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Breakthrough - Hish-Qu-Ten Frame Data is Wrong, Important!

dribirut

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
So I've been hearing a lot of players complain and cry about hqt predator. Mostly the complaining is about his low lasers being only negative one which makes his zoning but more importantly, his rushdown dumb and broken.
A lot of whinny "top" players have been spewing this misinformation without even testing it themselves and calling for nerfs(Tom Brady)

Well close low shot is in fact not -1 but -7.. It just has fast recovery so it seems like -1 is plausible. Kung Laos cyclone can punish. That is all.
 
infamy23

infamy23

FireBeard
Well shit, you're right. When I was testing everything myself I wasn't even aware that you could hold back for close low laser, so I tested mid distance low laser which is safe and then I forgot to go back and re-test the close version.

Nice find.
 
ando1184

ando1184

Warrior
Yeh there's a lot of "nerf predator" talk going around but honestly, I believe him to be one of the more balanced dlc characters to come out as is. People just need to do their research
 
infamy23

infamy23

FireBeard
This also means that his close low plasma is not +31 on hit. It's +26

Which sucks because I thought you could guarantee a f21 mixup after landing a close plasma but now I see that's not the case.
 
M2Dave

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Whoever said low plasma shot was -1 on block? I have been saying since Predator's release that the recovery is -7 on block. Cassie's back flip punishes too.

Miscellaneous trivial information.

- walk speed is very slow and back dash is mediocre.

- d+4 is -13 while d+4 xx PCC seems to be -5 or -4.

- 3,2 xx high plasma shot jails all characters. If the second hit hits, high plasma shot whiffs, but Predator is still safe.

- 3,2 xx EX high plasma shot jails some characters.

- 1,2,2 xx high plasma shot jails all characters.

- 1,2,2 xx EX high plasma shot jails more characters than 3,2 xx EX high plasma shot.

- running D'Vorah entirely ignores high plasma shot.

I think some people in the community are exaggerating. Based on the modus operandi of the patches thus far, if anything gets changed, I think the combos will do less damage, especially in Hunter.
 
dribirut

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
General M2Dave said:
Whoever said low plasma shot was -1 on block? I have been saying since Predator's release that the recovery is -7 on block. Cassie's back flip punishes too.

Miscellaneous trivial information.

- walk speed is very slow and back dash is mediocre.

- d+4 is -13 while d+4 xx PCC seems to be -5 or -4.

- 3,2 xx high plasma shot jails all characters. If the second hit hits, high plasma shot whiffs, but Predator is still safe.

- 3,2 xx EX high plasma shot jails some characters.

- 1,2,2 xx high plasma shot jails all characters.

- 1,2,2 xx EX high plasma shot jails more characters than 3,2 xx EX high plasma shot.

- running D'Vorah entirely ignores high plasma shot.

I think some people in the community are exaggerating. Based on the modus operandi of the patches thus far, if anything gets changed, I think the combos will do less damage, especially in Hunter.
Click to expand...
Well most people must not have heard you because that's what people are crying about
 
Magnum Magpie

Magnum Magpie

Apprentice
Not even kidding, NRS need to grow a pair and tell these nerf callers to sit the fuckk down and deal with the shit they put out.
 
SaltShaker

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Tired of my characters getting nerfed. If HQT Predator is next I'm done and will go play Tekken 7 in the arcades before I go back to the locals for MKX.
 
KillaGthug4Life

KillaGthug4Life

Believe in Magic yet? Let us Dance
The nerfs are more being asked for in Hunter because his damage is a bit ridiculous and the trap setup low high near unblockables are too easily abused for free combos. Sonic Fox shows us how they're insanely good. I think the startup on his trap will be changed a little, and his damage will be nerfed.
 
infamy23

infamy23

FireBeard
C88 Zombieekiler said:
how does it mean this?
Click to expand...
Because I had previously tested it and it was +31 but I was using the mid range shot so there is 5 extra frames where the plasma is traveling through the air and that lets you recover faster.

Close shot doesn't travel as far so there is less time to recover which makes this +26 on hit.

If you have your opponent in the corner, you can still do a regular low plasma, and if it hits you can do a f21 that they are forced to block because it's +31.

I like doing this because that string is so slow that this is one of the only times your opponent will see it, and people instinctively block high whenever they see that animation. So you can do something like low plasma, f21 low plasma, f21 low plasma (now they are like wtf I gotta block this low) and then you go for the f212 bf3 122 EXbf4 njp 321+3 into 46%
 
C88 Zombieekiler

C88 Zombieekiler

Up and coming sub zero
infamy23 said:
Because I had previously tested it and it was +31 but I was using the mid range shot so there is 5 extra frames where the plasma is traveling through the air and that lets you recover faster.

Close shot doesn't travel as far so there is less time to recover which makes this +26 on hit.

If you have your opponent in the corner, you can still do a regular low plasma, and if it hits you can do a f21 that they are forced to block because it's +31.

I like doing this because that string is so slow that this is one of the only times your opponent will see it, and people instinctively block high whenever they see that animation. So you can do something like low plasma, f21 low plasma, f21 low plasma (now they are like wtf I gotta block this low) and then you go for the f212 bf3 122 EXbf4 njp 321+3 into 46%
Click to expand...
no it means how many frames of block advantage you are left at isnt -1 theyre -7 i think you may have gotten it mixed up with recovery or im completly wrong but i dont think i am.
 
infamy23

infamy23

FireBeard
C88 Zombieekiler said:
no it means that the frames it puts you in block stun arent -1 theyre -7 i think you may have gotten it mixed up with recovery or im completly wrong but i dont think i am.
Click to expand...
Well yeah, but what I'm saying is that if the block advantage is incorrect, then so is the hit advantage.

As soon as I saw this thread I went and re-tested the hit advantage and it is +26 which is what I'm talking about.
 
infamy23

infamy23

FireBeard
C88 Zombieekiler said:
how did you test it?
Click to expand...
I use a 60fps capture card to count the frames.

Also you can clearly see that the hit advantage is different because if you do low plasma at jump range, you can do f2 and your opponent cannot get out of it.

But if you do close low plasma then f2, he can backdash or armor it.
 
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