Well, it's tomorrow >:I'mma add all that to the OP when I wake-up tm
Yea absorbing the projectile gains you nothing lol.honestly tho really should make amulet strike -5 on block. Its a pretty useless move outside of geting a brutality or nullifying a projectile...which you could just avoid.
What drugs are you on?Please Calf, add all the suggested changes at the top of the thread (as seen here: https://testyourmight.com/threads/with-the-kp2-patch-coming-up-what-buffs-nerfs-should-shinnok-receive.57844/) I was gonna make this thread lol but you beat me to it. Anyways, the changes I want are:
Here are the changes I still want implemented from the KP2 Thread
- OTG doesn't scale
- Can Mimicry and Scoop after Krushing Shoulder
- Krushing Shoulder's Spark on hit comes out on block as well leaving him at -7 but there is a gap between the spark and the hit from the shoulder
- Standing 4 faster start-up
- F2 is -3
- Less Push Back on Amulet Curse
- F3 faster start-up
- B2 is +6 on block (gets the big leg treatment)
- Amulet Strike steals bar from the opponent
- Mimicry steals bar from the opponent
- Increased range on Scepter Slam/Launch
- Amulet Curse has more pop-up/launch
- Ex-Dark Beam is +16
- Increased Vertical Hitbox on F4
- Amulet Strike is -5
- Krushing Shoulder pops them towards Shinnok not away
- Make D2 a mid
- Make Krushing Shoulder safe
- Make Charging Shoulder safe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Universal:
· Standing 3 – Now a Low instead of a Mid Buff
· Standing 4 – Now a Mid instead of a High Buff
· F2 – 2 frames off the start up frames (Down to 15 in Non-Bone Shaper; Down to 17 in Bone Shaper) Buff
· B1 – Increased push-back (enough for all 3 Hell Sparks to connect on block) Buff
· Damage – Increased damage output overall Buff
· 11 – Fix hit box issues Buff
· X-Ray – Bitch slaps into Brutality
Necromancer:
· Devil’s Flick
o Improve tracking Buff
o Reduced start up frames Buff
o Reverted back to -4 on block Buff
· Summoned Fiend
o Improve tracking Buff
o Safe(r) on block Buff
o Becomes a Low Buff
o Reduce start up frames (fast enough to anti-air) Buff
o Able to Brutality off of
· Judgment Fist
o Becomes an 11 Frame Overhead instead of Unblockable (similar to Tremor’s Rock Drop) Buff
o Cancel-able if it does not become an 11 frame overhead (cancel similar to MK9 Jax’s Ground Pound) Buff
o Note: Judgment Smash still remains a slow unblockable. with it able to still crush opponents on delayed wake-up.
· Judgment Smash – Cancel-able but faster than Judgment Fist's cancel (like the difference in advantage between cancelling LK's fire ball and cancelling his Ex-fire ball) Buff
· Summoned Slam
o Able to utilize twice in one combo Buff
o Armored Buff
· Variation Aesthetics – Remove silly bone hands in exchange for another aesthetic identifier (possibly Pimp Rings)
Impostor:
· Stolen Moves – Different stolen moves from the following characters:
o Kenshi; currently steals Rising Sword
o Takeda; currently steals Tornado Kick
o Jacqui; currently steals Bionic Dash
o Ferra/Torr; currently steals Deep Stab
o Raiden; currently steals Electric Fly
o Goro; currently steals Stomp
o Jason; currently steals Killing Machine
o Predator; currently steals Stealth
· Mimicry
o Kenshi – Steal “Blade Reflect” or “Rising Karma” instead of “Rising Sword”
o Takeda – Steal “Fist Whirlwind” instead of “Tornado Kick”
o Raiden – Steal “Shocker” instead of “Electric Fly”
o Predator – Steal “Scimitar Slam” instead of “Stealth”, or add the ability to combo into Mimicry while Stealth is already active at the cost of removing the invisibility.
o Add an Enhanced Mimicry or a MB version of Mimicry with the following properties:
- Armor while using the stolen move Buff
- Gains the Ex-properties of the stolen move if he does not already Buff
- Able to hit full screen like Quan Chi's trance Buff
· Air-Tricky Portal
o Can Air-Tricky Portal while grounded (just Tricky Portal); Ex-Version of grounded Tricky Portal with armor upon reaching the destination Shinnok teleported to. Buff
o Can teleport in place, in addition to behind or in front of the opponent. Buff
Bone Shaper:
· Dark Beam – Revert to -8 on block instead of -12. Buff
· F221+3 – Make the “1+3” part of the string able to come out on block (currently +2 but not possible to come out and block; also, come out as a Mid not a throw/grab) Buff
· F4, 1, D2, U2
o U2 is at least 0 on block Buff
o U2 has enough hit advantage to follow up with Sceptor Slam and Sceptor Launch Buff
o Gap between D2 and U2
o Note: Apply the same changes to F3, 1, D2, U2
· Krushing Shoulder – Can combo off it with Sceptor Slam/Sceptor Launch Buff
Both Impostor and Necromancer:
· Krushing Shoulder – Able to juggle off it with F22 Buff
· F2, 2, 4
o Fix hit box issues; some female characters low profile this mid hitting string while crouching or crouch blocking. Buff
o Add more cancel advantage frames to '4' Buff
o Less minus on block (currently -17) Buff
· Amulet Strike
o Reduce start up frames Buff
o Reduce recovery frames Buff
o Safe on block (around -5/-6) Buff
o Made into a Mid instead of a High. Buff
o Implement one of the 3 following options: Buff
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, 20-25% of a meter is gained
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, 2% of health is gained back
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, the next time Amulet Strike is used, it comes out faster with projectile absorbing properties, ~10% damage, ~3% chip damage, and at least neutral on block (similar to Ronin Takeda's Piercing Beam)
ikr? stealing a bar from the opponent? That'd give mystic ermacs ex push a run for its moneyWhat drugs are you on?
I know Impostor is situational/mu-dependent but the fact is you can do things INTO mimicry without meter in the first place, then depending on the move you steal you might use meter for vortex or other combos.Impostor is a very situational/mu dependant variation. You need mimicry to hit and steal a decent move to do damage without meter.
Impostor situational???? Yeah right. That variation is well rounded and can hold its own with almost any variation in the game. And why are Shinnok players complaining about having to use meter for big damage? He can build meter no problem. It is up to the player to manage it properly so that you get the most from meter dependant characters.Impostor is a very situational/mu dependant variation. You need mimicry to hit and steal a decent move to do damage without meter.
So where did my post go?I know Impostor is situational/mu-dependent but the fact is you can do things INTO mimicry without meter in the first place, then depending on the move you steal you might use meter for vortex or other combos.
TL;DR: Make Shinnok top 3. This list is insane.Please Calf, add all the suggested changes at the top of the thread (as seen here: https://testyourmight.com/threads/with-the-kp2-patch-coming-up-what-buffs-nerfs-should-shinnok-receive.57844/) I was gonna make this thread lol but you beat me to it. Anyways, the changes I want are:
Here are the changes I still want implemented from the KP2 Thread
- OTG doesn't scale
- Can Mimicry and Scoop after Krushing Shoulder
- Krushing Shoulder's Spark on hit comes out on block as well leaving him at -7 but there is a gap between the spark and the hit from the shoulder
- Standing 4 faster start-up
- F2 is -3
- Less Push Back on Amulet Curse
- F3 faster start-up
- B2 is +6 on block (gets the big leg treatment)
- Amulet Strike steals bar from the opponent
- Mimicry steals bar from the opponent
- Increased range on Scepter Slam/Launch
- Amulet Curse has more pop-up/launch
- Ex-Dark Beam is +16
- Increased Vertical Hitbox on F4
- Amulet Strike is -5
- Krushing Shoulder pops them towards Shinnok not away
- Make D2 a mid
- Make Krushing Shoulder safe
- Make Charging Shoulder safe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Universal:
· Standing 3 – Now a Low instead of a Mid Buff
· Standing 4 – Now a Mid instead of a High Buff
· F2 – 2 frames off the start up frames (Down to 15 in Non-Bone Shaper; Down to 17 in Bone Shaper) Buff
· B1 – Increased push-back (enough for all 3 Hell Sparks to connect on block) Buff
· Damage – Increased damage output overall Buff
· 11 – Fix hit box issues Buff
· X-Ray – Bitch slaps into Brutality
Necromancer:
· Devil’s Flick
o Improve tracking Buff
o Reduced start up frames Buff
o Reverted back to -4 on block Buff
· Summoned Fiend
o Improve tracking Buff
o Safe(r) on block Buff
o Becomes a Low Buff
o Reduce start up frames (fast enough to anti-air) Buff
o Able to Brutality off of
· Judgment Fist
o Becomes an 11 Frame Overhead instead of Unblockable (similar to Tremor’s Rock Drop) Buff
o Cancel-able if it does not become an 11 frame overhead (cancel similar to MK9 Jax’s Ground Pound) Buff
o Note: Judgment Smash still remains a slow unblockable. with it able to still crush opponents on delayed wake-up.
· Judgment Smash – Cancel-able but faster than Judgment Fist's cancel (like the difference in advantage between cancelling LK's fire ball and cancelling his Ex-fire ball) Buff
· Summoned Slam
o Able to utilize twice in one combo Buff
o Armored Buff
· Variation Aesthetics – Remove silly bone hands in exchange for another aesthetic identifier (possibly Pimp Rings)
Impostor:
· Stolen Moves – Different stolen moves from the following characters:
o Kenshi; currently steals Rising Sword
o Takeda; currently steals Tornado Kick
o Jacqui; currently steals Bionic Dash
o Ferra/Torr; currently steals Deep Stab
o Raiden; currently steals Electric Fly
o Goro; currently steals Stomp
o Jason; currently steals Killing Machine
o Predator; currently steals Stealth
· Mimicry
o Kenshi – Steal “Blade Reflect” or “Rising Karma” instead of “Rising Sword”
o Takeda – Steal “Fist Whirlwind” instead of “Tornado Kick”
o Raiden – Steal “Shocker” instead of “Electric Fly”
o Predator – Steal “Scimitar Slam” instead of “Stealth”, or add the ability to combo into Mimicry while Stealth is already active at the cost of removing the invisibility.
o Add an Enhanced Mimicry or a MB version of Mimicry with the following properties:
- Armor while using the stolen move Buff
- Gains the Ex-properties of the stolen move if he does not already Buff
- Able to hit full screen like Quan Chi's trance Buff
· Air-Tricky Portal
o Can Air-Tricky Portal while grounded (just Tricky Portal); Ex-Version of grounded Tricky Portal with armor upon reaching the destination Shinnok teleported to. Buff
o Can teleport in place, in addition to behind or in front of the opponent. Buff
Bone Shaper:
· Dark Beam – Revert to -8 on block instead of -12. Buff
· F221+3 – Make the “1+3” part of the string able to come out on block (currently +2 but not possible to come out and block; also, come out as a Mid not a throw/grab) Buff
· F4, 1, D2, U2
o U2 is at least 0 on block Buff
o U2 has enough hit advantage to follow up with Sceptor Slam and Sceptor Launch Buff
o Gap between D2 and U2
o Note: Apply the same changes to F3, 1, D2, U2
· Krushing Shoulder – Can combo off it with Sceptor Slam/Sceptor Launch Buff
Both Impostor and Necromancer:
· Krushing Shoulder – Able to juggle off it with F22 Buff
· F2, 2, 4
o Fix hit box issues; some female characters low profile this mid hitting string while crouching or crouch blocking. Buff
o Add more cancel advantage frames to '4' Buff
o Less minus on block (currently -17) Buff
· Amulet Strike
o Reduce start up frames Buff
o Reduce recovery frames Buff
o Safe on block (around -5/-6) Buff
o Made into a Mid instead of a High. Buff
o Implement one of the 3 following options: Buff
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, 20-25% of a meter is gained
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, 2% of health is gained back
- When Shinnok negates a projectile, the next time Amulet Strike is used, it comes out faster with projectile absorbing properties, ~10% damage, ~3% chip damage, and at least neutral on block (similar to Ronin Takeda's Piercing Beam)
I don't know about safer but making it quicker startup for when you read a run that HS is too slow to hit or wanna nullify a projectile would be cool.make meterless amulet safer, i don't get why the move is unsafe when it doesnt really do much, its not even a projectile like dark beam in boneshaper.
nah, forget that, f4 is good enough for that. making amulet -5 would be fine.I don't know about safer but making it quicker startup for when you read a run that HS is too slow to hit or wanna nullify a projectile would be cool.
F4 nullifies projectiles? Shit no wonder everyone says Wound downplays.nah, forget that, f4 is good enough for that. making amulet -5 would be fine.
no, im saying the nullification of a projectile isnt that big of a deal when u can just avoid them completely, i'd prefer a safe amulet over one doing something that i'd hardly bother with in the first place.F4 nullifies projectiles? Shit no wonder everyone says Wound downplays.
I don't want every buff, but just a list of possible buffs lolTL;DR: Make Shinnok top 3. This list is insane.
^THIS!!!!^ A thousand times!!!!!! @ArmedCalf please add this to the OP. It is like the most important thing ever!With the patch looming, this has to come to light as much as possible in hopes its addressed. Besides Necro's need for obvious buffs, I feel the only buffs the other two variations need are in regards to hitboxes and I hope they are seriously addressed.
This is just a recent example but this has been an issue for over 6 months now when trying to pressure characters using block strings with Shinnok:
It's one thing to be outplayed. It's another to lose because your characters hit boxes are incredibly inconsistent in certain match ups (Kano, D'Vorah, Kitana, etc). Somethings gotta give on one side of this problem: Increase Shinnok's hitboxes or increase the problematic characters hurtboxes.
- F2(2) whiffing on small hurt box, crouched characters.
- 1(1)2 whiffing point blank after a JiP.
- 31(2) whiffing at point blank due to random pushback issues from breathing hitboxes.
- Ji4~Tele~Ji1, 2(2) whiffing mainly in the corner during Impostor corner pressure.
#makenetherrealmgreatagain