Miasmata123
Noob
I think Jade is a solid character who requires very few adjustments. In fact, I would hesitate to buff this character much as in some match ups she is simply oppressive. I don't think she's OP, nor do I think she's weak. I think she is solidly mid tier. This is for ED Jade. I think Jaded needs some work but that's for another topic.
I want to make this post in response to a lot of the complaints I see around here. (There are a lot of complaints)
My major goal is for everyone to recognize that sometimes flaws in a character are deliberate balancing points. No character should have amazing zoning and 400 midscreen damage off mix ups. Nerf Sonya.
Jade is one of the premier zoners in the game, and she has the special quality of nullifying attempts to counter zone with Glow. She has incredible pokes and her neutral is some of the best.
As a character I think she was incredibly well designed and though she has flaws, many of these are warranted.
Here are her strengths:
Glow: It is not hard to activate on knockdown or on reaction. It nullifies enemy zoning.
Air glaive: a great projectile with tricky pathing. Controls a huge amount of the screen at midscreen.
Edenian Spark is a low projectile with knockdown
Best d4 in the game
Best d2 in the game
Amazing space control
b2 and 12 are some of the farthest reaching normals, and her shadow kick makes enemies hesitate as they approach
Probably the best anti air conversions in the game with s2 ex glaive, or even just d2 if your lazy. A lot of options here.
Solid frame data and extraordinarily safe. Even moves like f21 or b2 look punishable on paper but are impossible or very hard for most characters to punish when spaced properly.
B3434-a staggerable string off an 11f mid that ends in a + on block. Having this string is crazy, most staggerable strings are very unsafe at some points with things like -13 block advantage, having a high ender or a 10f+ gap. Meanwhile, most + on block strings start with highs or slow (14+f) mids.
This is an actual pressure string for a zoner who cannot be zoned off an 11f mid. That's pretty damn good.
As a note before people start bringing it up, every + on block string has a flawless block gap. It is the norm.
Very few bad match ups. Outside of Scorpion, Frost, and maybe Liu Kang, I personally don't think Jade has many losing match ups.
No flawless block gaps outside of her b3434. I may be wrong on this so feel free to correct me.
Edit: I stand corrected. F21 and b12 are also flawless blockable. This really makes them poor tools even beyond f21s slow start up and b12s hugely negative block advantage.
Solid Fatal Blow and easily canceled into off most of her strings.
Amazing corner carry with Deadly Butterfly and Shadow Kick. Enhanced Kick is a potential mix up and switches sides.
Great mobility with Air Glaive momentum canceling, Shadow Kick, f4. One of the fastest walk speeds in the game.
Now for her flaws, and why I think those flaws are important for balance:
(Note I see these complaints often, so this isn't directed at any one person)
No safe specials to cancel into. This isnt a problem, and seems like a deliberate balancing point-
First, Jade is safe off of almost all of her strings and has few flawless block gaps so she has no need to cancel into a safe special.
Second, Jade already has some of the best pokes in the game. Being able to cancel from a poke to a safe special is very popular right now because it forces the opponent to hesitate before counterpoking. (As in Cetrion d1 rock wall).
A safe special would turn a blocked d4 or b2 into a safe mix up, and sounds a little excessive to me considering how good these tools are and their range. Also, with how good her b3434 is having a potentially safe mix up off b343xxbutterfly for people flawless blocking also sounds like a bit much. She can still do it, but it requires some risk.
No launcher outside f21 and her Krushing Blows-honestly, seeing how much chip and poke damage Jade does, an actual launcher would be too much. For a character that essentially cant be zoned and has powerful keep away, facing big damage combos would be a little much.
Krushing Blows requirements-Kitana Prime managed to land Shadow Kick KB a number of times. Her uppercut KB is almost guaranteed just because her d2 is so good. Jade also has a launching throw KB, which is fairly unique. She seems pretty average in this regard.
Low damage-Jade's combo damage and anti air damage is actually decent. She may not have a solid launcher, but she does have solid poke damage. I could see some slight damage buffs being reasonable, but I mean like 1-2% on some hits, not extra combos.
Mix ups-Jade is actually among the few with a real mix up off b12/b1 edenian spark. Is it good? No. But mix ups and strong zoning should only be reserved for Sonya (nerf Sonya pls). Also, we're not all pros. Failing to react to a f21/124 mix up is bound to happen.
I already wrote way too much. I just hope going forward we can be more productive and consider whether Jade's flaws are inherent problems with the character or are there for a reason.
I want to make this post in response to a lot of the complaints I see around here. (There are a lot of complaints)
My major goal is for everyone to recognize that sometimes flaws in a character are deliberate balancing points. No character should have amazing zoning and 400 midscreen damage off mix ups. Nerf Sonya.
Jade is one of the premier zoners in the game, and she has the special quality of nullifying attempts to counter zone with Glow. She has incredible pokes and her neutral is some of the best.
As a character I think she was incredibly well designed and though she has flaws, many of these are warranted.
Here are her strengths:
Glow: It is not hard to activate on knockdown or on reaction. It nullifies enemy zoning.
Air glaive: a great projectile with tricky pathing. Controls a huge amount of the screen at midscreen.
Edenian Spark is a low projectile with knockdown
Best d4 in the game
Best d2 in the game
Amazing space control
b2 and 12 are some of the farthest reaching normals, and her shadow kick makes enemies hesitate as they approach
Probably the best anti air conversions in the game with s2 ex glaive, or even just d2 if your lazy. A lot of options here.
Solid frame data and extraordinarily safe. Even moves like f21 or b2 look punishable on paper but are impossible or very hard for most characters to punish when spaced properly.
B3434-a staggerable string off an 11f mid that ends in a + on block. Having this string is crazy, most staggerable strings are very unsafe at some points with things like -13 block advantage, having a high ender or a 10f+ gap. Meanwhile, most + on block strings start with highs or slow (14+f) mids.
This is an actual pressure string for a zoner who cannot be zoned off an 11f mid. That's pretty damn good.
As a note before people start bringing it up, every + on block string has a flawless block gap. It is the norm.
Very few bad match ups. Outside of Scorpion, Frost, and maybe Liu Kang, I personally don't think Jade has many losing match ups.
No flawless block gaps outside of her b3434. I may be wrong on this so feel free to correct me.
Edit: I stand corrected. F21 and b12 are also flawless blockable. This really makes them poor tools even beyond f21s slow start up and b12s hugely negative block advantage.
Solid Fatal Blow and easily canceled into off most of her strings.
Amazing corner carry with Deadly Butterfly and Shadow Kick. Enhanced Kick is a potential mix up and switches sides.
Great mobility with Air Glaive momentum canceling, Shadow Kick, f4. One of the fastest walk speeds in the game.
Now for her flaws, and why I think those flaws are important for balance:
(Note I see these complaints often, so this isn't directed at any one person)
No safe specials to cancel into. This isnt a problem, and seems like a deliberate balancing point-
First, Jade is safe off of almost all of her strings and has few flawless block gaps so she has no need to cancel into a safe special.
Second, Jade already has some of the best pokes in the game. Being able to cancel from a poke to a safe special is very popular right now because it forces the opponent to hesitate before counterpoking. (As in Cetrion d1 rock wall).
A safe special would turn a blocked d4 or b2 into a safe mix up, and sounds a little excessive to me considering how good these tools are and their range. Also, with how good her b3434 is having a potentially safe mix up off b343xxbutterfly for people flawless blocking also sounds like a bit much. She can still do it, but it requires some risk.
No launcher outside f21 and her Krushing Blows-honestly, seeing how much chip and poke damage Jade does, an actual launcher would be too much. For a character that essentially cant be zoned and has powerful keep away, facing big damage combos would be a little much.
Krushing Blows requirements-Kitana Prime managed to land Shadow Kick KB a number of times. Her uppercut KB is almost guaranteed just because her d2 is so good. Jade also has a launching throw KB, which is fairly unique. She seems pretty average in this regard.
Low damage-Jade's combo damage and anti air damage is actually decent. She may not have a solid launcher, but she does have solid poke damage. I could see some slight damage buffs being reasonable, but I mean like 1-2% on some hits, not extra combos.
Mix ups-Jade is actually among the few with a real mix up off b12/b1 edenian spark. Is it good? No. But mix ups and strong zoning should only be reserved for Sonya (nerf Sonya pls). Also, we're not all pros. Failing to react to a f21/124 mix up is bound to happen.
I already wrote way too much. I just hope going forward we can be more productive and consider whether Jade's flaws are inherent problems with the character or are there for a reason.
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one on top and one on bottom. Contrast.
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