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Lex has three big issues:
Raven 3-7 ?
Sinestro 3-7
Cyborg 3-7
These characters take steamy dumps on him all day, and Lex cannot get in on them, or outzone them.
I think Raven might be different now.
Warning: this thread is going to be filled with a bunch of my usual theory-fighter BS. It's only good if it works in an actual match against a Raven player that is thinking and reacting. I hope this makes the match-up better, but it all comes down to whether it works in practice. Please give me feedback in that regard. I will try to gain some match-up experience against Raven players using this strategy, as soon as I get the chance to play online again.
So here it is- sorry for the massive length, but I wanted to make sure I really picked apart this match-up and accounted for everything.... I actually haven't accounted for everything, and already plan a part 2 because there are ways a Raven can counter some of this stuff, and I really didn't analyze Raven's Demon Stance responses.
The format of this will show a video for each section, followed by an accompanying description. So the descriptions all refer to the video that came before.
NOW, LET'S START FROM FULL SCREEN
Lex's fastest zoning tool is his lance blast. It has an awful 26 frame start-up. From full screen, if you try and do ANYTHING but move forward against a Raven throwing out her basic projectiles, you will get hit. You will get hit out of Lance Blast, and the damage does not trade in your favor. You can get a probe out, but the Raven player can just ignore this and keep throwing projectiles, and it will trade in her favor, she will get hit by the probe, but interrupt anything you try to do with the projectile she just threw immediately after. If you try to trait up, you will get hit before you are out of level 1, and you will eat a damage penalty
So most Lex players are going to want to patiently get in on Raven by walking and blocking. This is also a huge issue. As shown in the video above, the main problem is that transition from far-range to soul-crush range. Raven's soul crush is NOT punishable by Corp Charge in a small area around it's maximum range. The Raven player will have multiple chances to mixup her basic projectile with a soul-crush. Meaning if you guess wrong and try to walk forward for even a split second after her projectile goes over your head, you will eat a soul crush. Your only option is to sit there and wait for a soul crush before you walk forward an inch more. This is just not a good way to get in on Raven.
So remember how before I said Lex can basically do nothing against a Raven spamming projectiles full screen? Well, that's not entirely true. You can get a Lance Blast out quickly after you duck a projectile. If she's constantly throwing a projectile, they will trade with each other. Lance Blast will deal 7 % to Raven, and her projectile will do 8% to you, so it's not a trade in your favor. HOWEVER you will be at frame advantage. This is because the Lance Blast will hit Raven after Lex is hit- so Lex has already started recovering by the time Raven takes the hit and is put in hit stun. So while normally you will lose your shields against a Raven spamming out projectiles, after a Lance blast hit, you can get FREE level 1 shields, and keep them by ducking the next projectile. You can use those level 1 shields to get a probe out, and then use the probe to follow up with an orbital strike. Basically, you can start zoning Raven.
So, off a trade between Lance Blast and Raven's projectile, Lex gets free shields, and he can use those shields to initiate counter-zoning. In that scenario, the trade goes from in Raven's favor, to almost perfectly even. Lex takes 8% damage while Raven takes only 7%. Lex then get's a free probe, and a followup orbital strike- if Raven throws a projectile, she will deal 10% damage to Lex because of the shield penalty, but she will take the probe hit and the orbital strike will deal 8 %, along with the 2% damage from the probe. The trade is each character takes around 17/18% damage.
But that scenario assumed a trade between Lance Blast and Raven's full-screen projectile. What if she block's the Lance Blast? The previous video shows exactly what happens. You get a free probe, and can duck under the next projectile, so you can capitalize full on that follow-up probe hit. In this scenario, you take 8% from Raven and deal 7 %, but you are guaranteed to do an extra 3% chip from the probe and at MINIMUM a follow-up lance blast. But you can also do an orbital strike to go for more substantial damage.
The video above shows that this does not work when Lex is at mid-screen. The hit and block advantage on Lance Blast varies by distance. The longer the distance, the more time Lex has to recover before it hits. Conversely, when you are close to the enemy, you haven't recovered much by the time Lance Blast hits. Further, the video is only showing Raven stuffing Lex with her basic wimpy projectile. She also can do a soul-crush to stuff Lex, and as previously mentioned, Lex cannot punish a blocked soul-crush with corp charge at max-range. He cannot punish her basic projectile at that same range either, as an immediate follow-up projectile will hit Lex out of his corp-charge right before he hits Raven.
So while I've shown Lex can hold his own against Raven at full-screen, even make damage trade in HIS FAVOR for a while, you don't want to stay there forever. The Raven player is eventually going to start making reads, and even worse, go into her Demon Stance (I have yet to analyze her options in Demon Stance yet, but let's assume for now she has options that will stuff the strategy I have her when in that stance)
So eventually we need to rush her down. We can use the meter we've built against her with the aforementioned options. We don't want to do anything that's going to get us from full-screen to mid-screen, because as I've shown, Raven dominates Lex there. We need to go from full-screen to up-close and personal immediately.
Lex NEEDS at least 1 bar of meter, and NEEDS to have trait ready to activate to get in on Raven completely safe.
On a Lex lance-blast block from full screen, Lex will be able to get out his MB orbital strike. You will get hit by a projectile trade, but you will still have enough comparative frame advantage to do a trait-dash cancel forward and get level 3 shields. Even if the Raven player techs into a soul-crush, you can get TWO dashes forward and not take any damage at all in the process (Level 3 sheilds). If your shields are dispersed by a wakeup-soul crush after a roll, you will still have time to complete your second dash forward and PUNISH it with corp-charge, because the Level 3 shields causes a whiff, which is so negative for raven, you will still punish it after dashing forward and corp-charging. The video above shows it. The Raven AI is set to block EVERYTHING, so she wouldn't be getting hit with the Corp Charge if this wasn't a true punish. The same will work for any other ranged weapon she has. If she opts to just get up and block instead, you will keep your shields, meaning you can corp charge the rest of the distance anyway, and shields will protect you from a punish. Congratulations, you just got from full-screen to right in her face with one smooth move.
Raven 3-7 ?
Sinestro 3-7
Cyborg 3-7
These characters take steamy dumps on him all day, and Lex cannot get in on them, or outzone them.
I think Raven might be different now.
Warning: this thread is going to be filled with a bunch of my usual theory-fighter BS. It's only good if it works in an actual match against a Raven player that is thinking and reacting. I hope this makes the match-up better, but it all comes down to whether it works in practice. Please give me feedback in that regard. I will try to gain some match-up experience against Raven players using this strategy, as soon as I get the chance to play online again.
So here it is- sorry for the massive length, but I wanted to make sure I really picked apart this match-up and accounted for everything.... I actually haven't accounted for everything, and already plan a part 2 because there are ways a Raven can counter some of this stuff, and I really didn't analyze Raven's Demon Stance responses.
The format of this will show a video for each section, followed by an accompanying description. So the descriptions all refer to the video that came before.
NOW, LET'S START FROM FULL SCREEN
Lex's fastest zoning tool is his lance blast. It has an awful 26 frame start-up. From full screen, if you try and do ANYTHING but move forward against a Raven throwing out her basic projectiles, you will get hit. You will get hit out of Lance Blast, and the damage does not trade in your favor. You can get a probe out, but the Raven player can just ignore this and keep throwing projectiles, and it will trade in her favor, she will get hit by the probe, but interrupt anything you try to do with the projectile she just threw immediately after. If you try to trait up, you will get hit before you are out of level 1, and you will eat a damage penalty
So most Lex players are going to want to patiently get in on Raven by walking and blocking. This is also a huge issue. As shown in the video above, the main problem is that transition from far-range to soul-crush range. Raven's soul crush is NOT punishable by Corp Charge in a small area around it's maximum range. The Raven player will have multiple chances to mixup her basic projectile with a soul-crush. Meaning if you guess wrong and try to walk forward for even a split second after her projectile goes over your head, you will eat a soul crush. Your only option is to sit there and wait for a soul crush before you walk forward an inch more. This is just not a good way to get in on Raven.
So remember how before I said Lex can basically do nothing against a Raven spamming projectiles full screen? Well, that's not entirely true. You can get a Lance Blast out quickly after you duck a projectile. If she's constantly throwing a projectile, they will trade with each other. Lance Blast will deal 7 % to Raven, and her projectile will do 8% to you, so it's not a trade in your favor. HOWEVER you will be at frame advantage. This is because the Lance Blast will hit Raven after Lex is hit- so Lex has already started recovering by the time Raven takes the hit and is put in hit stun. So while normally you will lose your shields against a Raven spamming out projectiles, after a Lance blast hit, you can get FREE level 1 shields, and keep them by ducking the next projectile. You can use those level 1 shields to get a probe out, and then use the probe to follow up with an orbital strike. Basically, you can start zoning Raven.
So, off a trade between Lance Blast and Raven's projectile, Lex gets free shields, and he can use those shields to initiate counter-zoning. In that scenario, the trade goes from in Raven's favor, to almost perfectly even. Lex takes 8% damage while Raven takes only 7%. Lex then get's a free probe, and a followup orbital strike- if Raven throws a projectile, she will deal 10% damage to Lex because of the shield penalty, but she will take the probe hit and the orbital strike will deal 8 %, along with the 2% damage from the probe. The trade is each character takes around 17/18% damage.
But that scenario assumed a trade between Lance Blast and Raven's full-screen projectile. What if she block's the Lance Blast? The previous video shows exactly what happens. You get a free probe, and can duck under the next projectile, so you can capitalize full on that follow-up probe hit. In this scenario, you take 8% from Raven and deal 7 %, but you are guaranteed to do an extra 3% chip from the probe and at MINIMUM a follow-up lance blast. But you can also do an orbital strike to go for more substantial damage.
The video above shows that this does not work when Lex is at mid-screen. The hit and block advantage on Lance Blast varies by distance. The longer the distance, the more time Lex has to recover before it hits. Conversely, when you are close to the enemy, you haven't recovered much by the time Lance Blast hits. Further, the video is only showing Raven stuffing Lex with her basic wimpy projectile. She also can do a soul-crush to stuff Lex, and as previously mentioned, Lex cannot punish a blocked soul-crush with corp charge at max-range. He cannot punish her basic projectile at that same range either, as an immediate follow-up projectile will hit Lex out of his corp-charge right before he hits Raven.
So while I've shown Lex can hold his own against Raven at full-screen, even make damage trade in HIS FAVOR for a while, you don't want to stay there forever. The Raven player is eventually going to start making reads, and even worse, go into her Demon Stance (I have yet to analyze her options in Demon Stance yet, but let's assume for now she has options that will stuff the strategy I have her when in that stance)
So eventually we need to rush her down. We can use the meter we've built against her with the aforementioned options. We don't want to do anything that's going to get us from full-screen to mid-screen, because as I've shown, Raven dominates Lex there. We need to go from full-screen to up-close and personal immediately.
Lex NEEDS at least 1 bar of meter, and NEEDS to have trait ready to activate to get in on Raven completely safe.
On a Lex lance-blast block from full screen, Lex will be able to get out his MB orbital strike. You will get hit by a projectile trade, but you will still have enough comparative frame advantage to do a trait-dash cancel forward and get level 3 shields. Even if the Raven player techs into a soul-crush, you can get TWO dashes forward and not take any damage at all in the process (Level 3 sheilds). If your shields are dispersed by a wakeup-soul crush after a roll, you will still have time to complete your second dash forward and PUNISH it with corp-charge, because the Level 3 shields causes a whiff, which is so negative for raven, you will still punish it after dashing forward and corp-charging. The video above shows it. The Raven AI is set to block EVERYTHING, so she wouldn't be getting hit with the Corp Charge if this wasn't a true punish. The same will work for any other ranged weapon she has. If she opts to just get up and block instead, you will keep your shields, meaning you can corp charge the rest of the distance anyway, and shields will protect you from a punish. Congratulations, you just got from full-screen to right in her face with one smooth move.
