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Sajam talks about people defending companies

santanabar

santanabar

Apprentice
Jynks said:
I like how every point on that thumbnail is something MK11 is best in industry at : )
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You are right, Mk11 does well in many aspects. He is more a SF guy, so is natural he focuses on things SF lacks.

MK has a lot of problems other games (fighting games) already solved:
  • Hitboxes (after 5 months, unacceptable)
  • Cannot queue for a game in practice mode (in 2019)
  • No filters (ping, region, connection type)
  • Loading screen after rematch
  • Mute button (I know you can create a party, that's not the point)
And let's not compare it with other genres:
  • Good replay system
  • In-game spectator mode (with chat)
  • Ability to follow players and get notifications to watch them play
  • Some kind of interaction with big events (like battle pass)
And yes, compared to other games, Mk11 netcode is good. Still, it can be so much better.
 
CrimsonShadow

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
He's not talking about people who "demand improvements", he's talking about games that fundamentally don't have basic stuff in 2019 like a decent netcode.

People saying the developer sucks or the game is going to die because their character isn't good enough or their fireball whiffs on [insert crouching character here] actually is whining. Like Jynks said, MK11 is always pretty far ahead in all of the areas he's speaking of.

He actually uses NRS as being the best example of a developer caring about their users at 6 and a half minutes in:


So don't use him complaining about people who are literally are having trouble just playing matches, to justify having a terrible attitude and not knowing how to write constructive criticism.
 
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santanabar

santanabar

Apprentice
CrimsonShadow said:
He's not talking about people who "demand improvements", he's talking about games that fundamentally don't have basic stuff in 2019 like a decent netcode.

People saying the developer sucks or the game is going to die because their character isn't good enough or their fireball whiffs on [insert character here] actually is whining. Like Jynks said, MK11 is always pretty far ahead in all of these areas.

He actually uses NRS as being the best example of a developer caring about their users at 6 and a half minutes in:


So don't use him complaining about people who are literally are having trouble just playing matches, to justify having a terrible attitude and not knowing how to write constructive criticism.
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Are you serious dude? Attacks whiffing on certain characters is completely unacceptable. Imagine if Lion stun whiffs on only one character. Dota community will demand instant fix. Or in CS:GO, certain weapons not working properly depending on the skin your enemy has. We have been dealing with this shlt for 8 years and you say it's whining?

I believe you missed the point of the video, he plays a lot more SF, so that's why he mentioned more issues related to it. But he even mentioned Mk11 not having queue in practice mode (something we have been asking for years).
 
NRF CharlieMurphy

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
santanabar said:
Are you serious dude? Attacks whiffing on certain characters is completely unacceptable. Imagine if Lion stun whiffs on only one character. Dota community will demand instant fix. Or in CS:GO, certain weapons not working properly depending on the skin your enemy has. We have been dealing with this shlt for 8 years and you say it's whining?

I believe you missed the point of the video, he plays a lot more SF, so that's why he mentioned more issues related to it. But he even mentioned Mk11 not having queue in practice mode (something we have been asking for years).
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Crimson clearly hasn't played other fighting games that are basically light years ahead of MK in every single thing MK does except its netcode.
 
T

trufenix

bye felicia
Qwark28 said:
Literally any game from which NRS half assedly took mechanics from from MKX and on. They bastardised KOF rolls, GG's IB mechanic, copy-pasted their own run mechanic from a 20 year old game without accounting them having to balance the game around it, etc.
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Weird, people must prefer games with half-assed mechanics then cause all those games are dead.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Marinjuana said:
Shitty opinion tbh

The hyper negativity doesn't do much for me
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It's not hyper negativity. Maybe play those games and you'll see why each of them is badly implemented. Unless you weren't around for MKX, where it took them until the near end of the game to fix run as a low risk mechanic.

Or GG, where instant blocking allows for a ton of different design choices and adds a shitton more options if you're good at it, in comparison to NRS using it as a replacement for armour.
trufenix said:
Weird, people must prefer games with half-assed mechanics then cause all those games are dead.
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Weird, because I recall seeing GG in more EVOs than NRS has years as a company. It's normal that you're confused, it took XRD 5 EVOs to not be a main game anymore, so 3 NRS titles?

Same for KOF. And both these franchises have a longer and better competitive history than 2 year NRS products.

You guys should accept differing opinions when it comes to game comparisons, especially when you haven't played those games and are embarassing yourselves by taking it personally.
 
B

bumpyface

Mortal
There are some things that should be included in a fighter released this gen and he hit on em pretty well. Bad online to me is inexcusable in 2019 but I can understand where some devs may run into problems given a limited budget. It makes me think about MVCI. MVCI had descent online but a lot of people complained about cosmetics like UI, character models and such. I wonder how well MVCI would of been received if Capcom put more into visuals and audio, and less in online?
 
T

trufenix

bye felicia
Qwark28 said:
Weird, because I recall seeing GG in more EVOs than NRS has years as a company. It's normal that you're confused, it took XRD 5 EVOs to not be a main game anymore, so 3 NRS titles?

Same for KOF. And both these franchises have a longer and better competitive history than 2 year NRS products.
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Maybe you're the confused one, is ANY competitive community playing Xrd right now? No? Not even with its far superior mechanics and competitive history? How about KoF? No? well certainly there must have been less players at EVO this year than ever before, with so many inferior games on display, right?

You guys should accept differing opinions when it comes to game comparisons, especially when you haven't played those games and are embarassing yourselves by taking it personally.
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There's no opinions in my post. Just facts. You say MK11 has half-assed equivalencies of old mechanics from real games, but thats the game all those OGs are playing. Nobody's hosting tournaments for GG or KoF anywhere right now. They're playing MK11 or SF5 or Tekken 7 or Smash or Chess. Not Xrd.
 
Jynks

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
CrimsonShadow said:
He actually uses NRS as being the best example of a developer caring about their users at 6 and a half minutes in:
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6:16 NRS Praise

Hahah... I love how he basically calls out evey company for not being as awesome as NRS but still some douchbag is using his video to bad mouth NRS.. I mean he liturally used NRS as an example of what the industry should be,.... people are so bias and full of shit.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
trufenix said:
Maybe you're the confused one, is ANY competitive community playing Xrd right now? No? Not even with its far superior mechanics and competitive history? How about KoF? No? well certainly there must have been less players at EVO this year than ever before, with so many inferior games on display, right?



There's no opinions in my post. Just facts. You say MK11 has half-assed equivalencies of old mechanics from real games, but thats the game all those OGs are playing. Nobody's hosting tournaments for GG or KoF anywhere right now. They're playing MK11 or SF5 or Tekken 7 or Smash or Chess. Not Xrd.
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You're legit clueless. Tons of people having been playing GG for decades, Japan even more so. Same with KOF, except replace Japan with China.

Maybe you should check literally any major tournament, you're so out of touch it's not even amusing anymore. And popularity doesn't make those mechanics any less half assed btw. "Hey, where's that 5 year old game's entrants now compared to the new blockbuster release from 3 months ago?". Where's MK9/X/IGAU1/2 now? Right.

You legitimately have to either be trolling or embarassingly free of awareness to say that the games people play now are because they're better. Tekken, where 7 is the first actually good game in the series since TTT1, SFV being SFV, DBFZ being dropped faster than a methed out hooker, one smash game that had half of their community outraged for being at EVO over the other, etc.
 
Jynks

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
santanabar said:
]Hitboxes (after 5 months, unacceptable)
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I'm actually on board with this. .. minus the "unacceptable" privilege bs... but while the HitBoxes in MK11 and NRS in general are mainly working and working very well, I do think that a revision to how hitboxes work might be good for the company and its games.

NRS using a mesh based collision system. I think it is a relic from MK9 and the engine physics system itself. I would like to see NRS switch to a 2d Hitbox overlay system like SF uses. You know like floating 2dBoxes instead of using the mesh itself. I understand this would basically drawing board the entire game engine as is such a massive change... but mesh based collision seems pretty far from the best option at this time. I guess eventually it will become the standard, so maybe they are looking to the future, there are a lot of positives about it.. but I still like the control of the 2d box system.

Everyone should remember though, that ALL games, including 2D HitBox games have HitBox issues.

santanabar said:
And yes, compared to other games, Mk11 netcode is good. Still, it can be so much better.
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yeah.. being literally the best netcode in the entire industry is so sucky!! Damn NRS suck!!

As a actual programmer in the game industry I always love how kids assume the impossible is possible. It is like people just assuming we can land on mars as no big deal. It is a SUPER big deal.
 
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NRF CharlieMurphy

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
Marinjuana said:
Like what?
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Does this mean you actually haven't played another fighting game as well?

Just go into SF. turn on the hitboxes.

This alone is enough.

NRS does a great job of fan service and a bad job of having mechanically working games.

Why do you think since MK9 (first year with this engine) that they refuse to show us the hit/hurt boxes in the game?

Instead we get The Joker in an MK game.

NRS has probalby the 2nd best Netcode for a FG. They are still SO FAR behind Killer Instinct in that regard.
 
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