Im glad the top players are speaking up about custom variations

[DDustiNN]

Better players could lose to worse players simply because they weren't prepared for some dumb variation or random variable thrown in.

No. Better players can adapt and overcome.

 

[DDustiNN]

Then maybe (just maybe) consider that the entire CONCEPT of variation is A HORRIBLE IDEA?!

I mean, don't you think that JUST FRIGGING MAYBE there is a god damn great reason why NO OTHER FIGHTING GAME ON THE MARKET uses a variation system that gates moves and makes characters less than complete? Why the general FGC appreciates FULLY FLESHED OUT characters from the get go?

If custom variations are going to be a problem, then maybe that IS the problem! I still think to date that the variation system in MKX was the worst fucking thing they could have done. MANY fighting games abandoned this approach years ago simply because it is a nightmare to ever balance. Why NRS thought it was a good idea baffles me, and why they doubled down even harder in this game honestly has me thinking Boon isn't right in the head.

Custom variations are great for CASUAL content, but if you want your game to be played professionally then there's a god damn great reason why it isn't done.

You are in the minority. This has been discussed to death following the beta, and the vast majority would prefer custom variations.

So I guess I’d simply say... you’re wrong.

 

[Xelz]

I mean, don't you think that JUST FRIGGING MAYBE there is a god damn great reason why NO OTHER FIGHTING GAME ON THE MARKET uses a variation system that gates moves and makes characters less than complete? Why the general FGC appreciates FULLY FLESHED OUT characters from the get go?

I often wonder why the FGC is so small compared to other gaming communities. And I wonder why most players besides the most hard core gamers drop a fighting game a few months after launch, while FPS, MOBA, battle royale, CCGs, RPG looters, loot shooters, MMOs, and other genres maintain player engagement for years.

And then I'm reminded that the FGC hasn't moved past the '90s, how the FGC fights innovation with tooth and nail, and then it all makes sense.

 

[Shirakani]

So I guess I’d simply say... you’re wrong.

Being in the minority doesn't make me wrong. If you want to go by that logic, I can say that being in the majority makes you mindless sheep.

Don't even start with that.

 

[ColdBoreMK23]

I'm kind of on the fence with custom variations one kind of grown accustomed to the set tournament variations but the custom ones are super fun and could be interesting in tournament.

 

[FlowerFighter]

This kind of talk makes me know I'm dealing with a young person who was never around during the arcade scene or the heyday of competitive fighting games. Your whole attitude of waiting for the game developer to figure out their game and change things is so sad and wrongheaded and goes against all of fighting game history. The players figure out the game. The players break the game. The players shape the gameplay and take it to places the developer may not have intended. THAT is fighting games.

What the hell are you even on about bro. I've never discussed anything about the 'devs figuring crap out.' I'm talking about the nuances of balancing a fighting game that has 10000000000x10000 variables. I grew up playing Tekken 2 in the arcades and SF3S. You're literally comparing apples to oranges if you're equating the players figuring out those games to a game in 2019 that has a create a fighter feel to it. I also don't want to go back to having 3 viable characters on the roster like the 'arcade days' Because Kabal has a variation that lets him use 3 different mediums of projectiles at once.

I'm against patching games frequently and I'm 100 percent all for letting players figure out the game. This has no bearing at all on 15 variations per character being good for the game competitively. Like I don't even know how else to be more blunt with you. It's so braindead that it almost baffles me you can't see this.

Sorry man, but not all of us in our 30s are morons. What kind of decent FG player wants to play 'kreat a fighter' Like get out of my face lmfao.

Hey you know what I want to fight against? Geras rewind time ability, man that would be a blast, wouldn't it?

I feel like these opinions are coming from people who were never competition ready in a fighting game in their life.

 

[FlowerFighter]

Being in the minority doesn't make me wrong. If you want to go by that logic, I can say that being in the majority makes you mindless sheep.

Don't even start with that.

Right? Because an intelligent person would totally believe that the balance of a game should be in the hands of the majority. Lmfao. If that was the case then we'd have no zoners in the game whatsoever because people don't know how to perfect block or block correctly in general.

 

[Syd Barrett Lives]

I love how people use "we can't use them in competitve modes because then we don't know what we're up against" as a justification.

Have you ever played any form of competitive sport or anything? Do the opposing team give you their playbook one month in advance? Do MMA fighters tell each other "I'll use only a front kick and a left hook so act accordingly"?

The fact that we don't know the exact matchups becomes a part of the competition, simple as that. Good players adapt, improve and overcome.
If players finds unbalanced stuff they can easily patch some different slot costs or conficting moves.

 

[Juggs]

Are they? It seems to me that lots of characters have one decent or good loadout and one crappy loadout while some have two subpar loadouts and maybe a couple have two decent ones. There are 25 characters in the roster - do you think that someone who wants to use a competitively viable character would have 25 options to choose from, let alone 50?

From the way I've seen it, the tournament variations are anything but fine.

Awesome username, btw. Guardians 2 was great.

Anyway, I think for right now they’re fine. Too much to figure out. It’s still very early. Like people were complaining, including myself, at first about Noob and Scorpion’s tournament variations not being too good. Turns out both characters are top tier in those same tournament variations.

Just give it a little time. I think there’s definitely some characters that need their variations improved or better ones made though, for sure. But again, I’m fine with it for the time being.

 

[Invincibeast]

I love how people use "we can't use them in competitve modes because then we don't know what we're up against" as a justification.

Have you ever played any form of competitive sport or anything? Do the opposing team give you their playbook one month in advance? Do MMA fighters tell each other "I'll use only a front kick and a left hook so act accordingly"?

The fact that we don't know the exact matchups becomes a part of the competition, simple as that. Good players adapt, improve and overcome.
If players finds unbalanced stuff they can easily patch some different slot costs or conficting moves.

As an MMA fighter myself all I can say is I fucking wish lmao.
But I think thats a great example to bring forward as well, we can scout our opposition on tapes as much as we want, even getting training partners to emulate their style, yet during the fight there is USUALLY something new that the opponent has worked on or started using that we need to adapt to. At least with custom variations you could go to the lab to see the properties of the move. Its really not that hard.

 

[TaserFace007]

Awesome username, btw. Guardians 2 was great.

Anyway, I think for right now they’re fine. Too much to figure out. It’s still very early. Like people were complaining, including myself, at first about Noob and Scorpion’s tournament variations not being too good. Turns out both characters are top tier in those same tournament variations.

Just give it a little time. I think there’s definitely some characters that need their variations improved or better ones made though, for sure. But again, I’m fine with it for the time being.

I’m still not a fan. If one of the variations randomly happens to be what I’d put in, I’ll play them in Ranked. Otherwise, I’ll use Kasual. The two modes are essentially identical, so there’s nothing really “official” about Ranked. It just limits what you can do with a character and, far more insidiously, prevents people from seeing the kool and klever custom names you’ve thought up.

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

I mean this in the most unoffensive way possible...this game isn't complex enough offensively for custom builds to break it. A LOT of its new mechanics and things to get used to are defensive bits like Flawless Blocks and Getup attacks.
Special Moves to me feel more like D2 and arming a Guardian; you've got your base build, and a few special add-ons in place of the guns. And I haven't seen or heard about anything Ghallarhorn Tier, yet.

We should have a Kontest.
See who can make the most fucked up versions of characters.
I really want to know how bad it can get.

 

[BookBurning]

I love how people use "we can't use them in competitve modes because then we don't know what we're up against" as a justification.

Have you ever played any form of competitive sport or anything? Do the opposing team give you their playbook one month in advance? Do MMA fighters tell each other "I'll use only a front kick and a left hook so act accordingly"?

The fact that we don't know the exact matchups becomes a part of the competition, simple as that. Good players adapt, improve and overcome.
If players finds unbalanced stuff they can easily patch some different slot costs or conficting moves.

You're confusing tactics and strategy with variables. A football is always football, they don't have to learn what different balls do.

 

[DarkSado]

I love how people use "we can't use them in competitve modes because then we don't know what we're up against" as a justification.

Have you ever played any form of competitive sport or anything? Do the opposing team give you their playbook one month in advance? Do MMA fighters tell each other "I'll use only a front kick and a left hook so act accordingly"?

The fact that we don't know the exact matchups becomes a part of the competition, simple as that. Good players adapt, improve and overcome.
If players finds unbalanced stuff they can easily patch some different slot costs or conficting moves.

yea bro let’s compare this to athletic sports lol.

 

[Kiss the Missile]

I don't see why balance is such a factor here. If I can make Kitana as busted a Erron, why stop me. Players will gravitate towards the most broken loadouts like they do towards the most broken characters. I don't see a difference, just a lack of fun.

Especially since NRS already said they'll add more moves and variations, this just seems to delay the inevitable. Geras might have a broken ass move right now, but we wont know until players experiment with it when it becomes tournament legal

 

[Osagri]

I have a feeling that this game will have some sort of "living variations". I think they will change the tournament variations In x ammount of time.