Strategy - Hellfire Blowing Up Wakeups

[HeroesNZ]

So in light of @Shadow985's Flame Aura tech (huge props for that btw), I figured it'd be good to have a thread where we can compile all of the different ways Scorpion can blow up wakeups in different matchups.

- **HELLFIRE** Shadow's tech is basically that the ticks from Flame Aura are absorbed by armour, so if timed right you can completely stuff any wakeup with 1 hit of armour in the game (including Lao's 5f EX Spin). I found it was only consistent after Flame Aura 21 xx FBC B22F2. After this, a meaty standing 2/whatever breaks the armour 99% of the time.

- Erron Black's slide gets bodied by a jump over after Takedown.

- Kung Jin's Bo Spin gets bodied by neutral jumps.

- A dash into neutral jump after a hard knockdown in the corner reverses wakeups.

@Eddy Wang
@Slips
@JTB123
@Scoot Magee
@MITDJT
@Vagrant
@Every Scorpion main

 

[Eddy Wang]

Youtube is not opening for me right now, you can't imagine how salty i am about this.

 

[Braindead]

That Flame Aura tech is good.

 

[LaidbackOne]

So in light of @Shadow985's Flame Aura tech (huge props for that btw), I figured it'd be good to have a thread where we can compile all of the different ways Scorpion can blow up wakeups in different matchups.

- **HELLFIRE** Shadow's tech is basically that the ticks from Flame Aura are absorbed by armour, so if timed right you can completely stuff any armoured wakeup in the game (including Lao's 5f EX Spin). I found it was only consistent after Flame Aura 21 xx FBC B22F2. After this, a meaty standing 2/whatever breaks the armour.

- Erron Black's slide gets bodied by a jump over after Takedown.

- Kung Jin's Bo Spin gets bodied by neutral jumps.

- A dash into neutral jump after a hard knockdown in the corner reverses wakeups.

@Eddy Wang
@Slips
@JTB123
@Scoot Magee
@MITDJT
@Vagrant
@Every Scorpion main

After seeing this im boarding the Scorpion train. TOOT TOOT!

 

[Eddy Wang]

So in light of @Shadow985's Flame Aura tech (huge props for that btw), I figured it'd be good to have a thread where we can compile all of the different ways Scorpion can blow up wakeups in different matchups.

- **HELLFIRE** Shadow's tech is basically that the ticks from Flame Aura are absorbed by armour, so if timed right you can completely stuff any armoured wakeup in the game (including Lao's 5f EX Spin). I found it was only consistent after Flame Aura 21 xx FBC B22F2. After this, a meaty standing 2/whatever breaks the armour 99% of the time.

- Erron Black's slide gets bodied by a jump over after Takedown.

- Kung Jin's Bo Spin gets bodied by neutral jumps.

- A dash into neutral jump after a hard knockdown in the corner reverses wakeups.

@Eddy Wang
@Slips
@JTB123
@Scoot Magee
@MITDJT
@Vagrant
@Every Scorpion main

Looks pretty legit to me, if B32F2 grants this hard knockdown, with flame aura activated should force them to delay their wakeup most of the time.

Hellfire for the win.

 

[NaughtySenpai]

Would anyone be so nice to link me to some optimal meterless/1 meter midscreen combos with Hellfire Scorpion, that are actually practical (i.e. starting from 2,1,4/1,1,4/b3,spear etc.)?
The combo thread is not well-organized and there's a lot of bad combos mixed with actual practical ones.
I'm not very creative in terms of coming up with combos, but I'm an execution monkey in this game and this video here made me interested in learning the Hellfire variation.

 

[HeroesNZ]

Would anyone be so nice to link me to some optimal meterless/1 meter midscreen combos with Hellfire Scorpion, that are actually practical (i.e. starting from 2,1,4/1,1,4/b3,spear etc.)?
The combo thread is not well-organized and there's a lot of bad combos mixed with actual practical ones.
I'm not very creative in terms of coming up with combos, but I'm an execution monkey in this game and this video here made me interested in learning the Hellfire variation.

Meterless:
214/114 xx DB3 21 xx Spear JP F4 xx DB4 21 xx FBC 21 xx DB3

Grounded Starter (11/21/B3/F3 etc...) xx Spear JP F4 xx DB4 214 xx DB3 4 xx BF4

Grounded Starter xx FBC (Fireball Cancel) 214 xx DB3 21 xx Spear JP F4 11 xx DB3

1 Bar:
214 xx DB3 214 xx EX DB3 run 21 xx Spear JP F4 xx DB4 21 xx FBC 21 xx DB3

Grounded Starter xx FBC 214 xx DB3 214 xx EX DB3 run 21 xx Spear JP F4 xx DB4 11 xx DB3

 

[Slips]

We have to take into account the other armor moves on wakeup as well. It's nice that we can neutral jump Kung Jin's the bow spin but that will get hit by his armored overhead cartwheel. A cross over would work best for efficiency's sake. Not sure on the others, but just sayin.

 

[Big Pampering]

To be clear tempest 5 frame spin isn't good because of its armor, its good because of its startup so the armor on it isn't different from the average armored move. The buzzsaw ex spin however has layers of armor, have you tested that wakeup attack?

 

[HeroesNZ]

To be clear tempest 5 frame spin isn't good because of its armor, its good because of its startup so the armor on it isn't different from the average armored move. The buzzsaw ex spin however has layers of armor, have you tested that wakeup attack?

Well yeah, I mentioned it because of its startup frames. It shows that he's hit out of the spin before the spin can hit you.

If a move can absorb >1 hits of armour then the wakeup will hit Scorpion because it will absorb both the Flame Aura tick & the meaty normal.

 

[Paul the Octopus]

We have to take into account the other armor moves on wakeup as well. It's nice that we can neutral jump Kung Jin's the bow spin but that will get hit by his armored overhead cartwheel. A cross over would work best for efficiency's sake. Not sure on the others, but just sayin.

Can't Kung Jin do his ex flying Grayson and avoid punishment if you cross him over?

I thought the best thing would be to backdash and then briefly hold block - you would block flying Grayson if he does that and you can punish. Then unblock on reaction to cartwheel/bow spin and whiff punish.

I could be missing/forgetting something.

 

[Slips]

Can't Kung Jin do his ex flying Grayson and avoid punishment if you cross him over?

I thought the best thing would be to backdash and then briefly hold block - you would block flying Grayson if he does that and you can punish. Then unblock on reaction to cartwheel/bow spin and whiff punish.

I could be missing/forgetting something.

Good question I'm not sure. I imagine you can do a jump cross over and whiff punish each armor option with EX tele on reaction depending on what he does. Just theory though I'll have to test to verify. (I'm at work)

 

[Paul the Octopus]

Good question I'm not sure. I imagine you can do a jump cross over and whiff punish each armor option with EX tele on reaction depending on what he does. Just theory though I'll have to test to verify. (I'm at work)

Ah oops I didn't realize I was in the scorpion forum hah. The above is what I do w Kano. But I imagine it works for near everyone anyway.

You're right scorpion might be able to still punish flying Grayson w ex tele if he does a jump cross over. Backdash and block method still might be helpful if you want a meterless punish that covers all wake ups tho.