What's new

Cyrax 80% (No Reset)

Mickael

Noob
Even with all the hating about the resets and the damage, we're seeing a sub player, a LIU KANG player and a milleena player on evo's top 8, and none of those are top tier like cyrax is considered. What im trying to say is, that if the resets made cyrax's game so easy or such an easy character, wouldn't we see 8 cyrax players at the top 8? Thing is he not only has bad matchups, bad normals and a bad wake-up game; he's a difficult character to use. You have to be skilled and relatively intelligent to use him and manage his setups, because everyone here knows that if you're just trying to fish for resets you ain't gonna win shit. He isn't built to effortlessly dominate like reptile, kabal, lao and raiden, you actually have to work to fight off his weaknesses. I think im unbeatable with him but i also acknowledge that while his strengths are overwhelming, his weaknesses are a pain in the ass.
IMHO, if these 80% damage resets had been found a couple of months ago before EVO players had committed to who they'd play with, then we'd see at least a couple Cyrax's in the Top 8. (barring any patch before hand)
 
I think most of the major points have been made. Even in the bracket of 64 after pools I saw very little Cyrax representation as I was watching matches play out. I'll be honest, the resets may be a little ridiculous but it obviously isn't what Cyrax actually needs.

I'd happily trade resets for some decent strings to add pressure, 1,1 and 3,3 are the only ones of any use outside of combos which is pretty pathetic compared to some kung lao strings that do 9% in chip damage alone after low hat making it practically unpunishable. As mentioned many times he has no real high low game at all and command throw is unbelievably easy to break these days. I personally think Cyrax gets outzoned by every zoner except sub-zero (which is why I get why so many sub players are always here) since net is slower (or seems like it is) than a lot of projectiles and does no chip damage. Bombs outside of planned setups are embarrassingly easy to avoid. However, his high damage with or without resets makes up for this weakness in some matches but not in others. Raiden is a ridiculously bad match-up because he can just mash teleport out of every setup that isn't a guaranteed reset and go into string pressure for easy chip damage if not combos.

The other major weakness I see in Cyrax's match-ups is he doesn't have a good get the fuck off me/check move outside of invincibility on wake up moves. Examples are things like superman tackle, ermac's force push, reptile run, Kano upball, of course Lao spin. Most of the other zoners I can think of have one of these moves and it keeps overly aggressive players honest. Rax and Sub both suffer in this department but clone isn't too bad if you have a little bit of breathing room.

At any rate these are just the things I see in my experience, maybe people will figure out ways around these things in the future. For now, I'd like to see some buffs to help with his bad matches alongside the nerfs because it should be obvious by now that he hasn't won a single major and has had less top 8 placings than any other supposed top tier, yet people always complain about him more than anything. I once read an article on SRK that talked about how scrubs always call throws cheap because it takes people out of their comfort zone of "I'm blocking therefore I should always be safe", Cyrax seems to be a prime villain for that kind of thinking.

That's the end of my 2 am rant after a less than desired performance at evo :] back to the lab for me!
 

NariTuba

disMember
That's the end of my 2 am rant after a less than desired performance at evo :] back to the lab for me!
I was looking forward to watching your matches TC but I dont think any of them were streamed... were they? You have a great Cyrax man, keep at it!
 

Mt. Mutombo

Asshole by nature
IMHO, if these 80% damage resets had been found a couple of months ago before EVO play7ers had committed to who they'd play with, then we'd see at least a couple Cyrax's in the Top 8. (barring any patch before hand)
Doubt it, most of the resets are at least a month old. So you're meaning to tell me that a dedicated cyrax player wouldn't train or incorporate a 60 to 80% reset one month prior to evo? That makes no sense, the minute i saw the 75% reset i got back to lab to perfect it and mastered it in a day in a half. Again it's not about the damage kiddo, it's about his play style, he's not an easy character to master plus he doesn't have the best of matchups. You want an example? Look at the Maxter v Reo match at salty battles, milleena zones cyrax so bad that it's difficult as fuck to land a reset or even get close. It's like in basketball, you can have a 70 inch vertical and dunk like blake griffin but if your jumpshot sucks and the defender doesn't let you penetrate to the basket you can't do shit, all you can do is throw bricks and hope for the best. I know you dig the analogy brah!
 

Mickael

Noob
Trophy Club: " I once read an article on SRK that talked about how scrubs always call throws cheap because it takes people out of their comfort zone of "I'm blocking therefore I should always be safe", Cyrax seems to be a prime villain for that kind of thinking."

This is very true.

Trophy Club: "For now, I'd like to see some buffs to help with his bad matches alongside the nerfs because it should be obvious by now that he hasn't won a single major and has had less top 8 placings than any other supposed top tier, yet people always complain about him more than anything"

This not as much. ..or do I not have the official "top tier" list? I think most complaints are on Kung Lao still, and with Raiden.
 
Cyrax is a pretty decent character. Sure he has damage, but most of his strings suck, his teleport is slow, and his buzz saw is more punishable than a missed spear. So stop complaining about his damage please.
 

TONY-T

Mad scientist
im ok with cyrax the way he is, but i do agree he suffers against good zoners and rush down characters. If he were to get a buff, id like it to be a safe teleport. I think this would help him alot. As it is, teleport is almost useless against someone who knows what there doing..
 
I was looking forward to watching your matches TC but I dont think any of them were streamed... were they? You have a great Cyrax man, keep at it!
I didn't get any matches on stream unfortunately :[. It was too bad as well, I'd really like to watch my matches with AKA's Mileena and study up on it a bit.

At any rate, I didn't mean to come off as saying Cyrax is bad, quite the opposite. I'd just like to see some improvements amongst the inevitable take aways he'll get every time a new trap comes out :p
 

PND_Mustard

"More stealthful than the night"
Premium Supporter
in all honesty cyrax needs his reset taken and he'll be fine, no buffs, no nerfs, fine, he has more than enough at his disposal to win matches, he has downsides sure, as does every other character in this game :p, can't have a character with zero weaknesses
 

Sasuga

Noob
Jup, thats 80% of your precious life and an hour and a half of your precious time, down the drain. ^^
 

Mickael

Noob
in all honesty cyrax needs his reset taken and he'll be fine, no buffs, no nerfs, fine, he has more than enough at his disposal to win matches, he has downsides sure, as does every other character in this game :p, can't have a character with zero weaknesses
Agreed. and while where at it with simple solutions, Kung Lao just needs his spin move to have more recovery frames for full combo punishes and he'll still be in a tier almost by himself and that's ok.... and I don't play him.
 
Jup, thats 80% of your precious life and an hour and a half of your precious time, down the drain. ^^
It really does suck that people put countless hours into a character and discover things by trial and error only to have it removed in the end. Your hard work really does go down the drain. I'm in the process of switching characters, don't know who yet but I'm definitely switching to a low tier character. I'm thinking Baraka, Jax, or Stryker. My number one choice for now is Baraka. At least I know they won't get nerfed and my strategies will work, since people don't seem to be paying attention to those chars. No one asks for nerfs or buffs on them. They are nonexistent.
 
Cyrax has no decent pressure strings and his wakeups are terrible. He can't do repeated high chip damage block strings like the other top tiers can. He can't follow up these block strings with mix ups like kung lao, and he needs to use a meter to stop pressure on wakeup. These are seriously bad weaknesses to have. Reset damage isn't going to win anything against anyone who understands not to use a breaker unless they are getting hit on the ground, or got netted while they are on the ground.

High damage resets only matter against people that don't know what Cyrax can do. People in tournaments know about him. that's why no one wins tournaments with him or plays him. The people that bitch about him aren't high ranking tournament players. Not to mention bitching doesn't matter because 95% damage for one punish is stupid, broken, and being removed.

NRS has the option to put a proper fix in place that allows for removal of the bomb resets without making people completely re-learn their character. I've heard that complaint from cyrax mains too, "wtf I don't want to have to relearn my main!"

Well, plead with NRS to do the right thing and only extend the duration of time it takes for damage to reset, making it last longer than it takes for a bomb to explode. You'll still have your big damage combos, just not two to three in one, and your style of play will be exactly the same.
 

Lyuben

Sinestro's might!
Cyrax has no decent pressure strings and his wakeups are terrible. He can't do repeated high chip damage block strings like the other top tiers can. He can't follow up these block strings with mix ups like kung lao, and he needs to use a meter to stop pressure on wakeup. These are seriously bad weaknesses to have. Reset damage isn't going to win anything against anyone who understands not to use a breaker unless they are getting hit on the ground, or got netted while they are on the ground.

High damage resets only matter against people that don't know what Cyrax can do. People in tournaments know about him. that's why no one wins tournaments with him or plays him. The people that bitch about him aren't high ranking tournament players. Not to mention bitching doesn't matter because 95% damage for one punish is stupid, broken, and being removed.

NRS has the option to put a proper fix in place that allows for removal of the bomb resets without making people completely re-learn their character. I've heard that complaint from cyrax mains too, "wtf I don't want to have to relearn my main!"

Well, plead with NRS to do the right thing and only extend the duration of time it takes for damage to reset, making it last longer than it takes for a bomb to explode. You'll still have your big damage combos, just not two to three in one, and your style of play will be exactly the same.
Even with his 55% bnb he is good. Not all characters are meant to be like Kung Lao. So dont compare against him, he is what we DO NOT want, not what we should all compare against and aspire to be. He can have good wake ups with ex ragdoll. He also has 212 which is safe. His ex teleport can stop jump ins and punish nicely.
 

Mt. Mutombo

Asshole by nature
Even with his 55% bnb he is good. Not all characters are meant to be like Kung Lao. So dont compare against him, he is what we DO NOT want, not what we should all compare against and aspire to be. He can have good wake ups with ex ragdoll. He also has 212 which is safe. His ex teleport can stop jump ins and punish nicely.
He has no wake-up, all of his wake-up options can be poked out of. Do you know how awesome it is to use EX ragdoll and EX teleport to get out of pressure from a damn liu kang only to have him poke you out of it? I would kill 7 babies just for armor in any of his ex wakeups!
 

babalook

Noob
they should make the last hit of 212 special cancel able, and im pretty damn sure EX ragdol is punishable so basicaly it's just sub's slide but requires meter
 

TONY-T

Mad scientist
Even with his 55% bnb he is good. Not all characters are meant to be like Kung Lao. So dont compare against him, he is what we DO NOT want, not what we should all compare against and aspire to be. He can have good wake ups with ex ragdoll. He also has 212 which is safe. His ex teleport can stop jump ins and punish nicely.
His 2,1,2 can be interupted after the 1 on block, it can also be punished by certain characters after the last 2 on block. 3,3 isnt safe, the second hit can be block ducked and punished, 1,2,1 can be punished on block and 1,2 can also be ducked and punished. 1,1,1 can be ducked and punished. 2,2,f+1 can be blocked and punished. his only safe string is 2,1, and 2,2, but there also his slowest strings.

cyraxs poke game is a little lacking when compared to other characters, you really have to mix them up to make them work.