What am I supposed to do with Choke?

[HexaDecimus]

I've played Kano since launch, and I haven't figured out why he has Choke in his movelist. Keep in mind, I'm not talking shit here, I'm sure the reason is my own ignorance.

Just about the only thing I can think of is if I want to sacrifice 2%-ish damage at the end of a juggle with the benefit of having the foe in sweep distance afterwards. It's not really that safe on block and 9% damage just doesn't beat Up Ball.

I've played around with everything I can think of, and I just can't think why I shouldn't just use Up Ball instead, even after I've been playing around post-hotfix (which, to be honest, wasn't that bad of a nerf at all, I'm still knockin heads around to make sure all the giddy players thinking Kano is cake now don't get things twisted).

Any help would be appreciated.

 

[MagicMan357]

I've played Kano since launch, and I haven't figured out why he has Choke in his movelist. Keep in mind, I'm not talking shit here, I'm sure the reason is my own ignorance.

Just about the only thing I can think of is if I want to sacrifice 2%-ish damage at the end of a juggle with the benefit of having the foe in sweep distance afterwards. It's not really that safe on block and 9% damage just doesn't beat Up Ball.

I've played around with everything I can think of, and I just can't think why I shouldn't just use Up Ball instead, even after I've been playing around post-hotfix (which, to be honest, wasn't that bad of a nerf at all, I'm still knockin heads around to make sure all the giddy players thinking Kano is cake now don't get things twisted).

Any help would be appreciated.

hit confirmation, and it cancels out alot of enemy attacks

The Ex Choke on Wake up knocks out projectiles but i dont know about regular

 

[Mailorder]

I've also wondered why the guide lists using Choke to end block strings when it's not completely safe since it can be ducked. But I guess it's still fairly useful to have as long as my block strings don't get predictable.

hit confirmation, and it cancels out alot of enemy attacks

The Ex Choke on Wake up knocks out projectiles but i dont know about regular

Good tip on using Choke for hit confirmation. I've been shortening some of my combos since I worry about dropping the combo at Up Ball, but I guess I can just end it with Choke instead.

I'll try Ex Choke on wake up, too. I got a Noob player who likes to do Up Shadow when he's getting up, so here's to hoping I'll choke him through it.

 

[Gthunda866]

The choke is safe man, it is used to cancel unsafe strings I'm almost positive that it is safe and no one has ever punished me on it

 

[cyke_out]

Choke and horizontal ball are Kano's only true wake-up attack that gain invunerability. Up-ball doesn't have it, and with the added 2 frames of start up, it's less useful on wake up now. so using choke when an opponent is next to you on wake up is your best bet. horizantol ball is too unsafe for me.

 

[Circus]

Kano's best special move isn't upball, it isn't knives, it's Choke. Real talk.

It's the basis of his rushdown game. If more people actually understood how broken the move is in certain situations you'd understand too. Vs some characters Kano goes into situations where his risk level is 0 and the opponent enters a guessing game hoping to not get rejuggled. It's what makes Kano S tier. Not the upball, not the knives. It's his Oki game and frame traps with Choke.

I've already said too much.

Training mode more and you'll find out.

 

[HexaDecimus]

Yeah, I found a sparring partner to help me test out the mechanics on Choke. It has some pretty crazy behavior that you can't theorycraft, it's actually pretty wacky how this move lands sometimes.

I had no idea how many opportunities I've been missing to choke a bitch. My Kano game grows stronger.

 

[Mailorder]

I hit training mode to practice block string mixups with Choke and I'm not completely impressed. I understand that it'll beat people who try to jump out, but it still seems people can just block low the whole time and duck when Choke comes out. Anyone want to share specific block strings ending with Choke I need to be paying attention to?

 

[wolfe]

wish i knew what oki games are...havent been playing fighting games long enough.

 

[Sao87]

I hit training mode to practice block string mixups with Choke and I'm not completely impressed. I understand that it'll beat people who try to jump out, but it still seems people can just block low the whole time and duck when Choke comes out. Anyone want to share specific block strings ending with Choke I need to be paying attention to?

You typically end his block strings with a cr.1 -> choke if they've blocked the strings. This is because they will either jump or try something after the string. Another thing I like to do is back + 1 -> choke after 1 or 2 cr.3's because the back + 1 lunges him forward. You almost always want to end with some kind of choke or air throw because it sets you up for pressure opportunities on wakeup. Basically try to cover all of your offensive holes with some sort of poke into choke since it is safe.

 

[ETC AdmiralAugustus]

wish i knew what oki games are...havent been playing fighting games long enough.

I believe it's your ground game, I could be wrong.

 

[Sao87]

wish i knew what oki games are...havent been playing fighting games long enough.

Oki typically means knock down block pressure. By choking someone you are left at slight advantage when they wake up which means you may be able to go for a jumping attack, a low starting string, tick throws, whatever. I wouldn't really call Kano's choke setup for oki type play though because all of his pressure setups after a choke are susceptible to wake up moves.

Easiest example would be Gief in street fighter. He command throws you, he has the ability to cross you up safely which you have to block and then he can choose to go for lariat which beats your jump away attempt or another throw which both set him up for more of the same shenanigans.

 

[Massive Kano]

"Kano's best special move isn't upball, it isn't knives, it's Choke. Real talk."

If so, somebody who knows all about this subject should put together a nice video tutorial on the finer points of choking.

 

[Mailorder]

I've been dicking around with choke and I'm starting to understand it a bit more. As others have noted, it catches jumpers and has pretty good priority. By ending your block strings with Choke, you discourage your opponent from jumping or poking out. And with that, you're free to unleash your offense with standard high/low/throw. Kano's mix-up isn't the most intricate, but the opponent's fear of getting choked or balled is what makes him free to move when up close.

However, there's still the problem that you can crouch under Choke. My buddy has been beating it by mashing d+3 and it seems to be working. Sweeps seem too slow to punish crouch-whiffed chokes, unsure on d+2 uppercuts. We'll have to test it.

 

[Brahma]

What strings or setups are you guys using for choke? The one I use regularly us b+2,f+1 xx choke. Sometimes after b+112 I use d+1 xx choke as well to catch jumpers.

 

[D.Barrett]

Using the B+1,1,2 is your main block string obviously. After which you can choose to do D+1 xx Choke to stuff anything like jumping or counter attack if your opponent does not respect your pressure. But after getting the choke, or applying pressure with it. Once you convince your opponent to block and accept the frame trap. You have all you need to get in their head and remind them of B+1 into grab. Using that, will convince them that blocking the B+1,1,2...D+1xxchoke set up is too dangerous because of the chance of tick throws and other mixups like dash D+3 into grab or other devious tools at your disposal.

These mix ups are character dependent, as trying to cross up a good Kung lao would not be the most wise thing. Never the less, this pressure with B+1,1,2 into choke or B+1 into grab can really freak out an opponent and allow baiting to be much easier if you can get into their head. A blocked wake up can end in 33% damage and then push them back into a strong zoning game, character dependent of course. Or end the punish with choke and keep them where you want them. Whatever works toward the match up. I find applying this pressure to a shang player can make them feel hopeless in both zoning and up close rushdown. Just make the right reads and this style of rushdown/pressure can keep the match up in your favor.

Thats my take on choke, i hope i can show this strategy more at the THE GAMER'S EDGE stream on thursday. If i can get there before brackets get set up that is...

 

[Error]

All that up there may be true but the true purpose of choke is a finish him/her screen, choke>90% of the fatalities.

 

[TheChad_87]

Use it on your chicken ...

BAHAHAHAHA! [/immaturity]

Okay, seriously. I haven't found much use for it in combos other than B+2, F+1, *Choke (19%, 3 hits) or EN Choke (24%, 3 Hits) as a good overhead combo.
If I use B+1, 1, 2, I tend to go for B+1, 1, 2, dash, B+1, 1, 2, *Ball (31%, 7 Hits) or EN Ball (33%, 8 Hits)

It's AWESOME as a wake-up attack though since it has armor and will snuff out other attacks.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I've played Kano since launch, and I haven't figured out why he has Choke in his movelist. Keep in mind, I'm not talking shit here, I'm sure the reason is my own ignorance.

Just about the only thing I can think of is if I want to sacrifice 2%-ish damage at the end of a juggle with the benefit of having the foe in sweep distance afterwards. It's not really that safe on block and 9% damage just doesn't beat Up Ball.

I've played around with everything I can think of, and I just can't think why I shouldn't just use Up Ball instead, even after I've been playing around post-hotfix (which, to be honest, wasn't that bad of a nerf at all, I'm still knockin heads around to make sure all the giddy players thinking Kano is cake now don't get things twisted).

Any help would be appreciated.

I can tell you that use Kano exclusively and I never touch the Choke move except as a replacement for fatalities. A few people have noted that you can use it during blocked chains to make them safe. I haven't tried that out yet, but I can tell you I've been very successful with Kano and I never touch Choke. You'll also see people say it makes a good kombo-ender because it leaves your opponent at your feet and they can't roll, but if you ask me the recovery is just too slow. I'll have to try it out as a wakeup move, though. It sounds promising.

 

[ChopChop Ninja]

I hate getting caught out of the air by that shit.

 

[G4S KT]

Kano's best special move isn't upball, it isn't knives, it's Choke. Real talk.

It's the basis of his rushdown game. If more people actually understood how broken the move is in certain situations you'd understand too. Vs some characters Kano goes into situations where his risk level is 0 and the opponent enters a guessing game hoping to not get rejuggled. It's what makes Kano S tier. Not the upball, not the knives. It's his Oki game and frame traps with Choke.

I've already said too much.

Training mode more and you'll find out.

Sounds to me like choke stuffs a lot of wake ups.

 

[Sao87]

Sounds to me like choke stuffs a lot of wake ups.

Nope, D. Barrett spelled it out already. You do b 1, 1, 2 strings and if its blocked you get used to the timing with d+1 cancelled into choke. This is a frame trap that will stuff any form of hesitation. Once you've conditioned your opponent to hold the block a little bit longer you have the ability to do things like b+1 which moves Kano forward and then do a normal throw. You basically cover all of your combo attempts with pokes into command throws and annoy people with normal throws.

You should also be ending your combos with either air throw, choke or ex kano ball because Kano is at advantage to keep pressuring with things like b+2, 3/ j.p f3, 3 into combo/b1, 1, 2 into more frame traps. Basically mix it up. Get creative and cover all of your holes with poke xx choke and you will start to realize that Kano is more than just a zoning character that uses up ball when people get close.

 

[PANDEMlC]

Very informative stuff, I was only using it for style points.

 

[Deleted member 5032]

I won't be able to test this myself until Monday so I figured I would ask it here: Since Choke takes priority over most moves and can catch people out of the air could it theoretically be used to catch characters with jump attacks like Kung Lao, CSZ, or Sonya? For instance, if you see the Dive Kick coming would it be possible to throw out Choke and potentially catch Kung Lao out of his Dive Kick?

 

[Deleted member 5032]

Also, I've found the recovery on a connected Choke to be atrocious. When you successfully land Choke on your opponent what do you like to follow it up with?