Resets

[Ether]

jP > 2,1 xx Ice Ball > Teleport > jP > u4 xx Teleport > 3,4 dash b2,2 xx Slide: 55% damage

jP > 2,1 xx Ice Ball > Teleport > jP > u4 xx Teleport > 3,3 EX Ice Ball > Teleport > Ice Parry > Ice Parry > jP > 2,1, 1+2 dash u4 xx Slide: 64% damage, 1 meter, builds 1/3 meter

jP > 2,1 xx Ice Ball > Teleport > jP > 2,1,1+2 dash u4 xx Ice Bomb mid: OLD/10. 39% damage. Forces them to wake up on a bomb. Multiple mixup scenarios, depends greatly on which character they are and how they choose to wake up. They have to use a wakeup attack, Xray or Jump to escape the bomb. These options are generally punishable, you just have to guess right.

Bolded text are where the mixups begin. Fairly practical resets, the issue with CSZ is landing 2, since it comes out on frame 15 and doesn't have the best range. Might put up a vid if I decide to actually make a YouTube account and record from my phone lol. CSZ can reset into resets if you're good at guessing right.

 

[Altaire]

So... Wait. You try to call me out on giving bad advice, and then you post a thread like this?

Here's a fun thought: The only viable mixup off his U4 teleport reset is 2 1 1+2, which only works so well. You can't alternate 3 3 and throw to create a mixup situation, because you need to start the 3 3 before you could start the throw. You can't throw your opponent while they're in U4 stun, so you need to wait for them to return to neutral before you can throw them at all; if they try to jump, guess what? You're fucked. You miss your throw, and if they guessed right, they are now crossing your dumb ass up for serious damage. 3 3 EX freeze works until your opponent realizes that they should just duck low, as you have no real mixup options here. If you even try to tell me this is a 50/50 with his 3 4, you should probably just stop posting.

Now, to post something that's actually a decent reset option, you can follow a bomb freeze with NJP U4 teleport (as long as the NJP won't splat your opponent, depending on their launch state before the freeze activated), which should give you enough advantage to throw out a close or mid bomb. The mid bomb should be close enough to your opponent whether they roll or not, and like Noob's throw/telethrow trap, the only catch is that you have to respect fast, advancing wakeups that can punish you before you recover. You can also use 3, 4, B2 2 mid/far bomb for a potential reset; the mid bomb will land underneath them if they return to standing, but only the far bomb will reach them if they roll. The far bomb is often times more beneficial just because it prevents your opponent's ability to move back, at which point you can wait to punish a jump-in or a dash-in on reaction. Consider that a bit of charity.

I realize how harsh I'm coming across here, but what can I say: You've always come across as such an upright prick that I just don't feel bad. Consider it karma.

P.S. Shoutouts to you regurgitating shit that xTac posted months ago. He beat you to the teleport reset by a mile.

 

[Ether]

So... Wait. You try to call me out on giving bad advice, and then you post a thread like this?

Here's a fun thought: The only viable mixup off his U4 teleport reset is 2 1 1+2, which only works so well. You can't alternate 3 3 and throw to create a mixup situation, because you need to start the 3 3 before you could start the throw. You can't throw your opponent while they're in U4 stun, so you need to wait for them to return to neutral before you can throw them at all; if they try to jump, guess what? You're fucked. You miss your throw, and if they guessed right, they are now crossing your dumb ass up for serious damage. 3 3 EX freeze works until your opponent realizes that they should just duck low, as you have no real mixup options here. If you even try to tell me this is a 50/50 with his 3 4, you should probably just stop posting.

Now, to post something that's actually a decent reset option, you can follow a bomb freeze with NJP U4 teleport (as long as the NJP won't splat your opponent, depending on their launch state before the freeze activated), which should give you enough advantage to throw out a close or mid bomb. The mid bomb should be close enough to your opponent whether they roll or not, and like Noob's throw/telethrow trap, the only catch is that you have to respect fast, advancing wakeups that can punish you before you recover. You can also use 3, 4, B2 2 mid/far bomb for a potential reset; the mid bomb will land underneath them if they return to standing, but only the far bomb will reach them if they roll. The far bomb is often times more beneficial just because it prevents your opponent's ability to move back, at which point you can wait to punish a jump-in or a dash-in on reaction. Consider that a bit of charity.

I realize how harsh I'm coming across here, but what can I say: You've always come across as such an upright prick that I just don't feel bad. Consider it karma.

P.S. Shoutouts to you regurgitating shit that xTac posted months ago. He beat you to the teleport reset by a mile.

The mixup is the 3,3 vs the 3,4. Didn't mention throw. The u4 teleport forces stagger so they have no choice but try to block this mixup. The downside is that its fuzzy guardable.

Not claiming to be the first to find this. It's just nice to have a thread to discuss practical, safe resets. I'm also thinking that instead of always going for 43% BnB off of jP, it might be worth trying various resets.

Also, you can be as harsh, inflammatory or combative as you want. I don't care at all, as I don't invest emotion into message boards.

 

[Altaire]

The mixup is the 3,3 vs the 3,4. Didn't mention throw. The u4 teleport forces stagger so they have no choice but try to block this mixup. The downside is that its fuzzy guardable.

Not claiming to be the first to find this. It's just nice to have a thread to discuss practical, safe resets. I'm also thinking that instead of always going for 43% BnB off of jP, it might be worth trying various resets.

Also, you can be as harsh, inflammatory or combative as you want. I don't care at all, as I don't invest emotion into message boards.

Annnnd there you go with the 3 3 vs. 3 4, completely ignorant of the fact that it isn't a viable mixup. 3 4 is so much slower than 3 3 that it can be easily fuzzy guarded. There goes your mixup.

 

[Ether]

Annnnd there you go with the 3 3 vs. 3 4, completely ignorant of the fact that it isn't a viable mixup. 3 4 is so much slower than 3 3 that it can be easily fuzzy guarded. There goes your mixup.

You don't ever use 3,3/3,4?

 

[salvificblood]

Now, to post something that's actually a decent reset option, you can follow a bomb freeze with NJP U4 teleport (as long as the NJP won't splat your opponent, depending on their launch state before the freeze activated), which should give you enough advantage to throw out a close or mid bomb.

I tested this a couple of days ago, it doesn't work. They can just get up and hit you after you throw the bomb. The better option is to u4 into a bomb to make them move on their wakeup.

 

[TheChad_87]

I think these are fairly viable tactics.

While 3,3 v 3,4 v Throw is not the absolute best mix-up out there, it gets the job done, and doing something different than the expected U4, xxm.Ice Bomb might be enough to throw someone off of his or her game a bit.

I definitely think there's some utility in it. These actually make me think of Jade's EN High 'Rang reset. It looks so bad on paper and to discuss it, you get the feeling that it's just garbage, but I have landed it several times against very solid players, most of which I would say are above me skill-wise. The things about these sort of Resets, though is that they tend to be 1-time things. You're not going to be able to consistently mix them into your playstyle, but they're great weapons to have in your arsenal.

 

[Ether]

Updated original post with a vid. Definitely interested in hearing about anything related to resets.

 

[GuamoKun]

I've done these before on multiple opponents. They're viable tactics IMO.

 

[Sid is a scrub]

Well this was helpfull hahaha gonna get cyber as one of my alts :top:

 

[Ether]

I tested this a couple of days ago, it doesn't work. They can just get up and hit you after you throw the bomb. The better option is to u4 into a bomb to make them move on their wakeup.

Yeah, this. It's best to go with Bomb/Slide in this situation.

 

[Altaire]

I tested this a couple of days ago, it doesn't work. They can just get up and hit you after you throw the bomb. The better option is to u4 into a bomb to make them move on their wakeup.

Uh, you can't do that after a bomb freeze, the bomb will whiff. For one, I HAVE tested this, and you can block most wakeup attacks after the U4 knockdown. Obviously, this is matchup specific, because nothing is "completely safe", but you can also use this to bait a punishable wakeup. I had a Cage player try to interrupt this with a wakeup shadow kick after I'd done it a couple times, so once I started expecting it, I just did U4 teleport with no bomb and punished the shadow kick on block.

Again, this isn't a "trap", and it's not a guaranteed reset either. Like most of Cyber Sub's bomb tech, it's just one setup you can use to pressure your opponent and limit his options. People are so quick to rule out any setup in this game that isn't completely brainless.

EDIT: Scratch that, I just tested it. Even Cage's shadow kick can't punish this, I guess I just wasn't quick enough online. Kung Lao's spin/EX spin can't punish it either, so there's ostensibly no wakeup fast enough to punish this setup. If you expect a wakeup attack, you can ALWAYS block in time, against any attack in the game (the only exception I haven't tested thoroughly enough is Reptile's wakeup elbow dash, and big fucking whoop if there's only one character this doesn't work on). If this setup didn't work for you, you did it wrong, period.

 

[salvificblood]

Uh, you can't do that after a bomb freeze, the bomb will whiff. For one, I HAVE tested this, and you can block most wakeup attacks after the U4 knockdown. Obviously, this is matchup specific, because nothing is "completely safe", but you can also use this to bait a punishable wakeup. I had a Cage player try to interrupt this with a wakeup shadow kick after I'd done it a couple times, so once I started expecting it, I just did U4 teleport with no bomb and punished the shadow kick on block.

Again, this isn't a "trap", and it's not a guaranteed reset either. Like most of Cyber Sub's bomb tech, it's just one setup you can use to pressure your opponent and limit his options. People are so quick to rule out any setup in this game that isn't completely brainless.

EDIT: Scratch that, I just tested it. Even Cage's shadow kick can't punish this, I guess I just wasn't quick enough online. Kung Lao's spin/EX spin can't punish it either, so there's ostensibly no wakeup fast enough to punish this setup. If you expect a wakeup attack, you can ALWAYS block in time, against any attack in the game (the only exception I haven't tested thoroughly enough is Reptile's wakeup elbow dash, and big fucking whoop if there's only one character this doesn't work on). If this setup didn't work for you, you did it wrong, period.

up 4 teleport obviously leaves you at a significant advantage, but chucking out a close bomb afterwards is the equivalent of saying: "please hit me". I use up 4, mid bomb/slide to end end bnb combos midscreen. Off a bomb freeze, I usually just do up 4, slide now. In general, it is better to use up 4, mid bomb/slide in my opinion. No wakeup can punish you after the up4, tele if you hold block, but pretty much anything can punish you from that range for throwing out a close bomb afterwards, which is all I am saying.

Why are you telling me I just did it wrong when the person I tested with just got up and full combo punished me for the close bomb every time? The problem with this is a close bomb after a an up 4 tele leaves you at a big disadvantage. You're too close to them for the bomb to even hit them if they start pressing buttons, too. It just doesn't work but you can think otherwise if you wish.

 

[Altaire]

up 4 teleport obviously leaves you at a significant advantage, but chucking out a close bomb afterwards is the equivalent of saying: "please hit me". I use up 4, mid bomb/slide to end end bnb combos midscreen. Off a bomb freeze, I usually just do up 4, slide now. In general, it is better to use up 4, mid bomb/slide in my opinion. No wakeup can punish you after the up4, tele if you hold block, but pretty much anything can punish you from that range for throwing out a close bomb afterwards, which is all I am saying.

Why are you telling me I just did it wrong when the person I tested with just got up and full combo punished me for the close bomb every time? The problem with this is a close bomb after a an up 4 tele leaves you at a big disadvantage. You're too close to them for the bomb to even hit them if they start pressing buttons, too. It just doesn't work but you can think otherwise if you wish.

Uh, because you ARE doing it wrong. I tested this against one of the best players I know, both with Cage's wakeup shadow kick and Kung Lao's wakeup EX spin. Here's the part where I KNOW you're fucking this up: You can block before your opponent can even recover. You can actually return to blocking a few frames before your opponent can even INITIATE a wakeup attack, or return to standing (in which case they'd still have to dash in to hit you with a normal string). If you're doing a NJP U4, canceling into a teleport and throwing out a close or mid bomb as soon as possible, you can block before your opponent can get a wakeup. You shouldn't even be getting hit by the fastest wakeup attacks in the game, much less full combos.

I quite honestly don't even understand how you could've fucked this up badly enough to give anyone a full combo punish. I can understand if you're a little late on the bomb and a fast wakeup tags you, but jesus christ, how can you be so delayed as to eat a full combo punish and think that you were doing this right?

P.S. You claimed Cyber Sub has an equivalent to Cage's nut punch (when I'm sure he doesn't). You never did elaborate on what that is, even when prompted to. Don't even try to tell me it's his U4.

 

[LOCO]

couldnt u do

jip 2 1 frz jip 2 1 1+2 up4 teleport for the reset and some good damage?

and just switch from teleport to slide to bomb and mix it up with lows and overheads for mind games?

wat bout diz?

 

[GuamoKun]

couldnt u do

jip 2 1 frz jip 2 1 1+2 up4 teleport for the reset and some good damage?

and just switch from teleport to slide to bomb and mix it up with lows and overheads for mind games?

wat bout diz?

When u4 hits a standing opponent it puts them in a stagger state, preventing wake up attacks. If the u4 is done after 21 2+1 the opponent is grounded and can punish the teleport.

 

[salvificblood]

Uh, because you ARE doing it wrong. I tested this against one of the best players I know, both with Cage's wakeup shadow kick and Kung Lao's wakeup EX spin. Here's the part where I KNOW you're fucking this up: You can block before your opponent can even recover. You can actually return to blocking a few frames before your opponent can even INITIATE a wakeup attack, or return to standing (in which case they'd still have to dash in to hit you with a normal string). If you're doing a NJP U4, canceling into a teleport and throwing out a close or mid bomb as soon as possible, you can block before your opponent can get a wakeup. You shouldn't even be getting hit by the fastest wakeup attacks in the game, much less full combos.

I quite honestly don't even understand how you could've fucked this up badly enough to give anyone a full combo punish. I can understand if you're a little late on the bomb and a fast wakeup tags you, but jesus christ, how can you be so delayed as to eat a full combo punish and think that you were doing this right?

P.S. You claimed Cyber Sub has an equivalent to Cage's nut punch (when I'm sure he doesn't). You never did elaborate on what that is, even when prompted to. Don't even try to tell me it's his U4.

Honestly, you are incredibly obnoxious.

The reason I was eating a full combo punish (remember, this was testing not an actual game), was because I was trying to pressure him on his wakeup to test how viable the trap was. The problem is, the close bomb after the up 4 tele leaves you at a disadvantage, however, up 4 into mid bomb does the same thing and much more safely. You stop them from tech rolling back and can apply pressure so long as they don't wakeup attack. Why would I trade that in for up 4, tele into close bomb? It doesn't make any sense. One is obviously more optimal than the other.


And, yes, up4, tele mid combo was the reset I was referring to in another thread, and it's been mentioned here so no need for me to go into it further. It's a situational tool that can come in handy against certain opponents or to force a round to a close through chip damage whilst denying your opponent a breaker. I never said Cyber Sub should use it all the time. Most of the time, you'll take your damage and bomb setup or untechable knockdown...

 

[Altaire]

If you were trying to pressure on wakeup, no shit you were going to get punished by wakeup attacks, that's kind of their whole purpose for existing. The point of this setup is that you can throw out the bomb, wait for your opponent to react to it and try to punish accordingly, either by AAing a jump-in, catching them with an anti-air slide/divekick if they try to jump out, or blocking a wakeup attack. This isn't completely foolproof, it isn't a trap, and it isn't a guaranteed bomb. The idea is that you can use this for 27% to get another bomb setup out of a bomb freeze (or after an anti-air NJP), as opposed to doing NJP U4 slide for 34%.

Don't tell me I'm being obnoxious when you insist that my setup doesn't work, despite being told numerous times that I've tested it extensively and determined that it's absolutely 100% safe.

 

[salvificblood]

If you were trying to pressure on wakeup, no shit you were going to get punished by wakeup attacks, that's kind of their whole purpose for existing. The point of this setup is that you can throw out the bomb, wait for your opponent to react to it and try to punish accordingly, either by AAing a jump-in, catching them with an anti-air slide/divekick if they try to jump out, or blocking a wakeup attack. This isn't completely foolproof, it isn't a trap, and it isn't a guaranteed bomb. The idea is that you can use this for 27% to get another bomb setup out of a bomb freeze (or after an anti-air NJP), as opposed to doing NJP U4 slide for 34%.

Don't tell me I'm being obnoxious when you insist that my setup doesn't work, despite being told numerous times that I've tested it extensively and determined that it's absolutely 100% safe.

As I explained to you, you can do the same thing and better off an up 4 cancelled into a mid bomb. There's no need to teleport and close bomb.

 

[Altaire]

As I explained to you, you can do the same thing and better off an up 4 cancelled into a mid bomb. There's no need to teleport and close bomb.

Except, y'know, you can't cancel a U4 into a mid bomb off a bomb freeze, which is what my setup is used for. Good call.

 

[salvificblood]

Except, y'know, you can't cancel a U4 into a mid bomb off a bomb freeze, which is what my setup is used for. Good call.

I am sorry? I do this all the time.