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Question - A-List Should a list be nerfed

Should a list be nerfed.


  • Total voters
    230

Death

Noob
333 and f24 should have less cancel advantage imo. Mostly f24. I think making f24 skrc plus 9 wouldn't hurt much. It currently jails into f3 which already jails into everything (not too sure about f2 or b3 so please correct me if im wrong).

Since f24 is johnny's only true combo starter, i think it should be more of a mind game. 1,2 can break a good amount of armor, so adjusting the cancel advantage of f24 to compliment 12's armor breaking properties would also be a solid fix imo...

But f24 currently jailing into f3 is too free and johnny doesn't need that lol.
No one in the world will be able to jail F3 from F24 consistently. Even getting 1 to jail is ridiculous. I think more players need to play Johnny and not respect that cancel and go for the armor. 99% of the time armor will beat out the F3. If you made F24 less plus like +9 it still wouldn't change the meta of the F3 after. Johnny will just cancel block to bait anyways and still be more plus which most do or at least I do now. 333 and B34 will only be possible after a nut punch anyways. If your worried about the F3 jailing after it than Johnny can always skip that string and starts the jailing process with F3. Theres ways around it


I think his cancels are fine but like I said earlier the only nerf to F3 I think would be fair is not being able to cancel it off a whiff so Johnny players will have to have better spacing in the neutral.
 
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omooba

fear the moobs
If they nerf him I will probably deal with it, I just don't see any reason for that since there are many characters who are surely better. Why would you want to nerf Johnny when he is not top tier? wasn't enough to ruin fisticuff?

It's also hilarious that at the same time you downplay liu kang lmao
he is top tier. i'm not even asking for nerfs but don't say he's not top tier
 

omooba

fear the moobs
He is nowhere near the top 5, debatable top 10. He is good, but far from being one of the problems of MKX
"problems of mkx" is too general for me to debate. and he is without a question top 10. i don't want to say you're downplaying but you're getting close
 

RyuKazuya

Jesus is my Lord and Savior!
good gosh alright!! Take away his jails.
Even then you guys will find something to complain about.
i mean ill play him even if he gets doo doo.

heck there are even People complaining about Jason nowww !!! I slowly start to believe there are barely any fighting game players left.
 

omooba

fear the moobs
good gosh alright!! Take away his jails.
Even then you guys will find something to complain about.
i mean ill play him even if he gets doo doo.

heck there are even People complaining about Jason nowww !!! I slowly start to believe there are barely any fighting game players left.
i don't think the game is that unfair. i wouldn't even nerf that much if i had the choice.but to say jason is unfair? idk what kind of people you are talking to
 

RyuKazuya

Jesus is my Lord and Savior!
i don't think the game is that unfair. i wouldn't even nerf that much if i had the choice.but to say jason is unfair? idk what kind of people you are talking to
sad but true there was someone who claimed that jasons low poke was too strong. It sounds unbelievable.
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
I just won a match online against dragon fire INFINITE SPAMMER (i like this word :D ), barely.

So we were in the final round and he had a pixel of health after i SPAMMED HIM in the corner with a-list crap, and then he read a cancel and jumped over me and SPAMMED me with the infinite until i had a pixel of health as well.

But, the karma universe said NO MORE, and when he was about to chip me with a bicycle kick FROM THE INFINITE SPAM, the bicycle kick went through me behind me and stopped hitting me, so i just poked him and won the match.

Conclusion: You can win against dragon fire ONLY IF THE GAME BUGS HIM OUT.
 

omooba

fear the moobs
I just won a match online against dragon fire INFINITE SPAMMER (i like this word :D ), barely.

So we were in the final round and he had a pixel of health after i SPAMMED HIM in the corner with a-list crap, and then he read a cancel and jumped over me and SPAMMED me with the infinite until i had a pixel of health as well.

But, the karma universe said NO MORE, and when he was about to chip me with a bicycle kick FROM THE INFINITE SPAM, the bicycle kick went through me behind me and stopped hitting me, so i just poked him and won the match.

Conclusion: You can win against dragon fire ONLY IF THE GAME BUGS HIM OUT.
do u main goro?
 

Somea2V

Thread Referee
I'm sorry guys, I've seen the light. Jailing so easily (I mean, come on, we all do it consistently with no practice whatsoever) is a serious problem. A most assuredly serious problem because with no real mix-up or way to open someone up, other than the "Is it a mid, overhead, low poke or throw game?", we might be able to apply substantial chip damage to our opponents. I mean, if we could actually harass people in a way that didn't lead them to just block high constantly and fuzzy the odd 113/11xF2 mix up, eating small amounts of damage from low pokes and being thrown away from us so that we then have to close distance, then people might have a fighting chance. But no, as long as we can do chip damage to people for such high, 7-9% amounts, we will continue to be a top 5 character. That chip damage... that jailing... it's a wonder people don't just wait until our stamina runs out and then destroy us with superior pokes and faster normals (real talk, D4 is 11 frames. That whole phantom hurtbox thing isn't really an issue when another poke OR NORMAL MOVE (looking at you, Liu's F4 & D3 (yeah, nested parenthetical biznitch)) beats it to the punch... ahem, kick.) But no... the jailing potential causes such fear that no one can resist pushing buttons and eating low to mid 20% combos. And as we make them screw up repeatedly... we destroy them in kombat.

Guys... I'm not joking. It's time to admit that Cage is a top, nay... the top character. Far more reliable and easy to play than Kung Lao, Tanya, Cassie, Quan Chi, Predator, Liu Kang and any other. I'm not sure we should ever get more than +1 off a shadow kick run cancel. Then we will all see the glorious mimicry light that is Stunt Double and work to perfect our execution and mind games with that variation... until it is discovered that it too is the strongest variation in the game, requiring so little skill they apply a ten second cooldown to clones and make it so that taking a hit or blocking a hit also dispels mimics.

Then... then the characters can truly thrive in this game... without fear of... JOOOOOOOOOOOOHNNY CAAAAAAAAGE!!!!!!
 

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
I'd agree with you if it weren't for that thing which is:

Cage's combos are low damage in a-list (25-29%) without bar, just because he can also add 5-7% chip afterwards.
Comparing him with tremor and quan chi who can do meterless waaay more than that, I'd say it balances out.

Oh and:


JANNYYYYYYY COOOOOOOOOOOOOOOJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJ
 

omooba

fear the moobs
Guys... I'm not joking. It's time to admit that Cage is a top, nay... the top character. Far more reliable and easy to play than Kung Lao, Tanya, Cassie, Quan Chi, Predator, Liu Kang and any other. I'm not sure we should ever get more than +1 off a shadow kick run cancel. Then we will all see the glorious mimicry light that is Stunt Double and work to perfect our execution and mind games with that variation... until it is discovered that it too is the strongest variation in the game, requiring so little skill they apply a ten second cooldown to clones and make it so that taking a hit or blocking a hit also dispels mimics.

Then... then the characters can truly thrive in this game... without fear of... JOOOOOOOOOOOOHNNY CAAAAAAAAGE!!!!!!
lies he's not the top character. you can't objectively say that. i think he's disgustingly good but to say he's better than quan, pred, lao, tanya AND liu kang!!!! is complete bull.
 

Somea2V

Thread Referee
lies he's not the top character. you can't objectively say that. i think he's disgustingly good but to say he's better than quan, pred, lao, tanya AND liu kang!!!! is complete bull.
One, praise be the nerf hammer's swift strike upon thy broken Cage. May it be washed away and replaced with a new, stronger way to keep oppenents restrained.

Two, seriously? You're not on board with this? Of all downpla-truthsayers in this thread, you... OF ALL OF THEM... are suddenly "hey, he's not top 5. Look, five other people better than him. But he's broke and disgusting so I don't know what my point is." I have your point here, son.

Nerf Cage, he's broke!
 

omooba

fear the moobs
One, praise be the nerf hammer's swift strike upon thy broken Cage. May it be washed away and replaced with a new, stronger way to keep oppenents restrained.

Two, seriously? You're not on board with this? Of all downpla-truthsayers in this thread, you... OF ALL OF THEM... are suddenly "hey, he's not top 5. Look, five other people better than him. But he's broke and disgusting so I don't know what my point is." I have your point here, son.

Nerf Cage, he's broke!
1) who have i downplayed? there are so little characters in this game that i don't think are good so i really want to know.
2) i've said liu is better than cage in this thread
3) i've never said he's top 5. i've never said my placement for any character cus there are too many characters that i feel are equal
 

Bar_Bar13

Friendly Neighborhood Spectre
I'd agree with you if it weren't for that thing which is:

Cage's combos are low damage in a-list (25-29%) without bar, just because he can also add 5-7% chip afterwards.
Comparing him with tremor and quan chi who can do meterless waaay more than that, I'd say it balances out.

Oh and:


JANNYYYYYYY COOOOOOOOOOOOOOOJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJ
In the corner, Cage can get 35% meterless, ending in nutpunch too.
 

Vini_Strife

"Online is your forte!" - A Wise Man, 2015.
Why u all don't learn to play with him, before u ask for nerfs? Alist is not a easy player to learn, and make his cancels true block string is a pain in the ass!

Enviado de meu LG-D855 usando Tapatalk
 
Tbh almost all character can get 40% meterless in the corner (include jump in and setup), but a list Cage bnb corner combo is only 32-33% meterless, I have never seen 40% corner combo from Dizzy or Vendetta or KillerXinok
 

Asodimazze

https://twitter.com/AlfioZacco
Tbh almost all character can get 40% meterless in the corner (include jump in and setup), but a list Cage bnb corner combo is only 32-33% meterless, I have never seen 40% corner combo from Dizzy or Vendetta or KillerXinok
You usually get 35 - 36 starting with f3, or 113 meterless and around 32 starting with f24