MK9 top (?) list vs tier list

[Evil_Riu48]

top (?) lists
we been trying to agree in which are the top 5 or top 10 characters for this game for more than 9 months already and still today you ask 10 top players who they think are the top 5 or top 10 and you will get like 8 different lists if you are talking about top 5 and 10 different list if you are talking about top 10 lol.

but why can't we agree? could it be beacuse the different on the level of some of this characters it is not clear to see? and if we can not clearly see the different of the level between this characters could it be because it is a small different? and if there is only a small different how can we give a number to this characters and be sure that is the number the characters is to be place?

i think as a community we need to start talking more about tier list because even if we happen to agree with a top 5 or top 10 list ( which do not look like it will happen ) what about the rest of the cast? if it hard for us to agree and who are the top 5 how hard would it be for us to agree on who are the top 10 or top 15 . . . i think we are just wasting time with all this top whatever lists


really guys tier list is a much better ranking system for so many reasons and we should start talking more about it

 

[Evil_Riu48]

the question is how many tier there should be for this game? i personally think there should be 4 and at the most 5

 

[NKZero]

top (?) lists
we been trying to agree in which are the top 5 or top 10 characters for this game for more than 9 months already and still today you ask 10 top players who they think are the top 5 or top 10 and you will get like 8 different lists if you are talking about top 5 and 10 different list if you are talking about top 10 lol.

but why can't we agree? could it be beacuse the different on the level of some of this characters it is not clear to see? and if we can not clearly see the different of the level between this characters could it be because it is a small different? and if there is only a small different how can we give a number to this characters and be sure that is the number the characters is to be place?

i think as a community we need to start talking more about tier list because even if we happen to agree with a top 5 or top 10 list ( which do not look like it will happen ) what about the rest of the cast? if it hard for us to agree and who are the top 5 how hard would it be for us to agree on who are the top 10 or top 15 . . . i think we are just wasting time with all this top whatever lists


really guys tier list is a much better ranking system for so many reasons and we should start talking more about it

The best ways to rank characters are simple. Do a match-up chart (which itself will be a problem). Tally up the score for each character and see who has the highest. The numbers as you stated is what is holding us back. We don't have appropriate numbers and I still maintain we don't have enough match-up experience. Community is still too small to say this match-up is 100% this or that. I mean who the hell knows the Jade-Kano match-up?

Anyways I tried doing something like this for fun and this is the top 10 I got with their match-up scores listed:
1. Kabal (175)
2. Sonya (173)
3. Kenshi/Raiden (168)
5. Kung Lao (167)
6. Johnny Cage/Smoke (164)
8. Freddy/Kitana (161)
10. Any of the following: Jax/Cyrax/Sektor/Reptile (156)

 

[crosstalk]

I think we've pretty much figured out who's top 10 and bottom 10 in the current state of the game. It's the middle of the tier list that we haven't really discussed. The most recent tier list was the official EVO one by REO, and I think most people agreed with it.

 

[NKZero]

the question is how many tier there should be for this game? i personally think there should be 4 and at the most 5

if we are doing group tiers then I see it like this: S+, S, A+, A, B, C, D (maybe excluding D)

 

[Enenra]

Its pretty obvious who the top 10 are, and those are really the only characters that matter. I say fuck it, tier lists just make people butthurt anyways.

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

The best ways to rank characters are simple. Do a match-up chart (which itself will be a problem). Tally up the score for each character and see who has the highest. The numbers as you stated is what is holding us back. We don't have appropriate numbers and I still maintain we don't have enough match-up experience. Community is still too small to say this match-up is 100% this or that. I mean who the hell knows the Jade-Kano match-up?

Anyways I tried doing something like this for fun and this is the top 10 I got with their match-up scores listed:
1. Kabal (175)
2. Sonya (173)
3. Kenshi/Raiden (168)
5. Kung Lao (167)
6. Johnny Cage/Smoke (164)
8. Freddy/Kitana (161)
10. Any of the following: Jax/Cyrax/Sektor/Reptile (156)

I want/think this would be the best choice, too.
But as you said, there are too many unfamiliar/rarely-apparent matchups and not enough people to know them well.

 

[Purple Haze]

This site is like Groundhog Day.

 

[Death]

5 is good and 1 of them only has Kabal in it.

I think 99% of the community agrees with Kabal/Kenshi/Sonya being top 3. Some put Kitana/Jax in there while others put KL/Freddy etc. But top 3 seems to be what the majority of people think.

 

[xSMoKEx]

S:
A:
B:
C:

Kano and Kabal imo do not need their own tier, just place them at the back / front of the list to indicate they are the best in that tier.

 

[xSMoKEx]

5 is good and 1 of them only has Kabal in it.

Regarding the end of my post, i don't think ^^^^ this is completely unreasonable but i just feel like it is misguiding and people get this thought that he is unbeatable / completely broken. Yeah he's damn good, number one, but to put him in a completely other level than the others seems like a bit of a stretch to me. That's just my opinion though, a S+ Tier for Kabal is no biggie.

 

[Death]

Regarding the end of my post, i don't think ^^^^ this is completely unreasonable but i just feel like it is misguiding and people get this thought that he is unbeatable / completely broken. Yeah he's damn good, number one, but to put him in a completely other level than the others seems like a bit of a stretch to me. That's just my opinion though, a S+ Tier for Kabal is no biggie.

S - Kabal
A -
B -
C -
D -

Something along those lines is reasonable imo. Similar to what you posted.

 

[SunnyD]

Just make an approximate tier list.

S Tier
A Tier
B Tier

and so on and so forth. Less arguing, more consensus, still pins which characters are better than which....win win eh?

 

[IKizzLE]

Here we go again...and since im bored at work.
In no order:

S-Kabal
A-Sonya, Kenshi, Freddy, Cage, Smoke, Skarlett, Kitana, KL, Cyrax, Sektor, Reptile, Jax, Shang, Raiden
B-SubZero, Ermac, Rain, Mileena, Cyber, Sindel, Lui Kang, Quan Chi,
C-Scorpion, Noob, Jade, Nightwolf
D-Sheeva, Baraka, Kano, Stryker

Moral of the story...a lot of good characters....main your favorite and level yourself up.

 

[Tom Brady]

S+
Kabal, Kenshi

S
Sonya, Smoke, Freddy, JAX

A+
Kitana, Sektor, Shang Tsung, Cage, Cyrax, Kung Lao, Raiden, Reptile, Mileena, Ermac

A-
Quan Chi

A
Liu Kang, Rain, Skarlet

B
Sub Zero, CSZ, Nightwolf, Sindel, Stryker

C
Kano, Noob Saibot, Scorpion, Sheeva, Baraka, Jade

IMO, this is the most accurate tier list so far. very hard to argue with. the biggest problem is that you have ppl that play certain characters like smoke, jax, freddy, etc who refuse to admit that they play a character in the top 5-8. Its like they feel like its an insult to say you win with a top character.

 

[Death]

Here we go again...and since im bored at work.
In no order:

S-Kabal
A-Sonya, Kenshi, Freddy, Cage, Smoke, Skarlett, Kitana, KL, Cyrax, Sektor, Reptile, Jax, Shang, Raiden
B-SubZero, Ermac, Rain, Mileena, Cyber, Sindel, Lui Kang, Quan Chi,
C-Scorpion, Noob, Jade, Nightwolf
D-Sheeva, Baraka, Kano, Stryker

Moral of the story...a lot of good characters....main your favorite and level yourself up.

Pretty accurate. Id probably put Shang and Raiden in B. Switch out Scorpion for Stryker. Stryker is ALOT better than scorpion.

 

[XXFleshtrapXX]

I'd say we just need to stop arguing over a characters placement in the tiers. It's like, I honestly don't believe Baraka is bottom 5. But I'm not delusional either....he is obviously bottom tier.

We should just except S-high-mid-low tiers and not aruge over a characters placement in those tiers. IMHO.

 

[REO]

-

Tom, I would appreciate it if you would stop going around and calling this the " CD jr and REO v1.05 patch" and saying we only win because NRS leaves our super characters and nerfs yours to other players behind our backs. We would body your Sub-Zero in the first patch (or any other) just like we do now.

Thank you.

 

[Death]

S+ - Kabal
S - Kenshi, Sonya, KL, Freddy, Cage, Jax
A+ - Kitana, Smoke, Skarlet, Sektor, Reptile, Cyrax
A- Raiden, Rain, Sub-Zero, Liu Kang, Shang, Ermac, Mileena, Quan Chi
B - Sindel, CSZ, Stryker, NW, Jade, Noob
C - Scorpion, Baraka, Kano, Sheeva

This is my opinion on the tier list. I really look around and ask people what they think. I think its really accurate. Alot of people think Jax should be higher but I dont think he is. Raiden is overrated as well imo. I dont know. Id like some feedback on my personal tier list. Kenshi is good but not Kabal good.

 

[crosstalk]

S - Kabal
A+ - Kenshi, Sonya, KL, Freddy, Cage
A - Jax, Kitana, Smoke, Skarlet, Sektor, Reptile, Cyrax
B- Raiden, Rain, Sub-Zero, Liu Kang, Shang, Ermac, Mileena
C - Sindel, Quan Chi, CSZ, Stryker, NW, Jade
D - Noob, Scorpion, Baraka, Kano, Sheeva

This is my opinion on the tier list. I really look around and ask people what they think. I think its really accurate. Alot of people think Jax should be higher but I dont think he is. Raiden is overrated as well imo. I dont know. Id like some feedback on my personal tier list. Kenshi is good but not Kabal good.

Pretty good, I agree with most of it. I would switch Skarlet with Cyrax, or possibly even move her down to A tier. She may move up higher when the character is played well in tournaments. I'd move Quan up to B tier as well. I'm not sure how I feel about KL yet either... I'd maybe put him at the bottom of S or top of A+.

 

[Death]

Pretty good, I agree with most of it. I would switch Skarlet with Cyrax, or possibly even move her down to A tier. She may move up higher when the character is played well in tournaments. I'd move Quan up to A tier as well. I'm not sure how I feel about KL yet either... I'd maybe put him at the bottom of S or top of A+.

I actually moved Quan up to B beside Mileena. I did this off the top of my head but i looked my word and saw I messed it up. But I have her in B. In my list i think the S, A+, A are the popular tournament characters you see other than Skarlet but Skarlet clearly has the tools to be in there. B is filled with a couple overrated characters like Raiden, Mileena, Ermac and underrates ones like Quan Chi, Sub, Ermac. For the most part I think C and D in my chart will be the most agreed upon. I also messed up the Noob placement. I meant to have him in C rather than D.

 

[Tom Brady]

Tom, I would appreciate it if you would stop going around and calling this the " @CD jr and @REO " patch to others behind our backs. We would body your Sub-Zero in the first patch (or any other) just like we do now.
.

i dont call it the "reo and cd jr patch". there are ppl who's characters benefit from the patches and that is a fact. in no way did i ever insult you or CDjr. if kabal didnt benefit from the dash nerf then i am mistaken in thinking the patch helped the character. if jax didnt benefit from his almost 10 buffs then i am mistaken in thinking the patch helped him. if sonya getting armor on start up of her ex cartwheel now then i am mistaken in thinking a patch benefited her... etc etc...

no one but cd jr has done what he has done with jax. there are many kabals that are a pain in the ass but none of have done what you have done with the character. character facts about the characters should never be taken as a player insult.

 

[NKZero]

S: Kabal
A+: Sonya, Kenshi, Kung Lao, Raiden, Johnny Cage, Smoke
A: Freddy, Kitana, Cyrax, Jax, Reptile, Sektor, Skarlet
B: Mileena, Rain, Sub Zero, Ermac, Liu Kang, Shang Tsung, Quan Chi
C: Noob, Sindel, Cyber Sub Zero, Nightwolf
D: Baraka, Kano, Scorpion, Stryker, Jade, Sheeva

 

[crosstalk]

I actually moved Quan up to B beside Mileena. I did this off the top of my head but i looked my word and saw I messed it up. But I have her in B. In my list i think the S, A+, A are the popular tournament characters you see other than Skarlet but Skarlet clearly has the tools to be in there. B is filled with a couple overrated characters like Raiden, Mileena, Ermac and underrates ones like Quan Chi, Sub, Ermac. For the most part I think C and D in my chart will be the most agreed upon. I also messed up the Noob placement. I meant to have him in C rather than D.

I definitely think Skarlet has the tools, but I think people are being too impatient and not waiting for actual results. It's like in SSF4, where people thought Dudley was going to be a top tier character due to what people thought he had, and a couple of months into the game, he was pretty much bottom 10. I believe we just need to wait until we see good Skarlet play in tournament.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Baraka really needs some more people to rep him, he is bottom 10 but in no way bottom five.