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Do you think there's enough punishment on block in the game?

Do you think there's enough punishment on block in the game?

  • Yes

    Votes: 12 30.0%

  • No

    Votes: 28 70.0%
  • Total voters
    40
Gaxkang

Gaxkang

Banned
That is to say, when you block stuff whether do you feel you can do something enough? Do more than puny damage, if you are able to do something? Or just be able to create space? Are people taking enough risks when they do something and it's blocked?

I myself think it's a mess and holds the game back. It might or might not work out better in offline PVP, but online fights...ouch. It can feel like a festival of being safe or plus, and offense being king. And punishing a poke...doubtful. And if you can punish something it's usually gonna be a D1 which may mean...that's it. You may end up going for throws too much really because that's all you may be able to do or feel you can do. Only the most unsafe of unsafe stuff will truly get tagged and even that sometimes might buckle.

I feel like it's just missing punishing and there's this empty space in the game.
 
CrimsonShadow

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Without tons of 50/50s, insane pressure, and crossups, making everything super punishable on block would be absolutely disastrous to the meta.

MK11 already favors strong defense and is very block-heavy and encourages patience. Making things super unsafe would further emphasize throws, a super-slow pace of gameplay and a turtling meta.
 
craftycheese

craftycheese

I tried to throw a yo-yo away. It was impossible.
I think people, including myself, don't do enough research and practice on how to properly punish stuff and then complain that you can't properly punish anything.

I know that I've seen videos on how to punish x Ray's since the game has come out and some other videos/tym thread/tweet/discord comment on how to counter certain characters, but I never practice it and I never punish correctly because it has never become a part of my muscle memory. That's not on the game, THAT'S ON ME.
 
Gaxkang

Gaxkang

Banned
CrimsonShadow said:
Without tons of 50/50s, insane pressure, and crossups, making everything super punishable on block would be absolutely disastrous to the meta.

MK11 already favors strong defense and is very block-heavy and encourages patience. Making things super unsafe would further emphasize throws, a super-slow pace of gameplay and a turtling meta.
Click to expand...
The 50/50's present powerfully effective enough, and the existing pressure sure seems dominant...and I guess increases online.

If you block something and can do nothing but if you get hit you take major damage...that seems like a prob.

Other day I was fighting a Raiden and I blocked his D1 so I hit mine but whatever he mashed out went right thru and clobbered me. And I was right in his face. I've even had like a Kano be able to hit poke after I blocked a kanoball.
One can chalk this up to just the online...but the online is a major part of the game.

But if you do hit that D1...eh, you might get a throw, or get D2'd into a combo. The "jailing" stuff it's miracle if you get that.

Imagine if you could punish something with simply an S1 or S2 string, period. Or if D1 simply comboed and easily into something. Since D1 or D3 has to feature so much.

The punishing needs some tweaking.
 
haketh

haketh

Champion
Gaxkang said:
The 50/50's present powerfully effective enough, and the existing pressure sure seems dominant...and I guess increases online.

If you block something and can do nothing but if you get hit you take major damage...that seems like a prob.

Other day I was fighting a Raiden and I blocked his D1 so I hit mine but whatever he mashed out went right thru and clobbered me. And I was right in his face. I've even had like a Kano be able to hit poke after I blocked a kanoball.
One can chalk this up to just the online...but the online is a major part of the game.

But if you do hit that D1...eh, you might get a throw, or get D2'd into a combo. The "jailing" stuff it's miracle if you get that.

Imagine if you could punish something with simply an S1 or S2 string, period. Or if D1 simply comboed and easily into something. Since D1 or D3 has to feature so much.

The punishing needs some tweaking.
Click to expand...
NO this just sounds like you need to tighten up your punishes & how to take your turn more than anything & be realistic about what you can hit online if the connections bad.
 
NaughtySenpai

NaughtySenpai

Kombatant
Yeah there's enough shit you can flawless block and make unsafe or shit with gaps in it. where you can gamble for a s1 interruption. There's just a couple of characters that can murder your for trying to exploit their gaps because most of their other shit is safe af like Jacqui or guys like Johnny that are safe or + on everything with no flawless block gaps to speak of.

Also if you can d1, you can s1 for a full combo. On the rare occasion that doesn't work, you can reversal throw for a guaranteed punish like Kano's f4 (i think it is. that dumb roll forward).
 
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Arqwart

Arqwart

D'Vorah for KP2 copium
For most characters, yes. For other characters (Geras, Cetrion, Liu, Kabal, Cassie, etc.), no.

However, there's a LOT of things that sacrifice one's turn while not being punishable. This results in an interested stagger mind game that I enjoy. I would definitely like to see more turn-losing mind games on the characters listed above though.
 
BRAZILIAN SHEEP

BRAZILIAN SHEEP

Apprentice
These man saying "you should practice more"....dude, only in mk11 you have to practice how to punish a random shit in your face like errons big boot and frosts dive bomb. This is mk11 classic: Who presses shit presses shit, who defends needs to practice how to defend the shit.

This is inexcusable.

Is too much reward for pressing BS without thinking and who is trying to play neutral, do anti air and pusinh mistakes is fucked.

I heard killerxinok here in BR saying that "He should practice more and pick up another character to beat x character"...I mean, this is everything you should kniw about the game. If the solution for your problems is "pick another char", the game is unbalanced. Is not you who should practice....holy shit.
 
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Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
The only thing I have a problem with are Fatal Blows. There should be much less push back and more minus.
 
Gaxkang

Gaxkang

Banned
CrimsonShadow said:
Right, flawless block literally makes a million things punishable.

I don’t get this thread.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure the total fights I've on done online, it's gotta be at least 1500 by now, and I still don't think I ever saw someone flawless block things I did.

Myself, I found flawless blocking in the tutorial to be touchy for sure...going online I'd feel really wary about letting go of block while blocking stuff. People can give it their best shot tho, of course.
I think you need at least 2 hits from someone to realistically flawless block, which means someone will feel conditioned to expect full strings. Some attackers will just tap one hit, then throw....and the conditioned person will get thrown.

And I don't think folks will be flawless blocking D1's or D3's.
 
CrimsonShadow

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Gaxkang said:
I'm not sure the total fights I've on done online, it's gotta be at least 1500 by now, and I still don't think I ever saw someone flawless block things I did.

Myself, I found flawless blocking in the tutorial to be touchy for sure...going online I'd feel really wary about letting go of block while blocking stuff. People can give it their best shot tho, of course.
I think you need at least 2 hits from someone to realistically flawless block, which means someone will feel conditioned to expect full strings. Some attackers will just tap one hit, then throw....and the conditioned person will get thrown.

And I don't think folks will be flawless blocking D1's or D3's.
Click to expand...
Then you aren’t playing against very good players. I have had plenty of counterpokes, etc flawless blocked along with the multi-hit strings.
 
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Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Gaxkang said:
I'm not sure the total fights I've on done online, it's gotta be at least 1500 by now, and I still don't think I ever saw someone flawless block things I did.

Myself, I found flawless blocking in the tutorial to be touchy for sure...going online I'd feel really wary about letting go of block while blocking stuff. People can give it their best shot tho, of course.
I think you need at least 2 hits from someone to realistically flawless block, which means someone will feel conditioned to expect full strings. Some attackers will just tap one hit, then throw....and the conditioned person will get thrown.

And I don't think folks will be flawless blocking D1's or D3's.
Click to expand...
D1/d3s have been flawless blocked into full combo punishes since June. This is why just playing online leaves you vastly unaware of how much a game has been explored.
 
Braindead

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
Gaxkang said:
I'm not sure the total fights I've on done online, it's gotta be at least 1500 by now, and I still don't think I ever saw someone flawless block things I did.

Myself, I found flawless blocking in the tutorial to be touchy for sure...going online I'd feel really wary about letting go of block while blocking stuff. People can give it their best shot tho, of course.
I think you need at least 2 hits from someone to realistically flawless block, which means someone will feel conditioned to expect full strings. Some attackers will just tap one hit, then throw....and the conditioned person will get thrown.

And I don't think folks will be flawless blocking D1's or D3's.
Click to expand...
Lol flawless blocking pokes is like month 2 meta
 
Wigy

Wigy

There it is...
There is a lot of moves that are very jank to punish.

Chop chop, Kano ball etc.

Sub zeros slide springs to mind, depending on how far away he does it you can or cannot do certain strings to punish. I've had mid strings just whiff for no reason after blocking it.

I'm probably trash but just think SOME moves should be a 100% of the time easy punish with any string.

I'd prefer if there was a more uniform blockstun after punishable moves, not some where you have to hit the instant you block and others you're sat blocking for ages.
 
NaughtySenpai

NaughtySenpai

Kombatant
Just gotta condition yourself to punish shit like Sub Zeros slide, dragon kick or basically everything Shao Kahn does with s4 into special cancel instead of s1. Thing with punishes is that some of them are pretty tight and you can't really buffer them so you gotta take a while in practice mode, then play a lotta sets against that character to really get it down.

I mean unless you're trying to get option selects down for offense, there's not much reason to hit practice mode for offense in this game, since combos are that easy. If defense wasn't as difficult as it is, you'd have no reason to hit the lab at all.
 
Z

Zer0_h0ur

XBL tag: South of Zero
CrimsonShadow said:
Right, flawless block literally makes a million things punishable.

I don’t get this thread.
Click to expand...
On this note, I'd honestly like to see FB affect frame data of more, bc I don't think it really is a million diff things.
When I'm labbing an enemy I see strings I can FB but to no frame advantage whatsoever. Plenty of times. If they're gonna have this mechanic, have it actually affect more things imo.
 
Ck AeroVoid

Ck AeroVoid

Mk Casual, KI God
Am I The only one who Flawless blocks on random than on purpose?
Normal block IMO should back you up a little bit more on harder/more damaging hits
 
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