How to handle Jax?

[kostikla]

Hey Guys, sorry if I'm not posting it in the correct forum subcategory, I was thinking of posting this in the Jax forums but it looked wrong to post a non-improvement topic for the character there.

Long story short, I faced a Jax yesterday that basically was using three moves:

• F2,1+3
• 22,1+3
• D3/F33

Basically he used the d3/f33 to test me and then proceeded with repeating the first two combos, then again to jabs, rinse repeat. I looked them up in Jax's frame data and they're -7 on block, which means I couldn't do anything but block, and couldn't punish/kounter since as Sonya the shortest punish is 7 frames on start-up. He has a gap before his 13 which allows you to flawless block but I'm so bad at flawless blocking that it's not really a viable strategy.

I wonder if any other players faced the same matchup and how did you overcome this non-stop spamming? Should I have just block a jab then proceed with my own combos since he was so oppressive? Or should I try to kounter him on his 2/F2 startup since they're 11 and 12 frames respectively which allows me to sneak in a S1?

Thanks a lot for any input!

 

[GLoRToR]

Hey Guys, sorry if I'm not posting it in the correct forum subcategory, I was thinking of posting this in the Jax forums but it looked wrong to post a non-improvement topic for the character there.

Long story short, I faced a Jax yesterday that basically was using three moves:

• F2,1+3
• 22,1+3
• D3/F33

Basically he used the d3/f33 to test me and then proceeded with repeating the first two combos, then again to jabs, rinse repeat. I looked them up in Jax's frame data and they're -7 on block, which means I couldn't do anything but block, and couldn't punish/kounter since as Sonya the shortest punish is 7 frames on start-up. He has a gap before his 13 which allows you to flawless block but I'm so bad at flawless blocking that it's not really a viable strategy.

I wonder if any other players faced the same matchup and how did you overcome this non-stop spamming? Should I have just block a jab then proceed with my own combos since he was so oppressive? Or should I try to kounter him on his 2/F2 startup since they're 11 and 12 frames respectively which allows me to sneak in a S1?

Thanks a lot for any input!

Sonya forum, matchup discussion is your best option.

As a general rule of thumb, though, you want to block low against Jax and react to his overhead options then poke out when he's negative. Sadly, most of his shit is very safe on block and online makes d1 timings difficult to say the least. Go into the lab, turn on frame data for both sides and record his strings then see when he's negative on block after you learn to block him correctly.

There is no general best answer to Jax as his pressure is pretty solid with F3, though. You want to see what your best mid is and contest him. Sonya is overall stronger currently, though, so don't be scared if you get outplayed.

 

[DrFolmer]

You kinda win more damage than he does when you guess right compared to when he does. You think he goes for staggers? Hit him with a fast mid or even b1.

Or just be really patient and wait for him to commit to the 1+3 ender. He has to hold it and respect your turn. Reversal throw can work wonders to also create space. And just zone him out, that alone wins games. Jax punishes impatient players hard. At the end of the day, his footsies are a bit meh and his range isnt super good either. Turtling helps Sonya super much here

 

[kostikla]

You kinda win more damage than he does when you guess right compared to when he does. You think he goes for staggers? Hit him with a fast mid or even b1.

Or just be really patient and wait for him to commit to the 1+3 ender. He has to hold it and respect your turn. Reversal throw can work wonders to also create space. And just zone him out, that alone wins games. Jax punishes impatient players hard. At the end of the day, his footsies are a bit meh and his range isnt super good either. Turtling helps Sonya super much here

Thanks for the advice! Although B1 seems like an overkill, isn't 11 frames a bit too much and risky? Also, could you please explain what Turtling is? I think I outta create a sort of keyword wiki here to help newbies like me understand these terms

 

[UPR_Nova]

As a Jax player, I know that you need to zone more. Stay back and try to bait out a poorly spaced f2 string and punish on whiff. In the -7 situations, start reversal throwing. It will eat follow up poke attempts (which are not real btw) and will start to get the Jax respecting the fact that he has lost his turn. You didn't mention amp bf2 on block from Jax but I recommend taking that to the lab to learn it's timing. Don't jump too much. Any standing 1 AA leads to over 40%. Everything else is kinda dependent on the Jax player (when they let 1+3 rip, when they block to check pokes, what they do with +1, etc.). Jax is a monster; takes a few sets against one to really see what he offers.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

F3 = -11
F33= -4
F33 1+3 = -7
F2 = -4
F2D4 = -20
F2 1+3 = -7
F4 = +1
B3 = -9
Gotcha Grab = -17
Dash Punch = -16
(high) 1 = +1
(high) 12 = +1
D12 = -6 (ends in high)

Other than F4, 1, and 12, (1 and 12 are highs so just duck block and you don't have to worry about those) literally any time he touches you on block it's your turn. If he's at -7 don't just block. It's your turn. You need to at least poke to keep him from going into a poke himself or another string.

Any of his 1+3 enders can be flawless blocked into full combo.

Gotcha grab and dash punch are both full combo punishable on block.


And yeah, if you're sonya... just throw rings. Hard for him to do much vs that.

 

[kostikla]

Thanks guys! I guess I just have to learn to take my turn when it's mine. I remember trying that but probably the timing was poor and I got knocked down over and over again.

 

[DrFolmer]

Thanks for the advice! Although B1 seems like an overkill, isn't 11 frames a bit too much and risky? Also, could you please explain what Turtling is? I think I outta create a sort of keyword wiki here to help newbies like me understand these terms

He is negative 7. He can d1 you but using a mid will catch all options. By turtling I mean just let him come to you. Sonya doesnt have to be up close, just walk backwards and shoot rings. If you read him trying to jump you just do that super fast anti air special you got that combos on hit with a bar

 

[DrFolmer]

Cant believe Im out here helping Sonya mains LOL

 

[Tundra81]

Good stuff Folmer and Reed. I got mauled by a couple Jax players in the KL. He seems honest enough where I know I'm just getting out played. As Johnny I think I try and poke too much and just get blown up for it. I was labbing last night and instead of poking in certain situations 124 or 121 worked out much better. gonna try this going forward.