REO
Undead
With Jason being probably the only character that has not received close to near the "20 buffs" other lower tier characters have gotten through out the span of patches, I'm starting to believe it has something to do with the Jason community not speaking up and just being quiet about our character. Now this thread is not meant to make Jason into an S tier character but more of a character to make people respect instead of having them go "Nice, I have a Jason in my pool instead of XYZ character.".
Now before we get into any of these buff or change requests, let's take a moment to realize Jason is probably the ONLY low tier character that has yet to be changed much and is very close to the same from how he is today compared to when he was first released. Now of course he's gotten some changes like a redesign *nerf* to Relentless, slight viability change to Unstoppable, and a safe 15% 50/50 in Slasher, but none of these modifications have changed to improve the core problems of Jason which are mainly: Low profiling, hitboxes, and counterproductive hit reactions.
The first main issue is low profiling. What's funny is there are other character communities that are constantly bringing attention to low profiling issues such as Jax and Johnny Cage but they have no idea how good they have it compared to Jason's low profiling issue. Jax has a fast advancing mid with F+3 and an overhead armored launcher and both can be used as viable options to whiff punish someone trying to low profile on a read. Johnny Cage has arguably the best footsie tool with his F+3 that can be used to whiff punish or beat out someone trying to low profile. Jason on the other hand has to use a bar of meter on a read to catch someone low profiling for 18% instead of a full combo by using EX Tight Squeeze with meter he has trouble building in the first place.
Now I won't get TOO heavily detailed on everything to prevent this thread being too colossal, but below are buffs requests I think would really help Jason become a better character in the long run.
Buff Requests:
General:
- Jason's standing 1 or his standing 2 should receive an improved hitbox so they can connect on characters who are crouch blocking.
Explanation:
- Jason's down+1 should become 6 frames of start up.
Explanation:
- Jason's back+3 should become faster in start up at 10 frames
Explanation:
- EX Close Line special move (B,F+3+Block) should become +8 on block
Explanation:
- Corpse Grab should become faster in start up or become a better anti-air
Explanation:
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RELENTLESS:
- Lake Mist special move (D,B+2) should receive some invulnerability frames when Jason dematerializes
Explanation:
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SLASHER
- Forward+2 needs to receive a different hit reaction, preferably one that keeps the opponent hit in place or towards Jason
Explanation:
- Back+2 needs to receive a different hit reaction, preferably one that sends the opponent towards Jason
Explanation:
- F+4 needs to have it's hitbox increased or given more range
Explanation:
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UNSTOPPABLE
- Punishment special move (D,D,3) needs to have better recovery or given an extra perk
Explanation:
- Rise special move (D,D,4) needs to have better recovery
Explanation:
- Corpse Walk special move (D,D,4+Block) needs to have way better recovery and heal more health
Explanation:
Agree? Disagree? Discuss. If you have anything you think Jason should get, feel free to post in here as well.
Now before we get into any of these buff or change requests, let's take a moment to realize Jason is probably the ONLY low tier character that has yet to be changed much and is very close to the same from how he is today compared to when he was first released. Now of course he's gotten some changes like a redesign *nerf* to Relentless, slight viability change to Unstoppable, and a safe 15% 50/50 in Slasher, but none of these modifications have changed to improve the core problems of Jason which are mainly: Low profiling, hitboxes, and counterproductive hit reactions.
The first main issue is low profiling. What's funny is there are other character communities that are constantly bringing attention to low profiling issues such as Jax and Johnny Cage but they have no idea how good they have it compared to Jason's low profiling issue. Jax has a fast advancing mid with F+3 and an overhead armored launcher and both can be used as viable options to whiff punish someone trying to low profile on a read. Johnny Cage has arguably the best footsie tool with his F+3 that can be used to whiff punish or beat out someone trying to low profile. Jason on the other hand has to use a bar of meter on a read to catch someone low profiling for 18% instead of a full combo by using EX Tight Squeeze with meter he has trouble building in the first place.
Now I won't get TOO heavily detailed on everything to prevent this thread being too colossal, but below are buffs requests I think would really help Jason become a better character in the long run.
Buff Requests:
General:
- Jason's standing 1 or his standing 2 should receive an improved hitbox so they can connect on characters who are crouch blocking.
Explanation:
EVERY other character in the game has at least a standing 1 or a standing 2 that can connect on an opponent who is crouch blocking. This was tested by using one of the smallest crouch blocking hurtboxes with Jacqui. The only character that does not hit her on crouch block with standing 1 or standing 2 is Liu Kang but it doesn't matter since he can just use his F+1 for the same effect. An up close grappling character should at least be able to perform some sort of jab pressure when he gets in.
- Jason's down+1 should become 6 frames of start up.
Explanation:
Jason is one of the slowest characters up close right now with his 8 frame down+1. He also has one of the worst down+3's and down+4's in the game. It doesn't make sense that a character with slow mobility who is designed to get in to become effective is slow when he gets in. Other main grapplers in this game such as Kotal Kahn, Torr, and Goro have amazing 6 frame pokes which totally makes sense. It's odd when Jason finally gets in on a zoning power house such as Quan Chi, Predator, or Shinnok and I'm forced to respect them up close because they're simply faster than a character who's sole purpose is to fight up close. Jason's D+1 also has stubby range and can be low profiled by some attacks so keep that in mind.
- Jason's back+3 should become faster in start up at 10 frames
Explanation:
Right now this is Jason's only meterless option to counter low profiling but back+3 is too slow to use up close in scrambles and the range and whiff recovery make it terrible when using it with spacing. This attack should become faster as a way to compensate for his down+1 not working against low profiling and give him an option that does not always require meter. This would be very fair as back+3 does not lead to any full combos AND the follow ups put the opponent full screen away from Jason.
- EX Close Line special move (B,F+3+Block) should become +8 on block
Explanation:
This is a buff I believe Jason needs to make him a better character. This would not be imbalanced as Jason has a difficult time building meter AND is very meter dependent. This would also not be too abusable as it can be ducked on a read and FULL combo punished. This would greatly help Jason by giving him the option to continue pressure with Meter Burn Close Line by using a bar.
- Corpse Grab should become faster in start up or become a better anti-air
Explanation:
One of Jason's big weaknesses is many characters can abuse jump ins on him and he doesn't have a reliable or consistent way to anti air them aside from using a bar of meter for not even a combo juggle. A character like Kotal Kahn has an amazing air throw in both recovery and juggling opportunities. I think given Jason the ability to use his air throw like Kotal would be fair since Jason's air grab does NOT launch and it has poor whiff recovery.
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RELENTLESS:
- Lake Mist special move (D,B+2) should receive some invulnerability frames when Jason dematerializes
Explanation:
Jason has one of the slowest teleports in the game but it is fine design wise because of the kind of character he is. The main issue with the teleport is when you do it preemptively to a projectile read, you still get hit out of it EVEN AFTER Jason dematerializes and his physical body disappears from the screen. I think Jason should receive some invincibility frames once he has dematerialized and is transitioning to the other side of the screen.
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SLASHER
- Forward+2 needs to receive a different hit reaction, preferably one that keeps the opponent hit in place or towards Jason
Explanation:
In Slasher F+2's current hit reaction sends the opponent backwards away from Jason. This is problematic as it makes F+2~Choke whiff in many situations. It can also make F+2 linked into B,F+2 or EN B,F+2 whiff, ruining the combo. A good way to fix this is to use a different hit reaction for F+2 so this problem does not occur. Using Cassie's hit reaction animation on her Forward+3 could work for Jason's Forward+2, just as an example.
- Back+2 needs to receive a different hit reaction, preferably one that sends the opponent towards Jason
Explanation:
Now normally a hit reaction on a move like this would not be an issue for almost any character, but because Jason does not have the feature to use run as a combo extension like almost every other character in the game is where the problem arises. When you make a read with Jason's Back+2 and anti-air someone out of the air, they're sent too far away to reliably combo afterwards. Changing the hit reaction of this attack to something like the last hit of Goro's Back+1,2,Up+2 string would be perfect.
- F+4 needs to have it's hitbox increased or given more range
Explanation:
F+4 in Slasher is a very important normal in Jason's arsenal and the main issue here is that you cannot use it after spacing Jason's unique jump in normals. If you do a good job spacing your jumping 1 or 2 and input the string F+4,2, after the opponent gets HIT by a jumping 1 or 2 the F+4 will whiff and they will be able to block the last part of the string and full combo punish you. Proper use of Jason's 50/50s with F+2 and F+4 are very important in this variation and the fact that you cannot reliably use the low option after a jump in is counterproductive to the variation's design.
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UNSTOPPABLE
- Punishment special move (D,D,3) needs to have better recovery or given an extra perk
Explanation:
D,D+3 (Punishment) is a very laggy damage increasing power up with total frames that rival that of an unblockable attack. This move is extremely difficult to get out in an actual match and pretty much forces you to cut combos short in order to even use. This special attack needs to definitely have less recovery and it would be neat if it did something unique like make Jason build meter on HIT or extra meter gain block if he has this buff active. Unstoppable is heavily meter dependent with no good ways to build meter so this would be a great help.
- Rise special move (D,D,4) needs to have better recovery
Explanation:
This special move restores very minimal health but the awful recovery makes it counterintuitive to use in a real match at risk of being hit and losing way more health than you would of healed. On top of that, D,D+3 (Punishment) is better to use in nearly every situation when choosing to end combos in a buff because the reward is greater. It would be nice if this move just had way better recovery and wasn't so penalizing so it would be a great option to consider using.
- Corpse Walk special move (D,D,4+Block) needs to have way better recovery and heal more health
Explanation:
Quite possibly the worst special move in the game to the point where this EX move is practically useless and heals the same amount of health without any noticable recovery difference from the normal version. The EX version should heal twice the health back (10% or more) and recover much faster.
Agree? Disagree? Discuss. If you have anything you think Jason should get, feel free to post in here as well.
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