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Question One of the most useless traits?

Does Killer Frost have one of the most useless traits in the game? I have yet to see it used in high-level play. Balrog never used it that I saw. 16 Bit never used it as far as I saw. I know folks had fun making videos showing high-damage combos using the trait, which is probably part of what freaked everyone out in what I thought was an overestimation of how good she was. Now, I'm not necessarily calling for a buff here. Whether she 'needs' a better trait is a separate issue. Replying, "Dude, she's fine, she doesn't need anything else," is non-responsive to the question. My query is just whether her trait has any use or do we have basically a useless button. The only time her trait was ever 'used' that I saw was for trait cancels and that was taken away. It is pretty sad when the only time the trait was ever used was for a trait cancel, and even that gets nixed. Ok, I guess you can use it for an Iceburg fake, but how often does that happen? And if the best use for the trait is to fake another move, that is not saying much. I mean, is there a single example of tournament play where someone actually managed to charge her trait and land one of those u3x9 combos or is that just something that is fun to make videos in the lab?

Most of the cast have traits that are useful. Some are great, like Superman, Black Adam, Batman, Aquaman, and more. The newest characters, Zod, MMH, Zatanna, all have cool-looking traits. Some characters are lower tier, but their trait is still really useful, like Ares. Even Bane actually has a trait that gets used. Scorpion's trait is useful. Right now though, it seems Frost is in the company of a handful of characters, like Cyborg, who have a trait that is really too slow to get going. Maybe Deathstroke's because his is slow. Lobo's is kind of lame b/c you just get 4% more damage, whoop-dee-do. Still, most of the cast, 20+ of them, almost all but a handful, have a trait that actually gets USED during high-level play. Are there any high-level players running KF who actually incorporate the trait in their game plan? Did I miss a tournament stream where someone actually charged up the trait and used it effectively? Or am I right, that it is just too slow to charge up to be worthwhile? Normally it seems no one even bothers trying to charge it up and use it, just don't even bother with it all. Thoughts?
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Unfortunately, after the last balance patch KF's trait usefulness took a nose dive. She is still an amazing character, but a lot of the damage scaling made the extra damage you would normally try to go after with trait nullified... so now there is not much of a point. There are still elaborate trait setups that exist, but in high level play they are not worth going for because of simple risk versus reward. All just my opinion as things stand now...which isn't to say that better/more practical uses won't be found as time goes on.

Personally, the only time I use the charge is to fake an iceberg, or after a command grab freeze just to charge it a bit before I go into the 50-50. That way if I am able to activate it I will be going into a 50-50 with increased damage potential.
 

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
The trait cancel bullshit was like Kabal's rushdown and had to go. Let's see how long you guys go until you bitch about the damage you lost...and then realize how much more you have to work to get relevant damamge.
 

trustinme

xbl-OBS trustinme
The trait cancel bullshit was like Kabal's rushdown and had to go. Let's see how long you guys go until you ***** about the damage you lost...and then realize how much more you have to work to get relevant damamge.
lmao! Wtf are u talking about? That post makes no sense whatsoever dude,unless your trying to be funny.
 

PoweredbyProtein

Eternal student
You could use her trait in a way to get advantage on blockstrings before it got patched out. It was stupid.
You couldn't use it to the extent that Kabal could pressure with Nomad dash canceling. You're exaggeratin- unless you're not. Was it really that good? I saw no footage and never played anyone that used that.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
The trait cancel bullshit was like Kabal's rushdown and had to go. Let's see how long you guys go until you bitch about the damage you lost...and then realize how much more you have to work to get relevant damamge.
Yeah the trait cancel was cheap and I think everyone agrees it was OP since she would get 50-50s off block strings. However, as much as you want this community to be a bunch of whining babies about nerfs, you are fishing in the wrong pond.
 

Konqrr

MK11 Kabal = MK9 Kitana
It is still useful, but you have to sacrifice potential resets to build it up. However, the setup I have couples as bait ^_^
 

Belial

Kombatant
I think its pretty usable in Aquaman MU. If it would build faster that would be much more usable.
 

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
I've implemented it into my gameplay in two-three ways, actually.

1. AGAINST CONSTANTLY BLOCKING OPPONENTS: If I notice that the opponent blocks more and doesn't press buttons or back dashes a lot to escape pressure, I do 1114 into mixup. You still have frame advantage, and so when they see the trait cancel (which 65-79% do not expect because no one does so anymore) they won't be able to react to the following slide or f3. After subsequent 111 pressure, you can 1114 then backdash. If they try to punish with a meaty string, slide will catch them off guard. If they tried to grab, you'd usually avoid such. The REAL meat of doing this, while not as ideal as prior, is to 1114 MB F3. Because they know you'd be trying to 1114 and ATTEMPT to mix them up, they almost 100% try to poke or punish, and so the MB F3 will work almost guaranteed. This is situational, however. The opponent has to KNOW that you aren't at as much advantage as pre-patch. Then you've got them at an impasse. Do they try to punish still? Do they stand block? They won't be able to react to the slide. It costs a meter bar and it's sometimes situation. But against strong defensive players it can work wonders. Mix in b14 MB f3 sometimes and you'll find it easy to open up people who block a lot. But against opponents that press buttons, it's not quite as effective, you see...

2. BAIT AND WAGER FORCE :If I get a huge life lead I stay back and zone sometimes, building the trait bit by bit, sometimes just to get them to say 'OMG' I can't let him build it up! He's planning something!

I can risk taking the chip or hit from some projectiles depending on the characters, and so if I do get the chance to fill it up, I use it as a wager-proof strategy. Catch them with the slide, meter burn iceburg and start with the soccer practice. They almost 100% wager the first kick, which would seem like a waste, but this causes you to spend one bar to force a wager. The vortex takes a bar for MB freeze and subsequent MB freezes when they guess wrong so it allows you to save meter for actual vortex damage while the opponent thinks they're wagering the big damage you were planning all along. I don't think I'm explaining this properly, but if you watch me wreck shop on PJS's stream, because some of the opponent's are 'good' but not educated in some of the game's tech, it works like a charm. It forces people from far away to come in or try to zone (then I iceberg or get them right where I want them) or build enough meter to force them to waste theirs when I start a trait combo.


3.FAKE AN ICEBERG: When you find yourself in an episode of Fullscreen Zoning 3: Redemption, sometimes all you need is a little fake out.


I don't think I've properly explained point 1 and 2, but both are much easier shown than stated.
 

JokersWild515

I'm a man of my word.
You're talking about useless traits and you didn't even mention Joker. I'm not sure if I should be offended or happy. His trait is such ass it's unreal. Batman's parry is 10 times better and it's just a special.
 

Komatose

The Prettiest
Pre-patch? Godly. Especially for pressure. Post patch... It's very iffy. I never really use it anymore...