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Trait Design and improving the initial concept

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
Ares' Downward weapons should auto track the opponent, the Sword projectile should be an armor breaker, Weapons shouldn't disappear if you're hit out of it and slightly less cooldown.

and also lol @ joker's trait is fine. Get out. If anything, the trait should let you full combo someone.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
Great concepts

But u lost me at Joker trait is fine lol

All jokes aside joker trait should be called "jokers wild"

-During this 5-6 time period gun shot is mid

-canisters twice as fast

-double speed dash and walk

-teeth unblockable
Sounds good, but what would be the downside of using this trait? What would give people caution not to just mindlessly activate this trait whenever they can?
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
This is an interesting concept, and I think it would add a lot of depth to the game. I never really liked the fact that for example, Black Adam's trait became "win any close game for free by just dashing in" etc.

Usually the hypest things in fighting games are the ones that have tradeoffs. Getting hit with an unblockable isn't hype.. But for example, I was watching the Cafe ID tournament and Fuudo was late into a match and about to lose the game. Everyone was trying to figure out how he could pull it out, and he literally went up and did walk up Raw Ultra on a read and won the match. It was hype, and everybody was screaming "He just did it!" because they knew that if his read was wrong or his execution was off, he'd have gotten pusnished to infinity and lost the match.

However if the Ultra was unavoidable or safe/free, then there wouldn't have been any hype at all. It'd just have been another cheap/semi-brainless mechanic.

It's the same reason it's hype when somebody DP's their opponent, and then walks right up to them and DP's them again on wakeup (like Daigo at Dreamhack). It's because it's risky as hell, but the tradeoff is good.. So you're rewarded for having the balls to risk the downside in order to get the payoff.

I know Injustice is supposed to be over-the-top, but I think that in the long term, risk/reward is what has the power to keep people enjoying and playing a game for a long time.
 
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Zatoichi

Fabulous Goofball
Green Arrow's trait needs some changes:

  • Arrow change: Slightly faster start-up
  • Normal Arrows: 2% Damage
  • Fire Arrows: 10% Damage. Cause Hard Knockdown (Can't use Wake-up) (Can Still Roll)
  • Electric Arrow: 6% Damage. Cause more hit and block stun, and cause more float on airborne opponents
  • Ice Arrow: 2% Damage.

As it is right now, there is no reason whatsoever to ever choose Electric or Fire Arrow over Ice Arrow.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
This is an interesting concept, and I think it would add a lot of depth to the game. I never really like the fact that for example, Black Adam's trait became "win any close game for free by just dashing in" etc.
Exactly! I really like the idea of traits and they add a lot to the game by making each character that more unique, but I think they require a bit more thought and the pllayer should have to consider whether or not they will really benefit that much from using it and if it's worth the price.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
Ares' Downward weapons should auto track the opponent, the Sword projectile should be an armor breaker, Weapons shouldn't disappear if you're hit out of it and slightly less cooldown.

and also lol @ joker's trait is fine. Get out. If anything, the trait should let you full combo someone.
I'm not saying the trait is completely fine as it is, just that the concept of having a parry as a trait which when landed correctly adds a buff to your character is a good design as it has a risk/reward factor. How practical it is is another matter
 

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
I'm not saying the trait is completely fine as it is, just that the concept of having a parry as a trait which when landed correctly adds a buff to your character is a good design as it has a risk/reward factor. How practical it is is another matter
The reward for parrying an opponent just doesn't make much sense though...more walkspeed matters very little when it takes so long to get to the max walkspeed. That speed boost may as well not be in the game.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
The reward for parrying an opponent just doesn't make much sense though...more walkspeed matters very little when it takes so long to get to the max walkspeed. That speed boost may as well not be in the game.
I agree with that, I think maybe then he could receive 3 buffs, one for each parry. First parry he deals 15% with the parry and his gun will now hit mid for the entirety of the match. Second parry he deals 20% damage with the parry and the canisters are now faster and the one he throws hits overhead. Third parry deals 25% damage and his teeth are now unblockable for the rest of the match
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
The reward for parrying an opponent just doesn't make much sense though...more walkspeed matters very little when it takes so long to get to the max walkspeed. That speed boost may as well not be in the game.
Doesn't it also affect his jump arc + dash and other things? Is it literally only his walkspeed that gets a boost?
 

Zatoichi

Fabulous Goofball
Green Arrow's trait needs some changes:

  • Arrow change: Slightly faster start-up
  • Normal Arrows: 2% Damage
  • Fire Arrows: 10% Damage. Cause Hard Knockdown (Can't use Wake-up) (Can Still Roll)
  • Electric Arrow: 6% Damage. Cause more hit and block stun, and cause more float on airborne opponents
  • Ice Arrow: 2% Damage.

As it is right now, there is no reason whatsoever to ever choose Electric or Fire Arrow over Ice Arrow.
Glad everyone agrees with me then.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
I definitely do not agree with Grundy losing the buff after a repeated grab. It's already heart breaking enough that you can clash it ;_;
I knew Grundy mains would hate this suggestion, I just thought it would be interesting to see people have to think about which chain grab they were going to do. At the very worst you'd have to just alternate between increased damage buff and reduced chip or damage received so you'd never really hit an actual debuff.

Would like to hear any suggestions on how to make this trait a little more thought out or if you think it's fine the way it is then that's fine. I've got no issues with this trait to be honest and was just trying to think of something to make it a bit deeper
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
Glad everyone agrees with me then.
Again the point of the thread wasn't about nerfing/buffing traits. I was talking about the concept of his trait i.e. having 3 different arrow stocks each with different properties. The technical details are another matter
 

JTB123

>>R2 - BF4 = Unblockable.
Grundy's trait is fine as it is, having to switch between traits with every combo would ruin the entire point of the individual buffs he receives.
I concur, the only thing worse than fighting Hawkgirl as Grundy would be fighting Hawkgirl with Grundy without the chip trait being active :eek:

LBSH, Grundy should be able to have all three traits active at once, that's the only change that needs to be made to his trait :p
 

ThaShiveGeek

Est In Harvey 1989
I was just thinking the other day... What if Jokers Trait was his teeth, but they were unblockable and had a cool down time?
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
I'm sorry but a lot of these would make it a game that I don't wanna play. Though I'm all ears on joker trait buffs =]
So you wouldn't like the idea of each trait having a mandatory downside? I think the idea of a trait being something people can press mindlessly to make their character better is stupid.