Combo List - Kitana Kitana Combo thread

[The Magician]

That's first week stuff, it's time to move on. We figured out what to do once we get a hold of our opponent already, but how do you get in position to do these combos? How important is stage control vs going for max damage in specific match ups? When should you rush down instead of zone? How do you counter all the Quancheese? What to do when getting out zoned? This is the type of stuff that should be discussed right now.

I saw several MKX tournament streams over the weekend, and not one had a Kitana that impressed me. We need to come up with some serious counter strats to all this and more, not show off impractical combos and "option selects." Seriously, if you need to option select with Kitana you're playing her wrong.

And I did more than just a couple combo videos, I made a whole thread on Strats specific to the Mournful variation, which I think far outshines Assassin or Royal Storm in most match ups.

You can't really discuss how to get in, in-depth; it's pretty much intuitive. How to get in will vary on each matchup and your opponent. What we can discuss is how the matchups are played in terms of punishes, frames, etc, and there is a thread for that already.

 

[Awsumpossm]

That's first week stuff, it's time to move on. We figured out what to do once we get a hold of our opponent already, but how do you get in position to do these combos? How important is stage control vs going for max damage

I don't understand. You're in a thread dedicated to combos, complaining about lack of discussion concerning spacing and opening up opponents.....

When there's another thread dedicated to exactly that.

 

[The Magician]

Not sure I've seen this combo anywhere else, I use this as one of my main BnB's for meterless corner:

 

[Inception]

50% damage

 

[The Magician]

43% Meterless Corner I made up, not sure if I've seen this posted on the forums anywhere else.

 

[Xero_18]

That's first week stuff, it's time to move on. We figured out what to do once we get a hold of our opponent already, but how do you get in position to do these combos? How important is stage control vs going for max damage in specific match ups? When should you rush down instead of zone? How do you counter all the Quancheese? What to do when getting out zoned? This is the type of stuff that should be discussed right now.

I saw several MKX tournament streams over the weekend, and not one had a Kitana that impressed me. We need to come up with some serious counter strats to all this and more, not show off impractical combos and "option selects." Seriously, if you need to option select with Kitana you're playing her wrong.

And I did more than just a couple combo videos, I made a whole thread on Strats specific to the Mournful variation, which I think far outshines Assassin or Royal Storm in most match ups.

You miss the point of option selects then. The point, which should be fairly obvious, is to hit confirm (something the game lacks, while still being able to cover your ass when it don't work out all for the same input or in other words, not over committing.

As for combos you're right there are numerous ways to get damage with Kitana it's all about know how But the game is only 2 and half weeks old. You aren't going to see "impressive" Kitana's or anyone just yet cuz the game is still new and people are getting a handle of things, even the good players. You're sounding like one of those people who creates tier lists at the end of the first month right now.

As for mournful variation the only thing it has on the other variations is the unique angles on glaives but the overall damage output without meter is horrible. It's pretty much the variation you use for up close combat but without the damage output and mixup.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

You can't really discuss how to get in, in-depth; it's pretty much intuitive. How to get in will vary on each matchup and your opponent. What we can discuss is how the matchups are played in terms of punishes, frames, etc, and there is a thread for that already.

I posted here because this thread seems to be getting the majority of the attention and I wanted to voice my concern where the most people would see it. There is plenty to be discussed and I feel like other characters are developing at a much faster rate than Kitana. For many people Getting in on their opponent is not inuititve hence the reason noobs might visit the forums.

Plus most of the chatter is only about Assassin or Royal Storm. The only thing those two do significantly better than Mournful are air to air conversions, but once people get comfortable with Run canceling none of that will matter much. Mournful can still get 30% or more meterless damage, coupled with the chip the opponent has to take she's killing in 3 strong combos. It's easy to zone out scrubs, but at a higher level players with good movement are gonna force you to fight on the ground. What are you gonna do when the rune traps and Puggles come for dat ass! You need armor, and none of the options in RS or AS are safe.

 

[Xero_18]

I posted here because this thread seems to be getting the majority of the attention and I wanted to voice my concern where the most people would see it. There is plenty to be discussed and I feel like other characters are developing at a much faster rate than Kitana. For many people Getting in on their opponent is not inuititve hence the reason noobs might visit the forums.

Plus most of the chatter is only about Assassin or Royal Storm. The only thing those two do significantly better than Mournful are air to air conversions, but once people get comfortable with Run canceling none of that will matter much. Mournful can still get 30% or more meterless damage, coupled with the chip the opponent has to take she's killing in 3 strong combos. It's easy to zone out scrubs, but at a higher level players with good movement are gonna force you to fight on the ground. What are you gonna do when the rune traps and Puggles come for dat ass! You need armor, and none of the options in RS or AS are safe.

What are you considering as a safe wakeup for Mournful though? Everything is pretty punishable either on recovery or by ducking. I don't think any of her options are safe like others. Honestly the only perk of Mournful is the control with glaive but the inability to deal decent damage without meter is a drawback. If she gained some magical overhead chain that leads to some kind of combo she'd be better but she is incredibly lacking in this variation especially with air control

With all that being said I figured I'd try it out to see if I could come up with some more combos and to test the recoveries on her moves. Apparently she's more unsafe than I thought on wakeup, at least with Shadow Kick. If your opponent reads you well enough the only thing you can do on wakeup is wakeup staff which has worse recovery than a blocked fan. While it may not be common place at the moment it's definitely not hard at all to force the pass through.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

What are you considering as a safe wakeup for Mournful though? Everything is pretty punishable either on recovery or by ducking. I don't think any of her options are safe like others. Honestly the only perk of Mournful is the control with glaive but the inability to deal decent damage without meter is a drawback. If she gained some magical overhead chain that leads to some kind of combo she'd be better but she is incredibly lacking in this variation especially with air control

Shadow Kick hits high but is safer on block. Staff grab hits mid and is only punished

What are you considering as a safe wakeup for Mournful though? Everything is pretty punishable either on recovery or by ducking. I don't think any of her options are safe like others. Honestly the only perk of Mournful is the control with glaive but the inability to deal decent damage without meter is a drawback. If she gained some magical overhead chain that leads to some kind of combo she'd be better but she is incredibly lacking in this variation especially with air control

With all that being said I figured I'd try it out to see if I could come up with some more combos and to test the recoveries on her moves. Apparently she's more unsafe than I thought on wakeup, at least with Shadow Kick. If your opponent reads you well enough the only thing you can do on wakeup is wakeup staff which has worse recovery than a blocked fan. While it may not be common place at the moment it's definitely not hard at all to force the pass through.

EX Shadow Kick is only -8 on block, EX Staff grab is -12. They have to make a read and just duck to punish shadow kick which leaves them open to eating 17% from EX Staff Grab. If they know to duck that means they aren't putting you in a 50/50 situation nearly as often. Plus EX Shadow kick has armor and travels over 2/3 of the screen, on hit it sends them flying full screen so you can start zoning again or push them to the corner.

Glaive is only -3, if they try to attack after blocking that you can bully them with EX Shadow kick or EX Staff grab just to make them respect the option when you have meter. It does wonders for her pressure game. EX glaive can even stop Xrays with the return hit since most only have armor during the initial frames. A returning glaive grants you a full F3 combo.

You don't need to control the air with fans, just chip them out with glaive and punish jumps with shadow kick. Air glaive makes it so that they can't zone you at full screen so they have to advance on you or do an unsafe teleport.

Her meterless damage can hit the 30's and easily hit 40 with 1 bar. You'll be building a lot of meter anyway with all the glaives you should be throwing and the block string glaive traps you should be using.

 

[Xero_18]

Shadow Kick hits high but is safer on block. Staff grab hits mid and is only punished


EX Shadow Kick is only -8 on block, EX Staff grab is -12. They have to make a read and just duck to punish shadow kick which leaves them open to eating 17% from EX Staff Grab. If they know to duck that means they aren't putting you in a 50/50 situation nearly as often. Plus EX Shadow kick has armor and travels over 2/3 of the screen, on hit it sends them flying full screen so you can start zoning again or push them to the corner.

Glaive is only -3, if they try to attack after blocking that you can bully them with EX Shadow kick or EX Staff grab just to make them respect the option when you have meter. It does wonders for her pressure game. EX glaive can even stop Xrays with the return hit since most only have armor during the initial frames. A returning glaive grants you a full F3 combo.

You don't need to control the air with fans, just chip them out with glaive and punish jumps with shadow kick. Air glaive makes it so that they can't zone you at full screen so they have to advance on you or do an unsafe teleport.

Her meterless damage can hit the 30's and easily hit 40 with 1 bar. You'll be building a lot of meter anyway with all the glaives you should be throwing and the block string glaive traps you should be using.

I'm messing around with it now but it really just makes me want to go back to RS. I see myself using it for a matchup or two but the potential is just much higher with the other two variations.

 

[The Magician]

I'm messing around with it now but it really just makes me want to go back to RS. I see myself using it for a matchup or two but the potential is just much higher with the other two variations.

At a tournament level, I can see mournful competing with both variations. Shadow Kick is really strong and staff grab can be used as an anti-air with a hard knockdown 100% of the time so you can set up more pressure. We'll have to see though, only one major has been played and no kitana's were in the pools; can't really judge how bad/good each variation until we get solid match evidence from tournaments.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

I'm messing around with it now but it really just makes me want to go back to RS. I see myself using it for a matchup or two but the potential is just much higher with the other two variations.

Fair enough, Mournful is a completely different play style. It's basically the way I would play Jade in MK9 without an overhead starter. I personally Prefer having stronger wake ups and rush down options to converting damage off air fans though. You can build meter almost as fast as you use it in Mournful, so her meterless damage should be a deterrent.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

At a tournament level, I can see mournful competing with both variations. Shadow Kick is really strong and staff grab can be used as an anti-air with a hard knockdown 100% of the time so you can set up more pressure. We'll have to see though, only one major has been played and no kitana's were in the pools; can't really judge how bad/good each variation until we get solid match evidence from tournaments.

Unless it's EX Staff grab I would just stick with Shadow Kick as an anti air or Upraise if they are closer for meterless options. I've been hit out of regular Staff grab way to often for it to be considered a viable anti air. I mainly use Staff Grab as a combo ender, or to keep them honest on my wake up so they are forced to block Shadow Kick.

Battle and Brew just happened tonight, Hope there was a Mournful in there, and then another Tournament is happening tomorrow, definitely gonna watch.

 

[Xero_18]

I could see that. I'll keep messing around with it but the few things I see RS and Assassin having over Mournful are the unbreakable setups. It makes zoning that much better and while you can duck under fans they can hold you in place better.

 

[The Magician]

39% for mid-low midscreen: b14 db1 f43 f43 21 JiK AF dash f4 db3. If anyone has anything thats more damage than that please tell me; I was practicing earlier and couldn't get more out of it.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

I could see that. I'll keep messing around with it but the few things I see RS and Assassin having over Mournful are the unbreakable setups. It makes zoning that much better and while you can duck under fans they can hold you in place better.

Very rarely do you NEED unbreakable damage. I'd much rather force them to burn the meter and give me the advantage once again. If they don't have meter they don't have armor, and are forced to eat what ever EX Glaive chip string I want to put them in (which builds more meter for me) or die from my next 40% combo. I've got a feeling Run canceling will destroy fan zoning strats pretty soon anyway...

Meter building here works the same way it did in MK9. Every attack they blocks does chip damage and builds meter for me while they get none!

You should watch some of my matches. I'm not say they are a true demonstration of skill but you can see some of the things I've been talking about in action. Everything is in My Mournful thread.

http://testyourmight.com/threads/mournful-kombos-and-general-strategy-video-inputs.50243/page-2#post-1690144

 

[Xero_18]

I don't see run becoming that big of a deal once smart play comes into it she's pretty mobile herself. I get unbreakable damage often. It's quite fun getting the hit off a mixup with her and them hearing people try to mash out from a combo only to get 30+ percent. Thats another part I like about RS, I can always convert my combos on the fly if I notice I give them bar again for a combo breaker and since they have meter it becomes much easier to bait armored attacks.

EDIT: Now I want to go back to Mournful just so I can push limits...ಠ_ಠ

If we could combo from crouching pokes she'd have a way to get glaive then lift from a ground string without them juggling.

 

[Xero_18]

... damnit now I want to test more stuff out and if it plays out I may decide to pick this variation up

 

[The Magician]

I don't see run becoming that big of a deal once smart play comes into it she's pretty mobile herself. I get unbreakable damage often. It's quite fun getting the hit off a mixup with her and them hearing people try to mash out from a combo only to get 30+ percent. Thats another part I like about RS, I can always convert my combos on the fly if I notice I give them bar again for a combo breaker and since they have meter it becomes much easier to bait armored attacks.

EDIT: Now I want to go back to Mournful just so I can push limits...ಠ_ಠ

If we could combo from crouching pokes she'd have a way to get glaive then lift from a ground string without them juggling.

If only Mournful added good overhead/low mixups, then she'd be like Covert ops Sonya.

 

[Xero_18]

If only Mournful added good overhead/low mixups, then she'd be like Covert ops Sonya.

Can you explain to me how the game treats combos that are strictly on the ground? As in does the combo wear off and they can block or can you keep going if you don't juggle them? If it doesn't wear off then Kitana may have an infinite

 

[The Magician]

Can you explain to me how the game treats combos that are strictly on the ground? As in does the combo wear off and they can block or can you keep going if you don't juggle them? If it doesn't wear off then Kitana may have an infinite

I'm not sure, if its anything like MK9's grounding combos, then yeah you can keep going. In the testing Jacqui had a potential infinite with her 11 into rocket(i think df2?) before they breaker, but it could go on for infinity. Also Liu Kang's infinite block string that Tom Brady showed on stream. I'm not sure if that technically answers your question, but it could give you some ideas.

If I pulled an all-nighter I could probably answer your question by tomorrow in terms of the behavior of ground strings(big day tomorrow though).

 

[Xero_18]

I just answered it lol thanks though. Mournful Kitana has a corner infinite. My execution ain't perfect as I'm on pad but once I mod my stick I should be able to get more reps consistently. The only thing about it though is the damage scales to shit relatively quick BUT it let's you set up some stuff as far as wake up

 

[The Magician]

I just answered it lol thanks though. Mournful Kitana has a corner infinite. My execution ain't perfect as I'm on pad but once I mod my stick I should be able to get more reps consistently. The only thing about it though is the damage scales to shit relatively quick BUT it let's you set up some stuff as far as wake up

Now I'm curious to what it is, might have to turn on my PS4 and figure it out now.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

Can you explain to me how the game treats combos that are strictly on the ground? As in does the combo wear off and they can block or can you keep going if you don't juggle them? If it doesn't wear off then Kitana may have an infinite

You can only EX glaive twice before they can block it, but that will net you about 30% before you even launch them. Gravity doesn't start to increase until the first hit that launches, and it will increase at the normal rate.

 

[ThaRawDeal]

I just answered it lol thanks though. Mournful Kitana has a corner infinite. My execution ain't perfect as I'm on pad but once I mod my stick I should be able to get more reps consistently. The only thing about it though is the damage scales to shit relatively quick BUT it let's you set up some stuff as far as wake up

Yeah EX glaive will help you stuff wake up attempts and full combo punish.