Moral Dilemmas (What would you do?)

[TarkatanDentist]

1. I would protect the kids
1a. Even though it's obviously an impossible scenario, it would be no different. The only difference is doing it with a machine vs doing it with your own hands. You're sacrificing an innocent by manipulating the natural path. So if that was my only option and I knew it would somehow work, I would push the man.

2. I would do nothing. In a post-9/11 world, airspace (here and internationally) is tightly controlled and by the time they reached a target people on the ground would know whether it is a hostage situation or a threat, and in the latter case (nowadays) they would probably shoot down the plane if they felt it was necessary. If there's no indication of them using the plane for terrorism, we shouldn't do anything that drastic.

3. I'm a [ban incoming] fuk having kids

Yep, agreed with all these answers.

 

[True Grave]

While we are talking, these moral philosopher's are fucking morons. Kantian theory is some of the dumbest shit I've ever heard, and I had a bitch once ask me who won WWII

I like the scenario where evil is good and good is evil. Both "think" they're doing a justice at times, but neither truly are. All based on the fact that it's for our best interest, and not based in principalities. Just speaking as a whole and in general. Nothing directed towards you.

 

[Youphemism]

What does that say?

 

[The Great One]

1. Definitely not saving the random kids. 4 kids crossing the train rail without adult supervision, nothing to feel guilty or amoral about here.
2. This one is simple. You do nothing to jeopardize the plane and the lives of people in it, you do not kill the terrorists, you do what you can - for example talk to them through the vent.
3. Lol Is this even a question?

I respect #1
#2 I respect your opinion but I just wanted to say that the chances of them speaking English are low and when a group of people like that risk their lives to steal a plane...chances are low that they're going to land it. (I said terrorist and that's subjective to everyone's personal image. Some might be guys with shades and suits but I have no problem saying that when I hear the word terrorist I see Muslims and people in turbans. do I assume everyone that looks like that is aa terrorist? Hell no but thats tthe image social media has brought me up to see.)

#3: omg don't say that. The comments have been all over the place like "fuck no ill never torture my daughter" to "Of course I would. The pain of both of us in exchange for the pain of the world? What people would we be not to take that?"
So yeah it is a question and I honestly don't see a immediate go to answer as of Now for tym

Bring in the heavy stuff.[/quote]

 

[Prinz]

I respect #1
#2 I respect your opinion but I just wanted to say that the chances of them speaking English are low and when a group of people like that risk their lives to steal a plane...chances are low that they're going to land it. (I said terrorist and that's subjective to everyone's personal image. Some might be guys with shades and suits but I have no problem saying that when I hear the word terrorist I see Muslims and people in turbans. do I assume everyone that looks like that is aa terrorist? Hell no but thats tthe image social media has brought me up to see.)

#3: omg don't say that. The comments have been all over the place like "fuck no ill never torture my daughter" to "Of course I would. The pain of both of us in exchange for the pain of the world? What people would we be not to take that?"
So yeah it is a question and I honestly don't see a immediate go to answer as of Now for tym

Bring in the heavy stuff.

[/quote]
#2 Still gotta do something, bc either way you're gonna die, so nothing to chose from here.
#3 The world ends when you end, so the choice is obvious.

 

[PaletteSwap]

1. Hit the 4 kids. They'd probably grow up to be message board trolls or douche bros anyway. My conscience is clear either way, as it is not my fault the train is out of control. I'm not taking my own life as well as the lives of the passengers (which probably includes children). Yeah sure, let's kill/injure the passengers of two trains for some stupid kids. No thanks.

2. Totally not poisoning myself based on a what if situation. We haven't landed yet so it isn't game over yet. I'd rather go out clawing and punching.

3. No way I'm gonna take away the one thing that keeps an already teetering population from exploding even more and devouring Earth's resources.

Sorry, but you aren't gonna get any warm and fuzzy responses from a true misanthrope. I'd be cheering for the demise of all humanity if it weren't for a few great humans who have proven me wrong along my bitter path. Unlike the great military of the United States, I'm not for bombing an entire city to take out 2 people.

 

[Kzaoo]

1. Kill the kids. It's their fault for being on the tracks anyway.
2. Do nothing. No need to exacerbate the situation.
3. I wouldn't torture my hypothetical daughter. I don't care about the world enough to choose my family over it.

In the end, I'll just be selfish. I don't feel compelled to do anything for people I don't care about.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Sorry, but you aren't gonna get any warm and fuzzy responses from a true misanthrope. I'd be cheering for the demise of all humanity if it weren't for a few great humans who have proven me wrong along my bitter path. Unlike the great military of the United States, I'm not for bombing an entire city to take out 2 people.

It is funny you say this because Bill Clinton was just on the news mentioning how he could have killed Bin Laden before 9/11 but would have had to blow up an entire city filled with 300 people(He didn't do it). Now THAT is a true moral dilemma.

I get your point too, just made me think of that.

 

[Shaazzyam]

Please don't put words in my mouth. Of course everyone deserves to live equally. I never said people we love deserve to live more. I'm saying when it comes down to choosing between them you will pick the people you care more about.

I guess it's possible you might care more about complete strangers than your own wife, kids and friends. But I could also say that's pretty fucked up.

To use your own rhetoric: What we do know: You'd let your best friends that saved your life/supported you when you needed help DIE, to save some random scrubs, materialists and criminals. You would stab your wife/bros in the back to save 100 people you've never even met before because you consider their lives somehow more valuable. Again, without even knowing anything about the 100. They could be 100 rapists or serial killers and you would still choose to save them (because since they're strangers you wouldn't even know if they're good people or dirtbags).

Yes saving people you love/care about is kind of selfish. But that's human nature. If you're completely selfless you are simply not human.

Let me get this straight.

You're arguement is literally: I'm a selfish person, everyone should be also selfish like me. If you choose to not save your family over any number of strangers you are not human?

Also, why do you keep assuming the 100 people you don't even know are immediately guilty of something? And what makes your family so perfect and free of guilt? Before, you admitted that any number of strangers vs. your family wouldn't even matter. You'd always choose your family, no matter what? That's the type of mentality that causes a lot of shit in the world. Honestly, man, there's no way you can come out not looking like a douche. Just own up to it.

Personally, I hope my family would understand and not be such shitbags to put their lives over 100s of other people. I guess that's just fucked up and psychopathic of me, though.

Sorry, but you aren't gonna get any warm and fuzzy responses from a true misanthrope. I'd be cheering for the demise of all humanity if it weren't for a few great humans who have proven me wrong along my bitter path. Unlike the great military of the United States, I'm not for bombing an entire city to take out 2 people.

That's super edgy brah

 

[TaffyMeat]

Read the Fighting Fantasy book Appointment With FEAR.

 

[Vulcan Hades]

Let me get this straight.

You're arguement is literally: I'm a selfish person, everyone should be also selfish like me. If you choose to not save your family over any number of strangers you are not human?

Also, why do you keep assuming the 100 people you don't even know are immediately guilty of something? And what makes your family so perfect and free of guilt? Before, you admitted that any number of strangers vs. your family wouldn't even matter. You'd always choose your family, no matter what? That's the type of mentality that causes a lot of shit in the world. Honestly, man, there's no way you can come out not looking like a douche. Just own up to it.

Personally, I hope my family would understand and not be such shitbags to put their lives over 100s of other people. I guess that's just fucked up and psychopathic of me, though.

I can't come out of this not looking like a douche? LOL take a good look at yourself in the mirror. You're the one acting like a dick, twisting people's words and making meaningless arguments vs someone who has a perfectly reasonable opinion that simply differs from yours.

You already admitted previously that the thread/OP is retarded and that you only respond to make your boring days a little more fun. So you already have zero credibility to begin with. It's obvious you're just arguing for the sake of arguing and I don't have time for this shit. You think whatever you want to think lol.

Tell you what brah, I'm gonna be the bigger man here and say you are RIGHT. YES congratulations you just won this completely meaningless argument based on a hypothetical scenario -even though you'll never find yourself in that scenario IRL so you can't know how you would truly act in the moment. Yes I'm a selfish idiot and a monster for even wanting to save my family and friends over complete strangers. You are ssooooo smart, righteous and sane dude. You convinced me and everyone else that you truly are a saint and a hero for always doing the right thing.

Whatever makes you sleep at night.

 

[TATAKAE]

I'll tell you after you tell me what you chose and what you voted for. The question this is screwed up and I don't know how to fix it

But I'll at least tell you what I voted for

"We stopped checking under the bed for monsters when we realized they were inside us"
I think it's true no matter how far we come as people we will never get past that animalistic urge to protect ourselves and our kin.

Not me. Based on your last sentence though I think we might have different answers...

 

[rev0lver]

If a friend/family member had to kill me to save a few random strangers, I would understand it. I mean I wouldn't really, because I'd be dead. But I would see them as doing the right thing.

I think people are basically good. Selflessness goes above gaining one's own needs and gratification in a way we can't necessarily understand logically. Maybe it's the way we've advanced, that it's more than survival of the fittest.

Maybe saving your brother isn't necessarily "selfish", but I'd like to think that if I had to make the decision that they would understand why I had to. Kids couldn't sacrifice themselves, I couldn't be okay with it.

 

[Shaazzyam]

I can't come out of this not looking like a douche? LOL take a good look at yourself in the mirror. You're the one acting like a dick, twisting people's words and making meaningless arguments vs someone who has a perfectly reasonable opinion that simply differs from yours.

Your pathetic rhetoric is hypocritical and full of shit. You already admitted previously that the thread/OP is retarded and that you only respond to make your boring days a little more fun. So you already have zero credibility to begin with. It's obvious you're just arguing for the sake of arguing and I don't have time for this shit. You think whatever you want to think lol.

Tell you what brah, I'm gonna be the bigger man here and say you are RIGHT. YES congratulations you just won this completely meaningless argument based on a hypothetical scenario -even though you'll never find yourself in that scenario IRL so you can't know how you would truly act in the moment. Yes I'm a selfish idiot and a monster for even wanting to save my family and friends over complete strangers. You are ssooooo smart, righteous and sane dude. You convinced me and everyone else that you truly are a saint and a hero for always doing the right thing.

Whatever makes you sleep at night.

You keep saying I'm putting words in your mouth. So I'm going to quote you and specifically address each statement.


"There is simply no dilemma if it's X strangers vs X people you know/care about"
This statement clearly implies that you don't care about what kind people they are. So pushing this "they might be criminals" excuse is pointless. If they're not your family, tough luck for them, they can eat shit.


"If you choose to save 100 strangers over your wife/family/kids you're a deranged psychopath who is incapable of loving/caring so you should be behind bars for being a danger to society"
Then we have this. I think this speaks for itself, really. Honestly.


"Pretending that you would save complete strangers over the people you love the most is hypocritical. We all know it ain't happening unless you don't really love or care about anyone."
I guess...? Or maybe, just maybe, I love my family but have the self awareness to understand that their lives don't weigh more than hundreds of others?

"I'm saying when it comes down to choosing between them you will pick the people you care more about."
No. I'm choosing the right thing because I realize that my family's lives do not take priority over 100s of other lives. Your arguments are completely based 100% in emotion. Can you for once try to think rationally or, like, just fairly?


" But is the human race as we know it really that important to save? I think saving our humanity matters more"
What does this even mean? According to you great wisdom, the more human thing to do is the most selfish option? You can't seriously be saying....

Yes saving people you love/care about is kind of selfish. But that's human nature. If you're completely selfless you are simply not human
...Oh. You're exactly saying that. What an asshole thing to say.

"Of course everyone deserves to live equally. I never said people we love deserve to live more."
If you truly believed that, then you're family's lives would not take precedence over 100s others. However, you still don't care. So, by your own admission, you are wrong and a selfish person. Deal with it.


"You already admitted previously that the thread/OP is retarded and that you only respond to make your boring days a little more fun. "
Ok, and? This isn't about the OP, we're on a different subject. Keep deflecting, though. It's great.

"You're the one acting like a dick, twisting people's words and making meaningless arguments vs someone who has a perfectly reasonable opinion that simply differs from yours."
Dress it up how you want. Your "perfectly reasonable opinion" is " me me me me my feelings." Seems legit. Look, if you feel that your family are the chosen ones and no other life compares, then that's your thing.

Just don't be offended when someone calls you out on how insanely douchey that sounds. That's all

 

[Vulcan Hades]

You keep saying I'm putting words in your mouth. So I'm going to quote you and specifically address each statement.
"There is simply no dilemma if it's X strangers vs X people you know/care about"
This statement clearly implies that you don't care about what kind people they are. So pushing this "they might be criminals" excuse is pointless. If they're not your family, tough luck for them, they can eat shit.
"If you choose to save 100 strangers over your wife/family/kids you're a deranged psychopath who is incapable of loving/caring so you should be behind bars for being a danger to society"
Then we have this. I think this speaks for itself, really. Honestly.
"Pretending that you would save complete strangers over the people you love the most is hypocritical. We all know it ain't happening unless you don't really love or care about anyone."
I guess...? Or maybe, just maybe, I love my family but have the self awareness to understand that their lives don't weigh more than hundreds of others?

"I'm saying when it comes down to choosing between them you will pick the people you care more about."
No. I'm choosing the right thing because I realize that my family's lives do not take priority over 100s of other lives. Your arguments are completely based 100% in emotion. Can you for once try to think rationally or, like, just fairly?
" But is the human race as we know it really that important to save? I think saving our humanity matters more"
What does this even mean? According to you great wisdom, the more human thing to do is the most selfish option? You can't seriously be saying....

Yes saving people you love/care about is kind of selfish. But that's human nature. If you're completely selfless you are simply not human
...Oh. You're exactly saying that. What an asshole thing to say.

"Of course everyone deserves to live equally. I never said people we love deserve to live more."
If you truly believed that, then you're family's lives would not take precedence over 100s others. However, you still don't care. So, by your own admission, you are wrong and a selfish person. Deal with it.


"You already admitted previously that the thread/OP is retarded and that you only respond to make your boring days a little more fun. "
Ok, and? This isn't about the OP, we're on a different subject. Keep deflecting, though. It's great.

"You're the one acting like a dick, twisting people's words and making meaningless arguments vs someone who has a perfectly reasonable opinion that simply differs from yours."
Dress it up how you want. Your "perfectly reasonable opinion" is " me me me me my feelings." Seems legit. Look, if you feel that your family are the chosen ones and no other life compares, then that's your thing.

Just don't be offended when someone calls you out on how insanely douchey that sounds. That's all

I seriously hope you're trolling lol. How could I get offended by such a cute tryhard wannabe.

We all went to school and studied Utilitarianism vs Kantianism philosophy. We all know saving 100 people over a couple is the "right", "logical" and most moral thing to do. 100 lives are generally more valuable to society than one. And if you were in control of the situation you could say it's our "duty" as human beings to I guess limit the casualties or maximize people's happiness or whatever.

You're basically saying we have to consider logic and reason over our emotions and passion. But none of that matters because it's just smalltalk masturbation by wannabe philosophers who wouldn't even find themselves applying what they preach if the situation occurred IRL. They just want to believe they have the right mindset and that they would be capable of making the right choice.

The people obsessed with the idea of always doing what is right are no less selfish than I am. You just don't realize it.

Dress it up how you want. Your "perfectly reasonable opinion" is " me me me me my feelings." Seems legit. Look, if you feel that your family are the chosen ones and no other life compares, then that's your thing.

omg you are so silly lol. I never said my family is superior to any other family. And I never said I don't care about any other life being lost. I said what I feel like I would do in the situation. Yes, I would follow my feelings and my heart not rationality in such a situation. But I will of course follow rationality/reason when loved ones aren't involved in the dilemma.

Read the thread, there are plenty of people who would hit the 4 kids and save their brother and daughter. So I'm not the only one.

This argument is pointless and you shouldn't be attacking and insulting people who don't share your sentiments.

 

[Kzaoo]

I understand what Vulcan Hades is saying.

Choosing your family may not be the right thing to do, but, because we know and love our family, it is much harder to decide to kill them. We have an emotional connection with them that we don't have with random people and it may be selfish, but we want that emotional connection to stay alive.

If I killed my sister I'm about 90% sure I'd kill myself after.

It may make you a douche, but who wants to stand up to their parents and say "I killed my brother, the person I grew up with. The person who has supported me. The person who I've loved for pretty much all my life - your son - for the greater good."

It may make you a douche, but could you stand over your brother's grave and say: "I made the right decision. I chose other people I've never met over you. I hope you can forgive me."?

It goes the other way around, too. Point is, there is no right answer. You're stuck in between a rock and a hard place. Choosing to save the one you have emotional connection to is completely understandable in a high pressure, split second decision situation.

 

[The Great One]

So im guessing you guys would do it if for ex: the whole world was on the line right? Where does that line get drawn? How many people are you willing to run over before you're willing to sacrifice a family members life? Apparently for some people 4 is enough

 

[Kzaoo]

If the whole world was on the line, then if you chose the family member over the world, the family member would be a victim regardless, because if the everybody in the world dies then they die, too and if only your family were alive, then what would they have to live for?

 

[Vulcan Hades]

If the whole world was on the line, then if you chose the family member over the world, the family member would be a victim regardless, because if the everybody in the world dies then they die, too and if only your family were alive, then what would they have to live for?

I definitely agree with that. In that scenario you lose your loved ones regardless or have nothing to live for afterwards.

In this case I'd rather save the whole world than be the only one alive with my wife and kids. There's plenty of fish in the sea after all LOL. I'll just start a new family with some random hooker.

Now if I'm going to die either way, I'll take the whole damn world with me lol. jk

 

[Shaazzyam]

I seriously hope you're trolling lol. How could I get offended by such a cute tryhard wannabe.

We all went to school and studied Utilitarianism vs Kantianism philosophy. We all know saving 100 people over a couple is the "right", "logical" and most moral thing to do. 100 lives are generally more valuable to society than one. And if you were in control of the situation you could say it's our "duty" as human beings to I guess limit the casualties or maximize people's happiness or whatever.

You're basically saying we have to consider logic and reason over our emotions and passion. But none of that matters because it's just smalltalk masturbation by wannabe philosophers who wouldn't even find themselves applying what they preach if the situation occurred IRL. They just want to believe they have the right mindset and that they would be capable of making the right choice.

The people obsessed with the idea of always doing what is right are no less selfish than I am. You just don't realize it.




omg you are so silly lol. I never said my family is superior to any other family. And I never said I don't care about any other life being lost. I said what I feel like I would do in the situation. Yes, I would follow my feelings and my heart not rationality in such a situation. But I will of course follow rationality/reason when loved ones aren't involved in the dilemma.

Read the thread, there are plenty of people who would hit the 4 kids and save their brother and daughter. So I'm not the only one.

This argument is pointless and you shouldn't be attacking and insulting people who don't share your sentiments.

Holy shit, I get it. You're selfish. How many times are you going to repeat the same shtick?

"The people obsessed with the idea of always doing what is right are no less selfish than I am. You just don't realize it."

Vulcan Hades knows all. He is not just spouting simplistic opinions based on no evidence, his own projection, and blanket statements whatsoever.

"You're basically saying we have to consider logic and reason over our emotions and passion."
Uh...yes. I am. The world doesn't revolve around you. I'm sorry, Vulcan Hades.

"Read the thread, there are plenty of people who would hit the 4 kids and save their brother and daughter. So I'm not the only one."
Following this logic, most popular = always right. I guess Hitler wasn't such a bad guy, he had so many supporters, after all.

"This argument is pointless and you shouldn't be attacking and insulting people who don't share your sentiments"
Ok, Vulcan Hades. I'm sorry I called you selfish and docuhey. Even though it's the truth and you, yourself, admitted it. But ok.

 

[Shaazzyam]

So im guessing you guys would do it if for ex: the whole world was on the line right? Where does that line get drawn? How many people are you willing to run over before you're willing to sacrifice a family members life? Apparently for some people 4 is enough

Going off some of the responses in this thread already, I'm afraid to see the answer to that question.

 

[Vulcan Hades]

Holy shit, I get it. You're selfish. How many times are you going to repeat the same shtick?

"The people obsessed with the idea of always doing what is right are no less selfish than I am. You just don't realize it."

Vulcan Hades knows all. He is not just spouting simplistic opinions based on no evidence, his own projection, and blanket statements whatsoever.

"You're basically saying we have to consider logic and reason over our emotions and passion."
Uh...yes. I am. The world doesn't revolve around you. I'm sorry, Vulcan Hades.

"Read the thread, there are plenty of people who would hit the 4 kids and save their brother and daughter. So I'm not the only one."
Following this logic, most popular = always right. I guess Hitler wasn't such a bad guy, he had so many supporters, after all.

"This argument is pointless and you shouldn't be attacking and insulting people who don't share your sentiments"
Ok, Vulcan Hades. I'm sorry I called you selfish and docuhey. Even though it's the truth and you, yourself, admitted it. But ok.

Dude you're such a fucking drama queen lmao. Calm your tits and go eat a snickers or something. You're taking this way too seriously and you're actually the one coming out like a douche believe it or not. I'm trying to remain as nice as possible but you're making that pretty hard to do.

All I know is I'm glad we're not friends. And I can sleep well knowing that this random guy on TYM will 100% kill his own daughter without hesitation to save my entire family since it's the right thing to do. The world is lucky to have people like you. I wish I was that heartless too so I could be seen as the saint and hero you are. But nope I will forever be known as the selfish monster of TYM. Oh well... sucks to be me.

 

[The Great One]

Going off some of the responses in this thread already, I'm afraid to see the answer to that question.

lolololololol nahhh i'm pretty sure there must be some line in peoples morality it's not that crazy...

I hope

 

[Shaazzyam]

Dude you're such a fucking drama queen lmao. Calm your tits and go eat a snickers or something. You're taking this way too seriously and you're actually the one coming out like a douche believe it or not. I'm trying to remain as nice as possible but you're making that pretty hard to do.

All I know is I'm glad we're not friends. And I can sleep well knowing that this random guy on TYM will 100% kill his own daughter without hesitation to save my entire family since it's the right thing to do. The world is lucky to have people like you. I wish I was that heartless too so I could be seen as the saint and hero you are. But nope I will forever be known as the selfish monster of TYM. Oh well... sucks to be me.

Yep. Here we go.

The last resort of someone who knows they're wrong. Say you weren't even being serious, ignore all the points they made, and pray nobody notices what a massive tool you are.

You're such a cool guy, braaah

 

[Zoidberg747]

Yep. Here we go.

The last resort of someone who knows they're wrong. Say you weren't even being serious, ignore all the points they made, and pray nobody notices what a massive tool you are.

You're such a cool guy, braaah

Nah I agree with him, you're being a douche.

I kind of agree with your point but your being so hostile it is kind of embarrassing. Your throwing insults over freaking hypothetical situations.

One thing you did prove though is these types of questions/discussions are never productive, so props for that.