I agree that cancels without stamina should be negative but everything else should be left alone imo. DF doesn't have anything else going for him. DF does not have the strong zoning that FF has and FF doesn't have the pressure DF has. So before you say Liu still has other options, break him down by variations please. Plus 2 means nothing in this game when there's armor involved. If you're worried about b12, just block because that string alone has gap at the end of it.