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Question Newbie Solomon Grundy asks for an advice.

R

Rockwood

Noob
Hello there guys, my name is Nick and I am here to ask for your help.
I've been reading (unregistered) a lot of articles here on TYM, trying to figure out how the game actually works. I am pretty new to fighting (MK3 does not count), was playing MK9 casually, but never online. But Injustice impressed me pretty well, so I've decided to try going a bit more hardcore.
And here is a problem - I am f***king STUCK. I totally can't understand some things, cause you are talking too hardcore for me, it's like reading on another language with some broken dictionary.
I've got LOTS of questions, and I am sorry I've made this thread - but I've got no other choice, I can't figure out things I need in other threads.
Really hope to find some here here, cause my online games are just horrible -_-.
So, back to the deal:
1) First of all - what EXACTLY is a "cancel"? I've read some stuff, but I still don't get it. Why should I want to do this? What does it bring to me? When?
2) I am maining Solomon Grundy for a reason, and I am really trying to be creative, but I always end up pressing d2>bf3 or d2>trait. I know some setups and I've watched some videos, but hell, I just get outspammed by combos and can't do shit. I don't even know how to start the fight properly, with what? Shall I close the distance immediately, or hold back or...? Some general advice of playstyle would be nice.
3) Well If i can place a well-timed db2MB, then I follow up with 112>bf2MB>11>trait, but I usually just don't have time to hit. So I end up trying desperately grab a guy with bf3.
4) My worst nightmare is Superman. God dammit I hate this guy. He comboes me for 13-15 hits I think, and I can't do shit (I figured out how clash works, but meh, it just 1 time salvation). And even if I combo him for 50%, we end up on different sides of the screen, and he starts to spam his lasers, oh god I HATE this lasers. If I move - it knocks me back. If I sit - he flies up and does an overhead laser, which I can't block at all. So he keep zoning me out so I can't even dash to him. And if for some reason I actually manage to get to him - 1 mistake and I am fully comboed for 40-60%.
And if I try to spam WCC (bf3) cause of this armour effect, I still can be hit in between WCCs.
5) Another problem is Nightwing - I can try to beat him if we are midscreen, but if he corners me somehow with his pressure - he just outspams me with that on-air batarangs. Shall I just spam WCCs to get out? I thought its pretty lame.
I think thats enough for a first time. Sorry again for a terrific huge thread and for my bad english (not native). Really hope to find some good advice here from you guys.
P.S. My MP stat is now about 13-11 in rankeds. :(
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
And 1 more question - sometimes the game ends up like session expired (dunno how exaclty it is in english), I receive 1 win on my stat, but I also receive a +1 to amount of disconnects. Is that okay? Sounds weird.
 
Alien Substance

Alien Substance

Evanesce
Greetings, Nick.

1) A "cancel" is when you cancel an attack/pre-made combo in your moves list with a special move of some sort. Say your string is 1,1,3, and your special move is done by pressing D,B,2. If you wanted to cancel your string before the 3, you would press the buttons on your controller like so: 1,1,D,B,2.

Cancels can bring forth an extended combo, a reset to leave your opponent standing so they can't wake up with a special attack, and other things.

2, 3, 4, 5) I do not have Injustice yet, so I cannot answer properly. Sorry.

However, have you checked the general I:GAU Gameplay Topics sub-forum? You may find some useful information in there.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Alien Substance said:
Greetings, Nick.

1) A "cancel" is when you cancel an attack/pre-made combo in your moves list with a special move of some sort. Say your string is 1,1,3, and your special move is done by pressing D,B,2. If you wanted to cancel your string before the 3, you would press the buttons on your controller like so: 1,1,D,B,2.

Cancels can bring forth an extended combo, a reset to leave your opponent standing so they can't wake up with a special attack, and other things.

2, 3, 4, 5) I do not have Injustice yet, so I cannot answer properly. Sorry.

However, have you checked the general I:GAU Gameplay Topics sub-forum? You may find some useful information in there.
Click to expand...
Well, thanks for that one, gonna try it right now.
Yeah, I've been checking this subforum for some time, but It is so complicated, so I don't have nuff experiense in fighting games to understand something. Frames, for example, I don't get them. And so on.
Thanks for an advice man, I appreciate it :)
 
Alien Substance

Alien Substance

Evanesce
Rockwood said:
Well, thanks for that one, gonna try it right now.
Yeah, I've been checking this subforum for some time, but It is so complicated, so I don't have nuff experiense in fighting games to understand something. Frames, for example, I don't get them. And so on.
Thanks for an advice man, I appreciate it :)
Click to expand...
You're welcome.
Have you checked that thread about Information for New Players?
These things just take time, especially fighting games. I've played MK9 since it was released back on 2011 of April 19th, and I haven't gotten to a level you can really say is "good", till at least Janurary 2013.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Well yeah, thats better topic, now I understand frames a bit. Still don't get how to implement this on practice tho :)) But I think I can manage this later.
Anyways, thanks again. :)
I still don't get about bbMBMB and ffMBMB cancels. But I think this is Injustice special thingy.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Well before posting this I've already adapted to that fighting slang like buttons, but this is still helpful, thanks a lot :)
 
ZedZeus

ZedZeus

WoolayWarrior
I knew a lot of stuff in general - but I couldn't understand what people were on about when they talked about oki setups and tick throws - so yeah - that helped me and I'm glad its useful for you as well! :D
 
B

Belloz22

Noob
Hey!!! To be completly honest...... if your new to fighting games in general, Grundy is definetly a hard character to pick up. His combos are not hard and you are guarenteed good damage with his trait/chain grabs....... but he is hard to play with, especially against quick characters. My one tip if you want to stick grundy out is learn to use his -> 1, 3 combo starter. It hits low and will counter alot of weaker spammers due to the space it covers. When you hit it, you have plenty of time to 1, 1, 4 (trait grab) for decent damage. The problem with Grundy is you have to learn to pressure alot and make the person scared to come in. Really your best bet is go into practice and pick one combo for grundy that does not use a meter burn special, and one that does. Once you get the timings down etc, do a run through arcade ladder trying to pull the combos off etc..... teach you to still hit the combo under pressure. Once you can do that go online and take your time, grundy gets out poked alot so you have to be patient...... and never forget how effective his swamp hands are from distance away, and how important meter burning his triat is to stop some pressure.

Hope this helps
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Wow, thanks for great advice man.
Tried f13 now, it is great for a start, gonna use it for sure. f13>114 is awesome.
I use Swamp Hands and Walking Corpse Charge very intensively, dunno in a right way or not tho :)
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Belloz22 said:
Well let me know how u get on and if u need ne more advice message back on this thread :)
Click to expand...
So I use Swamp Hands to:
Interrupt unstoppable barrage of spammed projectiles;
Close the gap;
Set up a combo using SwampHands MB;
Finish the opponent who tries to kite and poke being low hp.

I use Walking Corpse Charge to:
Generally start the fight;
Evade upcoming combos;
Evade projectiles;
Grab opponent on his wake-up (I saw how Tom Brady uses it with Grave Rot [WCCMB > Grave Rot > WCC], sometimes it is very cool);
Make a pressure.

I thinks thats it.
 
PANDEMlC

PANDEMlC

El Psy Congroo
4) I main Grundy and started playing Superman this week and I do agree it's an annoying matchup but there are things you can do.

-Once you hit a trait grab go into the chip damage one, the du, ud trait one. This will help you to get in and not take any damage from his lazers or block strings.

-Secondly, learn to Walking Corpse Cancel. This will help you approach Superman safely while not blindly committing to a Walking Corpse grab. You can use this to go through air lazers and punish and any projectile that doesn't hit more than 3 times, interactables, and even strings.

-If you land a Walking Corpse MB it and turn on grave rot and you get a free mixup on his wakeup, learn the timing and dash up and do f13, b1 into ex swamp hands into whatever or trait grab.

-He should never get a free jump in on you because you have a great AA grab and an amazing anti air d2. Use both these to keep him from wanting to jump. Also if you land the air grab you get a free dash in and setup on his wakeup similar to when you MB WC. If you learn how to block against Superman and play patiently and land the chip damage trait grab you'll have a lot of success.

-Learn to block cross up air dashes, block low and react to overheads when blocking strings on the ground, jump air lazers(they'll miss even if it looks like the lazer will hit you), dash between lazers or WCC to armor through it, and learn what his moves look like.

-Supermans will use f23 A LOT, it hits mid and covers a lot of horizontal space so be careful when approaching, but also learn what 22 looks like. It's two punches and he can go into an overhead or a low. To deal with this string you block low and react to the overhead. The low scoop is unsafe and you can punish it with 112 into whatever(i think).

-In the corner I'd recommend blocking high a lot, or be prepared to. A lot of his damage comes from overheads but be aware he can still throw and low you. He also has some frame traps to be aware of and also take note of his trait. If you see him glowing red, do not Walking Corpse at him, you will get knocked out of it.

-He can also frame trap you with his 111 string, so if you see 3 puny looking punches with no followup come out, keep blocking. His super breath is also +1 which means you gotta respect him a bit. You can walking corpse cancel after he does F23xxSuper breath but be aware he can jump it and punish so learning to cancel your WC again, is essential. It lets you react to what he does all the while getting closer. If he jumps over you, look for it next time and d2 or anti air grab him.



The most important thing about beating Superman is a good defense, remember the chip damage trait grab. It'll save your life many many times. Superman wins by annoying you with screen control and punishing your mistakes.

Terminology:

WC = Walking Corpse
WCC = Walking Cropse Cancel
MB = Meter Burn
AA = Anti Air
UDFB= Up, Down, Forward, Back
1234 = XYAB or Square, Triangle, X, Circle

Hope this helps, the matchup is still hard but it's very winable.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
PANDEMlC said:
some good text over here
Click to expand...
Wow man, thats fantastic, so much info, I think this gonna help.
Can you tell me, how exactly Walking Corpse cancel is performed? I don't exactly get it.
It would be awesome :)
Another thing that annoyes me in Sups is his wake-up grab - he flies up and grabs me right from the ground, so I can't stand before him if he knocked down :(
 
DaiHuu

DaiHuu

Nightwolf Mourner
Kudos to you for picking up Grundy as your main, know that grapplers in every fighting game need patience, perseverance, and dedication. As grapplers tend to have the biggest bulk, biggest health, and biggest hurt boxes (hurt boxes meaning the areas where you get hit.) We're slow, our walk speed is meh, and our jumps are usually recognizable from a mile away. However, we have the most powerful tool any fighting game character can have, a command throw. A move that can't be back dashed usually, that can't be blocked high or low, and can't be teched on reaction. A move that adds to the high, low, grab game that everyone else as a universal tool.

Now 5)

Nightwing's wingdings are a vast problem for Grundy, in fact, that's the move that usually every Nightwing resorts to against Grundy....So how Grundy stop? :C

You have 2 options depending on what angle he threw it.

A)He throws it at an arc where nothing will hit you, and you can swamp hands him while he's falling down.

B) (Best option) you know he's going to wing ding, so you WCC through, and do d+2.

Your answer to this match up WILL be to WCC his air options, the thing about Nightwing is that his pressure is insane if you don't take the character into the lab, you will want to try to burn meter to get out, to jump away, to back dash, ANYTHING TO GET OUT OF PRESSURE. but know that the best option against Nightwing is....push block. Nightwing (Now referred to as NW from further on) has such a hard time dealing with pushblock in Escrima, since he has to close that gap once more. Save your meter for that pushblock and let him attempt to pressure you so you can push him away.

If he gets into staff stance and starts to pressure, that's another problem. If he gets you into the corner, the match up is near lost. He covers EVERY option at a certain part of the screen if you're in the corner. So what do you do? Push block, and try to find a pattern, keep your composure and remember not to panic. You have to find a opening and abuse it.


Know this as well, you WILL go into a match up against characters like Green Lantern, Superman, DeathStroke, and Sinestro with 10%-25% less health than the other player due to taking chip while you're moving in. If you get use to that, you'll literally make it a breeze walking in.

As for combos, it's muscle memory. I'll give you the combos I do ALL the time. If you play on a controller on ps3 I'll write that annotation up too.

112~MB Swamp hands, ji.2, b+1 (wait for blood to disappear) trait throw.
square square triangle~MB Swamp hands, ji.Triangle, b+Square, Circle

F+1,3, 11~MB Swamp hands, ji.2, b+1, pause, trait throw.
f+Square X, square square~MB Swamp hands, ji.Triangle, b+Square, pause, trait throw

113, 11 trait throw
Square Square X, Square Square Circle

113, 11~MB Swamp hands, Ji.2, b+1, pause, trait throw
Square Square X, Square Square~MB Swamp hands, ji.Triangle, B+Square, pause, circle.

113, 2~MB Swamp hands, Ji.2, B+1, pause, trait throw.
Square Square X, Triangle~MB Swamp hands, ji.Triangle, b+Square, pause, Circle.

Hope this helps buddy, I gotta head to school so let me know if you need further help! And remember...Grundy Think you handsome. c:
 
PANDEMlC

PANDEMlC

El Psy Congroo
Rockwood said:
Wow man, thats fantastic, so much info, I think this gonna help.
Can you tell me, how exactly Walking Corpse cancel is performed? I don't exactly get it.
It would be awesome :)
Another thing that annoyes me in Sups is his wake-up grab - he flies up and grabs me right from the ground, so I can't stand before him if he knocked down :(
Click to expand...
Yeah, when you input WC which is bf3 you input down, back as he's doing it on screen. If done right he should not follow through with the actual grab part at the end of the walk and you should be able to hit any button while still remaining safe and getting the armor from the move. Very useful, for getting in for mixups, and I believe it builds meter too(not 100% sure).

That rising grab on wakeup is invincible and really annoying but you can punish it. The easiest way is to d2 him as hes falling after he does it. The harder and more timing specific way is to hit him the moment he lands with a 112 into whatever combo you want. A lot of people mess up their wakeup move timings or don't do them at all so I wouldn't worry too much unless someone is spamming it. But here's the combos I'd do to punish the rising grab.

d2, 11 mb swamp hands, ji2, b1,(reset, wait briefly), trait grab into whatever trait properties you want.
d2, 11 trait grab - meterless
d2 11 ex swamp hands, b3, ji2 11 trait grab - 1 bar

112 mb bf2, 11 mp swamp hands, ji2 b1(reset), trait grab - cost 2 bars
112 mb swamp hands, dash up b3, ji3, 11 trait grab - 1 bar
112 mb swamp hands, ji2 b1 (reset) trait grab - 1 bar

Grundy has a reset off of his b1, it grants him a free trait grab most of the time if timed right.

I almost always go for it because the damage is so good. I would list the damage for you here but it varies so much dependent on what grab trait you have active and what grab you end it with. Health trait does the most but again, staying in your chip damage free mode is really useful. But if you're running through a superman, you can go all out with the damage or health trait grab.

- Also, I forgot to mention but if Superman trys to zone while on the ground you can MB Swamp hands him and dash up and trait grab him. Make him respect your zoning tools. Make him want to jump and then ultimately make a mistake like air dashing in and getting air grabbed or shooting an air lazer as you WCC through or jump it.

- By reset I mean it resets the damage, so you'll see the combo end when you hit the b1 but really you're still getting the extra 20-30% from the trait grab.


:Note:

Apparently my punishes listed above only work if you don't block the rising grab on wakeup. It seems like if you block it leaves you in block stun for a long enough time that you cant' punish but you do get a free string into mp cleaver, mb swamp hands, grab or trait grab, armored b3, etc.

You can duck it though, so if you duck on their wakeup you don't have to worry about that ^

If they do any other wakeup you can punish with an mb trait grab, mb b3, WC, etc. His other invincible moves are low scoop and super breath both of which leave him on the ground, which means hes free to any armor moves.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Blah, I misspelled, I can use Walking Corpse, but I don't get how to use Walking Corpse CANCEL :(
Iam newb.
As I understand its like I start WC and then I cast uhmm for example graverot so character stops instantly and I can punish opponent who was thinking I will WC him? Is that so?
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
So I understood right, well man thanks alot, I think I must imrpove my antiair game, I barely use this AA grab, but it is really great tool seems to be lol :)
Gotta play some more online today and will post some results here :)
Btw, met Sups today, who was literally doing no mistakes on his wakeups. ZERO.
Perfect timing, could not do shit. He performed alot of em (played against him 3 times), and he never messed it up. I've avoided some of em, but meh, his timing was incredible :)
 
B

Belloz22

Noob
Basically to wcc.... u need go do wc but after the Input press down then back..... basically he will then start the walkin animation but not put out the hands for the grab, its from then u can follow up with a 1, 1, 2 combo etc. Basically the cancel allows you free pressure with armour. The problem is if you dont time it right you will get punish at the end of your walk. Your best bet against spammers is ur mb swamp hands. Rush in, back 3, into combo..... otherwise if u cant get in close just use mb swamp hands close in as far as time allows and then use standard swamp hands to get the knockdown before the mb ones release. Then when knocked down u can push in more...... go for safe mb cleaver spin or pressure their wakeup with walking corpse etc
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
Well, your advices guys are priceless, I really appreciate that. I expected more coldhearted replies, glad I was wrong :)
Gonna play for a while now so I can test all the things you told me :)
Practice, practice, practice :D
 
PANDEMlC

PANDEMlC

El Psy Congroo
He was probably mashing, I can do it every time when I want on a controller.. on a stick.. not so much. Like I said though, now you know how to punish that wakeup. Block it low and bait it out if someone abuses it.

I like helping Grundy players and people in general, I usually just lurk here for new info for myself but I try and help when I can. Most people on this site are helpful. Once you grind out how to react to every situation with the right move or combo you'll feel a lot more confident in your grundy game. I remember when I used to despise playing Deathstroke with Grundy cause I thought there was no punish to his wakeup sword flip, lol boy was I wrong, 112 ex swamp hands that shit all day. Now I know a 2 bar punish that does over 70% starting with 112, scrubby Deathstrokes stand no chance against a decent grundy who knows that. Learning how to punish, what to look for and how to block consistently will make this game infinitely more fun for you. Just keep at it, it's a lot of shit to take in but refer to this page and ask whatever.
 
R

Rockwood

Noob
So I've played some matches yesterday and heres another bunch of questions.
1) Superman is still a jerk, I can deal with Sups who are at least try to go melee, but man, i've met 2 Sups today who were just spamming lasers, and my WCC is not perfectly timed, so I was getting punished at the end of it. Could not do shit -_- But I think its just a matter of practice :)
2) Played with Aquaman, and actually I've managed to bait his trait twice and won the match, which was very hard tho. Another aquaman just killed me with his xray, he's got smth about 20% hp left =(
3) Ares is annoying, and if he just tries to zone me, I can deal with him. But if hes mixing it up, I just got distracted, cause I don't know him well.
4) It came out of nowhere: Joker. I've played with 4-5 Jokers, and I've won every single match, but yesterday I've played with my friend, who was abusing 1 combo - 3 hits + smashing me with crowbar on the ground. And he was doing it on and on, and I just could not figure out, how exactly can I counter him. Think its a matter of practice too :)
5) Ah, and Lobo. Well, he is pretty brutal - his dmg output from pretty simple combos is terrific.I've won against 1, but other 2 just smashed me.
 
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