chip: 2.07%
Other Notes: This move is affected by Deathstroke's trait (the grenade is not)

*Certain reversals will come out before the grenade lands

Analysis: Okay, I just want to say cover this move to let new Deathstroke players that it is NOT as good as it seems at first. It's a mediocre keepaway tool that really only shines with the trait up. Let's pick apart exactly why you shouldn't use this move too often.

In comparison to pistol moves (Quick Fire, Low Shots, and Air Quick Fire)
1. It's got an incredibly slow startup (about twice as much as pistols)
2. It's got much more recovery time
3. Despite having 3 hits on block, it does LESS chip damage than pistols
4. Builds less meter
5. Near useless in combos

Just like the pistols, this thing has NO pushback on block, and the opponent gets a free dash in after blocking one.

So what IS okay about this move?
1. 3 bullets are fired, making it tougher to jump over (but not by much honestly...)
2. Higher damage output on hit
3. Hits mid

The cons just heavily outweigh the pros. That startup may as well count as 2 cons. If you're trying to play keepaway, just stick to pistols. It DOES trade well with opponent projectiles though, since it's pretty strong.

HOWEVER, if you manage to get the trait up, this move becomes a different story. Once it becomes unblockable, this move can actually be scarier than pistols. Why? Because with the trait up, you HAVE to avoid Deathstroke's guns. Blocking is out the window, and this projectile is the hardest to avoid. It's harder to jump over than pistols, and can't be crouched under. Low Shots can't be crouched under either, but they are infinitely easier to jump over, and have no pushback on hit (unlike Machine Gun). But then again, that's if you get Deathstroke's monstrously slow trait activated without dying...

The meter burn version doesn't see much use, but I don't think it's useless. So long as you're not saving meter for anything in particular, there's not much harm in meter burning if Machine Gun hits. Also, the grenade pushes back even on block, so you might use it if you really feel the need to keep distance.

Also, let me just give a quick rundown of Machine Gun and MB Machine Gun mechanics. Deathstroke fires 3 bullets from his Machine Gun. If the first or second bullet hits, he shoots all 5. You can MB this move on hit or not, and the grenade hits overhead.

Other Players’ Input:

Sword Spin ( 3 )

Spoiler

Damage: Low
Startup: Very Fast
On Block: Somewhat Safe
Meter Burn: 2 versions
Wakeup Invincibility: Some
Total Hits: 2
Hit Range: Mid-Mid
Range: Good
Knockdown: Can't knock down, restands opponent
Total Chip: 3.13%
Other Notes: This move has 2 meter burn versions, one of which has a specific command to execute.

MB Sword Spin
Startup: Very Fast
On Block: Unsafe
Wakeup Invincibility: Some
Total Hits: 3
Hit Range: Mid-Mid-Overhead
Range: Good
Knockdown: Normal
Total Chip: 3.29%

MB Sword Spin Low (DB 3, D+MB)
Startup: Very Fast
On Block: Extremely Unsafe
Wakeup Invincibility: Some
Total Hits: 2
Hit Range: Mid-Low
Range: Good
Knockdown: Unscaled Hard
Total Chip: 3.29%

Analysis: I love how derpy Deathstroke looks while doing Sword Spin. This move is very fast and a very good wakeup and reversal move. With a startup of 7 frames and invcinibility on wakeup, this is a good defensive tool.

7 frames is as fast as Deathstroke's D1, and is the fastest move Deathstroke has barring his J1. Being safe on block, this move makes just as good as an interrupt tool as D1, plus it does more damage. Since it is a special move, you can reversal it for an easy pressure breaker.

As a wakeup, it has some invincibility, but it's not a massive amount. Despite the animation, it's not very good at dealing with crossups, and Deathstroke is very vulnerable on his head. Use Sword Flip to deal with those. It's a good wakeup, but use it wisely.

Only use this move as a combo ender for very short strings. Attacks like F23, D1, and B22 get optimal meterless damage by special cancelling into Sword Spin (stronger AND safer than Sword Flip!). Do NOT use this to end extended juggle combos, ESPECIALLY in the corner. A juggled opponent recovers from this move even quicker than Deathstroke does, and they can actually hit you before you can block sometimes. It is NOT a good idea to go for the standing reset mixup.

A lot of people will tell you this move is safe on block. While in a practical sense it is, it IS actually -7 on block. The only thing that can punish it (aside from Superman's super) is Flash's Flying Uppercut at a point blank range. So realistically, it's pretty safe. This means you can cancel any of your ground strings on block into this move for extra chip and pushback.

The MB version bounces the opponent if you hit them with the sword, allowing you to combo afterwards. Midscreen, you can always combo into Quick Fire and Low Shots.
In the corner, this move is a powerful combo extender, as you can combo into more vicious moves like 323 for massive damage.

MB Sword Spin Low is generally useless. The hard knockdown doesn't scale, but it's too short to take advantage of. On top of that, the mixup potential isn't very good, and it's terribly unsafe on block. It's a waste of meter, don't use this.

Other Players’ Input:

Recommended Combos:

MB Sword Spin, Quick Fire = 17% (1 meter)
MB Sword Spin, Low Shots = 17% (1 meter)

Sword Flip ( 3 )

Spoiler

Damage: Low
Startup: Fast
On Block: Extremely Unsafe
Meter Burn: None
Wakeup Invincibility: Some *Credit to Trini_Bwoi*
Total Hits: 3
Hit Range: Mid-Mid-Mid
Range: Very Good
Knockdown: Hard (last hit)
Total Chip: 4%
Other Notes: This move makes Deathstroke airborne for most of the flip, so getting hit out of it will cause a juggle.

Analysis: This is a darn good move. It really has 3 main uses: ending combos, wakeups, and anti-airing opponents.

As a combo ender, it does the ending damage you need, but most importantly, it does a hard knockdown to the opponent. This can lead to some dirty setups such as chip damage with Low Shots or mixups in the corner with F3.

As an anti-air, it's recognized as one of the best in the game. What I love most about it is the massive, long lasting hitbox. The first 2 hits are giant circles around Deathstroke's body, and the last one is a huge pillar in front of him. This move can hit the opponent from about halfway across the screen. Since it hits on both sides of him, it can even stop pesky crossup forward jumps from the opponent. Plus, it's super fast (8 frames)!

Things to watch out for though: There are situations in which all 3 hits of Sword Flip will not hit. This includes long juggle combos and if your opponent is very high above Deathstroke when he activates the move. If the last hit does not connect, you get a normal knockdown instead of a hard one. And most importantly... THIS MOVE IS MAD PUNISHABLE ON BLOCK! Do NOT go about throwing this move around willy-nilly. You WILL get full combo punished by every character in this game.

This move used to be a poor wakeup as it had no invulnerability frames. However, after the 1.04 patch, it was given a decent number of invincibility frames. Hooray! Now unlike before, it makes a fine wakeup, and can handle crossup and jump in attacks well. It IS still incredibly unsafe on block though, so use it carefully.

One other thing I would like to mention is that the chip damage on this move is pretty huge. Since the hitbox is so huge, it's pretty hard to evade at a melee range. Unlike gun shots, the opponent cannot easily jump or duck under this move. If your opponent is low on health, you can easily just run up to them and throw this move their way to chip them out. Just make sure they die, otherwise they'll punish you. You can even add a pressure string to increase the chip. Something like Ji3, 32 xx Sword Flip works for 4.62%.

Other Players’ Input:

Here is TONY-T's combo breakdown of when and why all 3 Sword Flip hits will not connect in extended juggles.

If you do more then 1 hit after the launcher and before the 323, the sword flip after the f23 will miss the majority of its hits.

example..

132, uf2, 1, 323, f23~df3.. only the first hit of sword flip will hit..

132, uf2, 323, f23~df3. all hits of sword flip will hit..


if you do more then 1 hit after the launcher, then its best to use 12 into sword flip, as all hits will hit and it will do the same damage as 1 hit before launcher into f23 sword flip.

Of course, if your comboing your opponent in the corner, then this does not apply.

Throws

Trait

Super

Credits

TONY-T for his unparalleled lab work with Deathstroke. It would take a ton of space to mention everything he has contributed, but know he's a key contributor!

Trini_Bwoi for a 323 combo, Sword Flip wakeup information, and his video on F3 crossups

m2dave for confirming the lack of invincibility frames on Sword Flip wakeup before patch 1.04

JokeStroke for striking up some good discussion on the new and improved D2

 

[Mikman360]

Reserved just in case

 

[Batman-IGAU]

Deathstroke is a zoner yes. But can anyone formulate any possible pressure strings aside from his guns?

 

[RYX]

Deathstroke is a zoner yes. But can anyone formulate any possible pressure strings aside from his guns?

F.23

 

[Batman-IGAU]

Would Jump in 2,Away+1,Up+2,-3,2-3,2-3,2,3-Down,Toward,3 work as a block-lock pressure string?

 

[Batman-IGAU]

F.23

Really? What are you dumb or something.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I don't believe you should ever use j2 except in specific combo situations or when comboing after an interactible mine. J3 does more damage and appears to be at least +10 on block, despite what the in-game frame data says.

3231 should also never be used. 323 can link into f23-SF for much better damage, advantage, and meter.

F23 is a good pressure string because it's so safe and fast. However, from around sweep distance, 323 becomes an excellent pressure string. If it's blocked, only the 32 will come out, which is very difficult to punish. If it hits, all 3 hits will connect, making it incredibly easy to confirm into f23-SF.

 

[RYX]

Really? What are you dumb or something.

Yeah 7 frames and +9 is shit for pressure.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

I don't believe you should ever use j2 except in specific combo situations or when comboing after an interactible mine. J3 does more damage and appears to be at least +10 on block, despite what the in-game frame data says.

3231 should also never be used. 323 can link into f23-SF for much better damage, advantage, and meter.

F23 is a good pressure string because it's so safe and fast. However, from around sweep distance, 323 becomes an excellent pressure string. If it's blocked, only the 32 will come out, which is very difficult to punish. If it hits, all 3 hits will connect, making it incredibly easy to confirm into f23-SF.

Excellent! so say if I rushed my opponent by armoring my way through his pressure say with Toward+3+R2 into 3,2-3,2-3,2-Toward+2,3-3,2,3-T+2,3-SF would that somewhat force him to block this entire pressure string? Is the mentioned string i just put together even viable as a block-lock string?

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I'm not sure we have the same definition of "block string". What you're typing looks more like a combo, but the inputs don't match DS's strings. You should also never end a block string with sword flip; it's very unsafe. Sword Spin is a much better option.

F23 is probably his best block string, like RYX said. It's got a 7-frame start-up, it hits mid, and it's +9 on block.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

I'm not sure we have the same definition of "block string". What you're typing looks more like a combo, but the inputs don't match DS's strings. You should also never end a block string with sword flip; it's very unsafe. Sword Spin is a much better option.

F23 is probably his best block string, like RYX said. It's got a 7-frame start-up, it hits mid, and it's +9 on block.

Ok let me try to clarify myself better. If i have my opponent cornered, can the string i just put together chip away his health uninterrupted? or can it be interrupted at any point?

 

[Deleted member 5032]

Ok let me try to clarify myself better. If i have my opponent cornered, can the string i just put together chip away his health uninterrupted? or can it be interrupted at any point?

I'm assuming the "23" inputs you posted are meant to be f23?

Either way, b3, f3, j3, and f23 are Deathstroke's only real block strings, since they are advantage on block. The only real link that's safe is f3 or b3 into f23 into any other string. The last string would be the end of your pressure. 323 would probably be your best bet, since a blocked f23 leaves you around sweep distance away, and the 323 can be confirmed into f23 sword flip.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

I'm assuming the "23" inputs you posted are meant to be f23?

Either way, b3, f3, j3, and f23 are Deathstroke's only real block strings, since they are advantage on block. The only real link that's safe is f3 or b3 into f23 into any other string. The last string would be the end of your pressure. 323 would probably be your best bet, since a blocked f23 leaves you around sweep distance away, and the 323 can be confirmed into f23 sword flip.

Understood. Thank you.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

What the hell is Enhanced Reflexes good for? unless your playing against someone who never played a fighting game before who stands away full screen throwing out 1,1,1,1, into the air. The damn trait takes FOREEEEEEVR to startup and any good player can still close in on you after a full screen hard knock down! wtf!

 

[Trini_Bwoi]

What the hell is Enhanced Reflexes good for? unless your playing against someone who never played a fighting game before who stands away full screen throwing out 1,1,1,1, into the air. The damn trait takes FOREEEEEEVR to startup and any good player can still close in on you after a full screen hard knock down! wtf!

Ikr, I haven't found a good use for it yet. Even if you do manage to use it, all my opponents become Neo at dodging bullets. It's way better to chip them as they try to get in instead of trying to get that unblockable damage and then they can get in for free during the debuff.

 

[RYX]

Ikr, I haven't found a good use for it yet. Even if you do manage to use it, all my opponents become Neo at dodging bullets. It's way better to chip them as they try to get in instead of trying to get that unblockable damage and then they can get in for free during the debuff.

Not really no. Just score a knockdown and you can use it while they try and get in. You can save/build meter and MB f/b.3 if they try coming in or you could check them with b.1, 32xspin. Depending on distance and when they get in, you can usually shoot again while doing a combo and still finish with optimum damage.

Don't rely on it but it has its uses.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I just use it on Bane after his Venom runs out and his player thinks they can just crouch-block in the corner while it recovers. That is literally the only use I've found for it. It could probably work on WW if she tries to turtle in S&S stance.

 

[Mikman360]

I feel like enhanced reflexes are possibly good in a situation in which you want to fight close, but you don't want to make the approach (say they have a really good anti-air game). It basically forces the opponent to approach you sort of.

Look at it this way. No one is going to keep turtling in the corner if you have trait up. Theyre just going to eat straight damage. So they sort of have to approach you.

Now I haven't had much luck in finding safe times to use it though. The startup is HUGE. None of DS's completed strings give him enough time to use his trait without being punished by a good wakeup, even the hard knockdown ones. F23 is the closest you can get, but fast wakeups can still hit you. The only real setup I could find is D2, Trait. Other than that, you can really only activate it full screen and hope the opponent cant teleport/projectile you in time.

 

[LiangHuBBB]

3,2,3 into f3,2 is it just me or does anyone else have trouble to get the timing down in online matches for this?
In training mode I can do it like 9 out of 10 times, but online maybe 1 out of 10 times.
Maybe it's the slight delay which makes the timing for the input a bit different?
Any advice?
Thanks in advance.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

3,2,3 into f3,2 is it just me or does anyone else have trouble to get the timing down in online matches for this?
In training mode I can do it like 9 out of 10 times, but online maybe 1 out of 10 times.
Maybe it's the slight delay which makes the timing for the input a bit different?
Any advice?
Thanks in advance.

You just have to input the f23 a few frames earlier than you think you should. I used to just do 3231-airshot because I thought it was impossible online; now I rarely drop it.

 

[LiangHuBBB]

Thanks I will give it a try.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

I just use it on Bane after his Venom runs out and his player thinks they can just crouch-block in the corner while it recovers. That is literally the only use I've found for it. It could probably work on WW if she tries to turtle in S&S stance.

lol

 

[Batman-IGAU]

I feel like enhanced reflexes are possibly good in a situation in which you want to fight close, but you don't want to make the approach (say they have a really good anti-air game). It basically forces the opponent to approach you sort of.

Look at it this way. No one is going to keep turtling in the corner if you have trait up. Theyre just going to eat straight damage. So they sort of have to approach you.

Now I haven't had much luck in finding safe times to use it though. The startup is HUGE. None of DS's completed strings give him enough time to use his trait without being punished by a good wakeup, even the hard knockdown ones. F23 is the closest you can get, but fast wakeups can still hit you. The only real setup I could find is D2, Trait. Other than that, you can really only activate it full screen and hope the opponent cant teleport/projectile you in time.

Don't get me wrong, Even though Batman is my primary character hence my name, my secondary character is Deathstroke and I love him to death. So even if I'm playing as Deathstroke against a Batman player I still don't want to lose and it seems like every time I activate his trait by the time his shout "Haah!" is ending I'm already eating meterburn batarangs knocking me down killing my Enhanced Reflexes time because now I gotta get up. I think i'm just gonna use it as a greeting to my opponent at the beginning of the match.

 

[Mikman360]

Don't get me wrong, Even though Batman is my primary character hence my name, my secondary character is Deathstroke and I love him to death. So even if I'm playing as Deathstroke against a Batman player I still don't want to lose and it seems like every time I activate his trait by the time his shout "Haah!" is ending I'm already eating meterburn batarangs knocking me down killing my Enhanced Reflexes time because now I gotta get up. I think i'm just gonna use it as a greeting to my opponent at the beginning of the match.

Using it at the beginning of the match? I'm sorry, but that sounds like a terribly dangerous idea. Many characters can open you up for a combo at that range.

Like I said, the safest options I've found so far would be D2 > Trait cancel, full screen after some gunshots, and F23 on a grounded opponent.
Even then, only the first one is COMPLETELY safe.

 

[Batman-IGAU]

You just have to input the f23 a few frames earlier than you think you should. I used to just do 3231-airshot because I thought it was impossible online; now I rarely drop it.

To get off the topic for a sec, remember my questions to you about possible Deathstroke pressure strings? Well I just tried a string on someone online and it worked! He had me closed in so I meter burned a SS and I was able to pressure him forcing him to stay in block mode till I created enough space to start zoning him again. I did this: Jump-in 3 like you said and followed up with 3,2,SF-1,2,MBF+3-1,2,SF-3,2,--throw. I guess I conditioned him to expect a SF after every 3,2 and 1,2 that he stayed blocking after my last 1,2 long enough for me to grab him and throw him giving me distance to pistol zone him low-air-stance-low. maybe you want to try this.