General/Other - Ermac ERMAC 'Best Variation' Voting Poll/Discussion of Opinions [5/22/16]

[D7X]

Explanations and debates are appreciated!
Feel free to put them in order of ranking! =)

 

[Nausea]

Spectral. Hands down. <3

 

[D7X]

Spectral. Hands down. <3

That's what I think too
Started playing around w/ him today.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

Spectral. Hands down. <3

Mystic with the glitch. Hands down

 

[Geoffmeister]

Mystic:
- 12-14 frame launching reversal (meterless)
- 9 frame armor that heals and can launch in some situations
- space control with Push

MoS
- meterless (unsafe) vortex
- space control with Soul Ball
- can end exchange into a restand (meterless)

Spectral
- "safe" 50/50's (I wouldn't call them safe but a punish is less guaranteed than his other variations)
- no space control other than Spectral Push/Tele-lift (highly unsafe)
- top corner game

MU-wise I believe Mystic wins, better character is Master of Souls and Spectral lacks the space-control that Ermac globally needs (for lack of range and a mid) but is the strongest in the corner.

All in all: I think MoS/Mystic share the best variations spot and Spectral is slightly lower. If safe 50/50's are what you're after, you could find a lot better than Spectral imo.

 

[Nausea]

Mystic:
- 12-14 frame launching reversal (meterless)
- 9 frame armor that heals and can launch in some situations
- space control with Push

- Did Mystic get a new move or wha?! The only thing I can think of is the Tele-Push trade which is a terrible example of a launching meterless move... What move are you referring to here?
- The only reason anyone really picks Mystic. EXBF2 is Ermacs best move globally across all 3 variations imo.
- You can't control space with Push, just air control if anything. Highly unsafe and can be punished with relative ease by most of the cast, sometimes into full combo.

Spectral
- "safe" 50/50's (I wouldn't call them safe but a punish is less guaranteed than his other variations)
- no space control other than Spectral Push/Tele-lift (highly unsafe)
- top corner game

- It is safe. Its only when the opponent has meter it becomes "safe".
- He has 10x better space control than Mystic. His free flight in Soul Ascension is incredibly fast moving. 2 armored moves while in flight and a safe ground pound that can stop jumping opponents in their tracks. You can easily avoid being zoned and has the the entire screen to work with. If that isn't total space control I don't know what is lol. 9f advancing mid which is awkward to punish and deals a nice chunk of damage giving it is used sparingly and on a good read.
- YES! His corner game is the best corner game <3

If anything its Spectral then closely followed by MoS then Mystic for a few matchups that they struggle in! Do you have any Mystic GP uploaded anywhere @Geoffmeister?

 

[Geoffmeister]

- Did Mystic get a new move or wha?! The only thing I can think of is the Tele-Push trade which is a terrible example of a launching meterless move... What move are you referring to here?
- The only reason anyone really picks Mystic. EXBF2 is Ermacs best move globally across all 3 variations imo.
- You can't control space with Push, just air control if anything. Highly unsafe and can be punished with relative ease by most of the cast, sometimes into full combo.

- It is safe. Its only when the opponent has meter it becomes "safe".
- He has 10x better space control than Mystic. His free flight in Soul Ascension is incredibly fast moving. 2 armored moves while in flight and a safe ground pound that can stop jumping opponents in their tracks. You can easily avoid being zoned and has the the entire screen to work with. If that isn't total space control I don't know what is lol. 9f advancing mid which is awkward to punish and deals a nice chunk of damage giving it is used sparingly and on a good read.
- YES! His corner game is the best corner game <3

If anything its Spectral then closely followed by MoS then Mystic for a few matchups that they struggle in! Do you have any Mystic GP uploaded anywhere @Geoffmeister?

- That's exactly what I mean, the EX Push can punish/trade opponents projectiles, I think it's a pretty big deal..
edit*: no the meterless is Tele-lift
- Agreed, EX Push is Ermacs best move.
- I believe you can get space control out of it, there's several situations where if followed up with a Force Push you're safe from most advancing normals. Fully punishable, yes, more unsafe than a Soul Ball yes, but people can't just jump over it (which you can with Soul Ball or Telestomps) so he gains a bit more respect (you don't even have to use it, just the threat of it is enough for his gameplan).
- You can backdash after the mixup (doesn't sound like much but) this leaves Ermac exposed in the air where he might be whiffing his levitated normals, making him vulnerable. Worst case scenario the opponent is back in neutral where I think Spectral is severely lacking. Still pretty good, but when you think about the fact there's characters with safe mixup-after-mixup situations coupled with no gaps it's just not as reliable.
- He can't have better space control, when you're opponent is out of F4 range (furthest reaching normal which I will add is inconsistent) your best option is Spectral Charge (which is as unsafe as Soul Ball or Force Push) and he becomes the traveling hitbox, meaning if blocked a punish should be inevitable. Levitate into Telestomp leaves him exposed to jumpins (you could mix this up with Levitated Teleport, also inconsistent and unsafe, only to be done on reads). Also he's not safe from projectiles when trying to space control with Levitate footsies, you might stand a chance to high startup projectiles (like SZ's Ice Ball, Smoke's Smoke Bomb) but those are scarce.
- Yeah can't downplay the corner game, it's deadly and if you don't have a bar you might as well put your controller down.

I have about 6 hours worth of Challenger/ESL gameplay using Mystic/MoS/Spectral (and Smoke) which I will upload soon. This is also what I base this information on, I tried Spectral and the weaknesses I mentioned felt all the more noticable against high-level players. Would not recommend Spectral for any Ermac main if I'm being honest (I would consider a very few MU's, 3-5 variations at most) but Mystic does fine against those specific ones as well so it seems redundant to me.

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

I wish they buff Mystic's push to something like Raven's soul crush. The beta version was -14 on block, I think it was very balanced, no idea why they overnerfed it. I love Raven and miss her so much. Unfortunately Ermac's walk speed sucks ass.....

 

[mariano1234]

master of souls for me hes fucking unstoppable

 

[Geoffmeister]

I wish they buff Mystic's push to something like Raven's soul crush. The beta version was -14 on block, I think it was very balanced, no idea why they overnerfed it. I love Raven and miss her so much. Unfortunately Ermac's walk speed sucks ass.....

Gotta say, I thought the same thing for a long time but if it came down to only having either the improved Push or improved EX Push, we were lucky to get the EX Push (which is -6, not -1 like in MKXL beta iirc).
-14 was kinda crazy, -18 would have been more acceptable for normal Push but in combination with the EX push Mystic might've been bit too strong (although for this current roster, It'd be "fair"), there's an actual gameplan now and a way for your opponent to work around it.

 

[D7X]

Gotta say, I thought the same thing for a long time but if it came down to only having either the improved Push or improved EX Push, we were lucky to get the EX Push (which is -6, not -1 like in MKXL beta iirc).
-14 was kinda crazy, -18 would have been more acceptable for normal Push but in combination with the EX push Mystic might've been bit too strong (although for this current roster, It'd be "fair"), there's an actual gameplan now and a way for your opponent to work around it.

I'm almost a month late, but I forgot to write my opinion.
1. Spectral
2. Mystic (Debatable spot)
3. MoS