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I think I really need to say this...

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Looking at some of the discussions lately, I've become really frustrated with this community. I love you guys. You know that. But I'm sorry...everyone's been pampered too much. And to be frank, you guys need to step it up.

What do I mean by pampered? Let's look at some of the discussions going on. There was a topic as of late, discussing whether Cyrax should be banned because he can spend an entire bar and create an unbreakable combo for up to, what, 50%? We still have people wanting another hotfix to change the game because shit "looks awful" and because we still think some characters need to be buffed.

You know what I think? We need to stop being babies.

I know I can't talk about being around back when there were no patches, because I'll be honest, I wasn't. However, the first games I came to play and explore first were the classics that were still played not because they were always patched up until this day, but because they were fun games still evolving because people were still putting in the effort to evolve themselves as players. Admittedly, the first game I became serious about had no tournaments. MKA. By the end of its lifespan, I was up there as one of the top players...there's only a handful of players who know that game as far inside and out as I do...several of those players are huge and influential figures within our community right now. All of it was from hard work. Exploring the limits, evolving our play as time went on...we spent hours leveling up. And you know what? At no point did we ask for rebalances of the game. Because we couldn't...we were given the game and forced to either just keep playing and just learn, or give up.

I'm kinda disgusted at the mentality we have right now. Instead of grinding our asses off and playing this game we're given...I see a lot of complaining. There's a rumored hotfix supposed to be arriving, and some stuff will be fixed with it. I have a question.

What if this hotfix doesn't come?

I'm sorry, let me ask some more questions. What if we are stuck with Cyrax being able to strip half our life and be unable to do anything about it? What if Smoke is forever blessed with the ability to strip your entire lifebar anywhere on the screen? What if we are left with Jax's absurd corner game? What if Kabal can still spam the fuck out of us? What if Quan Chi remains capable of beating you because you played proper defense?

Pretty much, what if this version of the game is the final version we will get? What will all of you guys do? Are you going to stop playing because you can't handle the bullshit? Or are you going to level up?

Let me talk about another game really quick...my favorite Street Fighter, Alpha 2. Now, in this game, basically every character is capable of taking off anywhere from 40-60% of your life, you can't do a damn thing about it if they start the combo, and they can do it in a way where basically you're losing all this damage from a 0-frame low because there is a bug where you cannot block low if you are not already blocking low when the custom combo flash goes off...or they can just walk up to you and break your guard by activating the custom combo. This same game has a universal option that allows you to spend meter to counter an opponent while still blocking...note not every character has a strong counter of this type, while some can basically on reaction, nail you from basically sweep distance for 15% (Think Cage X-Ray), or can basically solve an entire lack of a traditional reversal by just spending a bar that they can easily fill back up. Other things include a command throw that can be set up to basically be impossible to avoid and you lose like 20% everytime it lands (Kinda like Cyrax could do pre-patch). This game has a load of bullshit in it. Still played to this day in tournaments, and is arguably the best game of the Alpha series. Yet, it is pretty fucking broke lol.

What I'm trying to say is that history tells us broken shit doesn't stop people from playing these games for a long time. You think games like SFII or Tekken are innocent angels? Fuck no. And you know what? The players had to deal with it all, or they pretty much wasted their money and had to wait at the back of the line. Be lucky you guys don't have to do that, lol...get randomly touched by Cyrax and there goes your quarter taken.

We shouldn't be worrying about this stuff, because it's possibly here to stay. What we should be worrying about is improving. The level of play for MK9 has really evolved since what, 9, 10 months ago? That said, we still have a lot of room for improvement. Admittedly, a lot of the play we see can be pretty sloppy, and not just on occasion, either. At this point, we should not be able to jump so freely, our reading should be a lot quicker and more on point, and our spacing should be better. We have our work cut out for us as players. Not to mention, a lot of people still don't have experience vs at least half the cast. A huge number of characters still haven't been explored to the extent that you've seen Kabal, Jax, Reptile, Kung Lao, Kitana, etc, explored.

We need to be putting in all our efforts to pull out the full potential of this game. If we can do that, can you imagine how much funner this game will become to play? Can you imagine how this game could potentially evolve so much further than it already has, to the point where maybe some of the shit we complain about isn't even really that big a deal anymore? It's happened for other games...why can't it happen here?

I say forget about how stupid things are. Right here, right now. Let's continue to break the fuck out of this game. Let's make the gameplay become deep as the fucking ocean.

Let's level up and quit the bitching.
 

NKZero

Warrior
You've hit the nail right on the head there. Other games have gone through similar difficulties and yet people still play them. Here it's like we expect to be rescued from the fire. Well what if the firemen said they aren't rescuing us (which they effectively have with regards to a future hot fix)? As you said, people need to just shut up and play and try and discover new things.

Also this game isn't even nearly as bad as others. It's so damn balanced and an overall very solid game. Yes we can do without the Cyrax and Smoke resetting combos or the Jax 100% corner stuff, but it's not impossible to avoid. Just up your game people!
 

WayoftheFist

Cold day in hell...
My only gripes and grievances with this game have been the things already taken out of it because of community griping vs. the things still in. It's a fantastic game and I will work with what I have and enjoy it, I just think some things were patched too quickly without letting the game evolve to a point where we really knew how game-breaking certain things could be compared to the things the other characters are capable of doing.
 
Inescapable damage resets are stupid. The whole "it's not what the developers intended" argument doesn't really work since the devs don't really "intend" for most of what comprises high level play...but still. They're bullshit. That being said, every character in the game potentially has them, or stuff that's even more bullshit. So it's really a never ending cycle. You can't really expect NRS to continually release patches/hotfixes when "unfair" stuff arises. Everything is a chain reaction. And people are still finding new things in games from the 90s. MK9 is pretty well balanced.

But Noob still needs armor. Chain mail, preferably. :)
 

Vulcan Hades

Champion
THTB said:
What will all of you guys do? Are you going to stop playing because you can't handle the bullshit? Or are you going to level up?
If they don't fix the inescapable resets left in the game, then my prediction is that 99% of top players that are serious about "playing to win" are going to drop their main and pick up Smoke, Jax, Cyrax, Freddy/Kabal or Raiden.

However I don't really play to win. I play this game because I like it.

You're making some good points THTB, and I agree with what you're trying to say. But that still doesn't mean that glitches are OK in fighting games. I don't care about how much damage Cyrax can do. I don't have a problem with 60% for 1 bar even if that is ridiculous. But I do have a problem with glitches, inescapable crap and other things that just break the game's rules for no reason. It's just dumb. Not a question of being cheap or overpowered. It's a question of having consistency in design.

If they can't fix it, too bad. I guess we'll have to adapt like you said. But ideally I really think they should fix it. No question in my mind that MK9 would be a much better game without glitched resets, block infinites and input drop bugs etc.

I just don't understand people that can say "this glitch is ok because it's my main and I think he sucks and is unviable but that glitch needs to go because it's Kabal/Skarlet/Freddy and they're OP". :confused: What kind of mentality is that?
 

WayoftheFist

Cold day in hell...
I just don't understand people that can say "this glitch is ok because it's my main and I think he sucks and is unviable but that glitch needs to go because it's Kabal/Freddy and they're OP". :confused: What kind of mentality is that?
This. The thing with the resets is this; there needs to be a standard. If Sub-Zero's ground freeze reset was broken and had to go then so are all the others and they should go as well.
 

CJKRattlehead

Two men enter, one man leaves!
If they don't fix the inescapable resets left in the game, then my prediction is that 99% of top players that are serious about "playing to win" are going to drop their main and pick up Smoke, Jax, Freddy or Raiden.
Woah woah woah, What's wrong with Freddy and how is he classified with Smoke, Jax, and Raiden?
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Don't get me wrong, Vulcan, a glitch is a glitch. They're unintended, and hence, shouldn't be there. Do they sometimes enhance the game? Yes, but that doesn't mean the developer wants them in. But unless they do take them out, it's out of our hands unless the game really devolves as a result.

And I play the game because I like it as well and I have fun with it...much like you. I'd be lying if I said I didn't play to win, and tbh, so would you, by all technicalities, but I can't really go there lol.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Am I the only one who isn't bothered by my game having SOME dirty shit?

I mean, where's the fear and motivation if you don't have a drastic amount to lose in certain situations?
Maybe they left it alone on purpose. Maybe they intended for this to make them the BAMF's of the game.
I have no idea. As far as my thoughts go, if it's there, it's there, and that's the fight I need to be prepared for.

Just wish they'd left Sub's alone, but them's the breaks. I seriously hope the fucking patches are over.
Unless it's something to fix the consistency in the game itself, leave the characters alone.
Otherwise, this game is gonna end up losing all the time it's spent post-patch learning the "new" matchups, and having to readjust and re-plan the whole drawing board, yet again. 5 months from EVO = Bad, bad idea.
Every game has its share of outlandish shit. Kombat is no different.
At least that's my thought.
 

Killphil

A prop on the stage of life.
The game is evolving tremendously. Ever since you post about the ground game becoming more important I've jumped considerably less in my fights and have been punishing those that do with the appropriate AA or uppercut. As far as leveling up goes? I can't say I'm going to magically dance around every cyrax net and smoke bomb that comes my way, but I can live with it. I just try to laugh off my losses to "the bullshit" whenever I can. My friend and I play sets and he uses Kabal NDC's now. Do I care? No. I get annoyed, but I got jokes. I just laugh and congratulate him for beating me with the best character in the game. All in good fun. I just wish input drop and random advantage were gone. I've been frozen by many a subzero freeze blast when I was clearly ducking under it from full screen. lol On top of people asking for a patch, there will just as many bitching about how we have to relearn the game AGAIN. Umvc3 has bullshit in it but people still love and play that as well. Just thought I'd add my two cents. #lovehatethisshit
 

NYCj360

i Use a modded cyber now
Don't get me wrong, Vulcan, a glitch is a glitch. They're unintended, and hence, shouldn't be there. Do they sometimes enhance the game? Yes, but that doesn't mean the developer wants them in. But unless they do take them out, it's out of our hands unless the game really devolves as a result.

And I play the game because I like it as well and I have fun with it...much like you. I'd be lying if I said I didn't play to win, and tbh, so would you, by all technicalities, but I can't really go there lol.
Couldn't agree more. As much as I don't like the resets ill still use em, ill continue to break the game and continue to play it patch or not because I love it. I doubt any top players will switch mains like that seeing as how the same characters who are messed up have always been messed up. Yet people stick to their shit.

Sent from my HTC Sensation XE with Beats Audio using Tapatalk
 

DanCock

Cock Master!!
Okay, so I worded that wrong lol. Damnit, Dan! But I'm sure you understand what I meant.
yes for sure i agree 100% what your saying over all.. :)


if there isnt a hotfix ever coming again then WE as a Kommunity need to STFU and deal with whatever nonsense this game has. play a game like MKD and MKA and then you'll know what nonsense is. mk9 has nothing on those 2 games and i still loved them LOL
 

hardwire

Apprentice
yes for sure i agree 100% what your saying over all.. :)


if there isnt a hotfix ever coming again then WE as a Kommunity need to STFU and deal with whatever nonsense this game has. play a game like MKD and MKA and then you'll know what nonsense is. mk9 has nothing on those 2 games and i still loved them LOL

so let me get this straight other games that there is broken stuff (brawl soul caliber) a ban is ok but for some reason when nrs drops the ball on mk9 a ban is people bitching? explain this logic.

also ill just go ahead and say this
cyrax is not a problem for me i play smoke i can shake his net and rarely get touched by his resest im just playing the devils advocate here and trying to get an understanding of the hypocrisy in the fgc

btw this is also THTB
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
so let me get this straight other games that there is broken stuff (brawl soul caliber) a ban is ok but for some reason when nrs drops the ball on mk9 a ban is people bitching? explain this logic.

btw this is also THTB
Both of the communities for those games banned stuff and it definitely didn't come without controversy.

Smash Bros. in general requires banning a number of stuff to even play the game without it turning to shit (Don't get me wrong, I like Smash, but the game was definitely not designed with competition in mind). When it came to stuff like Metaknight, it took forever for that to happen, with him dominating the game for like 3 years, and by then the game was already considered a failure and its rep couldn't be repaired.

Soul Calibur ended up banning stuff off of theory, not experience, from what I understand. Also, in SCII days, characters who were available on console only were banned at first until later on, excluding the ones exclusive to specific consoles.

NONE of this stuff that people want banned has dominated MK9, mind you. Fuck, vanilla Cyrax had bomb traps off of an untechable command throw, and STILL hasn't won a tournament in the US on his own. The reset Sub had didn't result in him winning anything in the time it was used. Only time will tell if Smoke's new reset will rape the game.
 

hardwire

Apprentice
Both of the communities for those games banned stuff and it definitely didn't come without controversy.

Smash Bros. in general requires banning a number of stuff to even play the game without it turning to shit (Don't get me wrong, I like Smash, but the game was definitely not designed with competition in mind). When it came to stuff like Metaknight, it took forever for that to happen, with him dominating the game for like 3 years, and by then the game was already considered a failure and its rep couldn't be repaired.

Soul Calibur ended up banning stuff off of theory, not experience, from what I understand. Also, in SCII days, characters who were available on console only were banned at first until later on, excluding the ones exclusive to specific consoles.

NONE of this stuff that people want banned has dominated MK9, mind you. Fuck, vanilla Cyrax had bomb traps off of an untechable command throw, and STILL hasn't won a tournament in the US on his own. The reset Sub had didn't result in him winning anything in the time it was used. Only time will tell if Smoke's new reset will rape the game.
Alright i can understand that and agree.

on a side note smoke will win because of his tools not his reset (hasnt that already been proven) also if his otg didnt net him wins what makes you think the new reset will. remember the otg was a lot more lenient in use.
 

GodsLonelyman

Kombatant
I agree, I don't have a problem with the resets people are complaining about or any character in particular, however, I have grown apathetic for other reasons. My issue is the glitches and inconsistencies in this game. Random dropped inputs, Negative edge ruining certain characters ie: (CSZ) Lack of frame data from the developers, Glitchy hitboxes on certain characters and just inconsistent in general, corner glitches, lack of a training mode to test out theories and scenarios, the one we have now is bug riddled and cannot be taken seriously, stages causing glitches and making matches unplayable, some characters getting random frame advantages on strings, some armored moves being inconsistent, All these bugs and glitches is what needs to be fixed, sure we could use some character rebalancing but for me it's these things that get me angry and I ask myself, why am I bothering to play this at a competitive level? NRS doesn't seem to have intentions of fixing any of it via a hot fix or a new installment, they just want to cash in on the next project. It was their intention of creating a competitive fighter wasn't it? If they had implied it was intended to a casual fanbase (which it clearly is) I wouldn't be upset. They really dropped the ball and left us hanging.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
It's funny you bring up the OTG. Imagine if the guaranteed reset tech was found DURING the OTG days. O_____________O

Also, I don't think the reset will net him more wins...but it will make him a shit ton more difficult to fight.
 

B W1zZ

Warrior
Well said THTB, I've personally always taken this approach when it comes to this game, along with MKA. Basically if a character has some kind of BS like kabal Iagb or Cyrax/Smoke resets, learn to find ways around it instead of complaining about it. Also if you're character is struggling with something push said character until you can learn to combat it. What IF this IS the final version of the game? Can't just sit around twiddling your thumbs waiting for a hotfix, work with what you have and level your game up.

In all honesty, the dirt the characters in this game have is childs play compared to all of the bugs and glitches in previous MK titles.
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
Well, I haven't done any bitching. My only bitching comes from the people I deal with day in and day out. I love this game. I love Mortal Kombat. We busted our asses to get back at EVO, and Mr.Wizard notice that we did that. Let's not lose it. Let's stop worrying what the haters say. I mean the people that hate on SC bitch about ringouts and think they are cheap. What did I do? I told they are stupid, and left it alone. Now, let me leave you with a little story.

You see, I'm a senior in high school, and my school started a Debate Team. This was their first time doing it, and I was excited to join because I loved to talk. So, let's do a little skipping. The Debate season is broken up into six tournaments. I was on fire for the first two tournaments. I was placing high in the speaker rewards and my team( we're broken up into teams of two) was kicking ass, but at the mid-Season classic I was fucking awful. We did so badly. We finished 2-5. Not so bad, eh? Well, those "two wins" were byes. So, that means we had five debate rounds, and lost them all. Something happen in one of the rounds, that made me lose my cool. I was demanding that my team get the win because of the Judge's way of picking the winner of the round. I blew up after that, and almost got booted out of the tournament. My coach had to clam me down. The worst part was that we had the Mid-Season classic at a college I wanted to go to. So acting like that wasn't cool at all. I was so salty after the mid-Season classic, it took me two months to get over it. Until, I said to myself," just drop it and try to have fun." I felt I was taking this sport too serious. So, I decided to chill. What happen when I did that? I dominated at the next tournament and punch our ticket to the City Championships that is going to be held at one of the best colleges in the city. You have to quality at other tournament to be given this honor. But enough about debate. Let me tie this back.

Now, I could have sat on my ass and spam the CDL's(Chicago Debate League) twitter demanding my win at T3. but I didn't do that. I just took a chill pill, and dealt with the shit. so, deal with this shit that in Mk9 because if you just sit back and relax and try to have fun, then you might win a big major like EVO. Sorry about the grammar folks, it's late here.

P.S.

If anyone is wondering what the colleges were. I'll tell you.

Mid-Season classic: Depaul University

City Championship: Northwestern University

Yeah I know. Get hype.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
In all honesty, the dirt the characters in this game have is childs play compared to all of the bugs and glitches in previous MK titles.
Remember how MKA Scorpion could basically take off half your life in unbreakables, all the while keeping you in a 50/50? Or the broken version of Skarlet they call Sareena? All the characters capable of killing you for getting thrown? XDDDDD