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General/Other - Hat Trick Hatarang hat respawn nerf was too severe and brought consequences

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
As some of you may know, Hat Trick had a legit way to punish people for trying to mash anything out when Hatarang was blocked by forcing a hat trap right after the opponent blocks a the second hit of hatarang on correct ranges.
Not only would put them in check but could launch people for going with explosive reads.

Ever heard the term "if ain't broke, don't fix it"? Well, NRS took that away and as result has brought lots of consequences while using this move.

for example, there are times you hit someone with hatarang, but when the hat is returning for the second hit, somewhat the opponent is able to block.

Sometimes you're hit after you use hatarang on the first hit and the hat disappears immediately, before the hat would only disappear after two hits.
This is where it gets confusing, sometimes you're hit more than 2 times and the hat doesn't get disabled and still hits them, but since its unknown if this will actually happen it makes pretty random.

Now since the nerf, the hat won't recover on KL's head fast enough for an immediate punish, specially if the window where the opponent lets themselves open is that sort and exactly right after they block the second hit of hatarang, trying to punish with F23~spin which is your only punish at that range won't work sadly.

There is also some issues with Spin in general, the hitbox seems smaller.
It cannot launch ermac with 11212~spin which is most reliable meterless punish midscreen, and the only way to do that is by wearing MK3 KL costume which honestly looks like a dress.

While this issue its not only to ermac, Hat Trick has some combos where even in respectable height, the spin simply won't connect making him lose a lot of damage opportunity which is already small.

And last but not least, why can anyone like for example shinnok when not even that close to KL can by pass regular spin with NJP and hit KL hurtbox without getting hit by his hitbox? he doesn't even has a dislocated hitbox attached to his arms but this happens very consistently, probably because somehow KL hurtbox on spin is larger than his own active frames hitbox.

I'm not sure if those were addressed or not, but those could really be some quality life changes, there is so many things wrong with this character and that is just the slimmest along everything else that was already discussed in many threads before.
Lord colt, pls save Lao.

@ROG Moonspell @God Confirm @colt @ETC Mcfly
 
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Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
Since those problem started to pop out, my usage of hatarang was decreased. The Spin issues are legit as well. I mainly use his s1 or d1 for AA but since we all know how messed up jumps are in this game I started to use ex Spin just to make sure I dont get hit out of.
 

Pygmy_Potato

BF4+FF+BLK
Just wanted to make it clear that 11212~spin whiffing on Ermac happens in all his variations unless you're in the MK3 costume. I'm pretty sure this literally only happens with Ermac and it's very strange. I'd love for it to get fixed.
 
It is complex play with the character but I still really like this style. ... you think that in the next patch improve the "Hat trick" mode or you think will be worse?
 

Pygmy_Potato

BF4+FF+BLK
The Ermac thing isn't MK3 specific, it's DOUBLE costume specific. As in it depends on what costume BOTH characters are wearing. AND it's ONLY on Ermac, not even females! NotLikeThis
Wow lol. I wasn't aware there was a whole other level to that wonkiness. Thanks for the heads up. Do you remember which Ermac costumes affect it?
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
It is complex play with the character but I still really like this style. ... you think that in the next patch improve the "Hat trick" mode or you think will be worse?
i'm more inclined to agree with @The PantyChrist and say worse, we got ignored in the last two patches after all, ppl think Hat Trick is fine and balanced and if they nerf top tiers a bit he will be fine.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
God, I hope you are just a pessimist and we get at least fixes and slight buffs.
i stopped being optimist when we got ignored twice, its not like we didn't put video evidence of the actual problems.
Its not like we didn't politely ask why we were ignored the two times we got ignored, which in fact NRS never bothered to ask why current events led to us being ignored twice, they also ignored our questions twice.
 

Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
i stopped being optimist when we got ignored twice, its not like we didn't put video evidence of the actual problems.
Its not like we didn't politely ask why we were ignored the two times we got ignored, which in fact NRS never bothered to ask why current events led to us being ignored twice, they also ignored our questions twice.
Well, Its hard not to admit but with the incoming patch I hope that they were able to realize that HT do really have serious problems that really needs to be solved.
 

Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
Last time you got emotionally down, don't do this to yourself anymore, we deserve better.
I got two tournaments on my way and I am still struggling with dropping HT and going with Ronin. But to be honest with You I feel that I am enslaved to HT so bad that I will pick him up anyway and when it comes to D'Vorah BM or Wrestler Jax or that cock sucker A-List JC I will hate my self for it because when the moment comes I decide to go with my main rather than losing with other character.
 

RyuKazuya

Jesus is my Lord and Savior!
I think hattrick is a very fun variation but The more I play the more I feel like I have to heavily rely on gimmicks. Additionally it is stupid that we also have to face inconsistencies that will give us huge trouble in certain matchups. Stuff like mids whiffing on crouching opponents or different animations on hat callbacks is something, that speaks for itself.
I am sure non of us demands a broken "plus on everything" character or even something near to it. Seriously, all we want is fixing a character so he can function the way he is supposed to.

And before all people start to claim he was fine I really urge you to play this character first, so you can realise that we do not downplay rather than stating facts. As soon as you play someone who knows the match up its actually GG :(
 

RyuKazuya

Jesus is my Lord and Savior!
I got two tournaments on my way and I am still struggling with dropping HT and going with Ronin. But to be honest with You I feel that I am enslaved to HT so bad that I will pick him up anyway and when it comes to D'Vorah BM or Wrestler Jax or that cock sucker A-List JC I will hate my self for it because when the moment comes I decide to go with my main rather than losing with other character.
I totally understand that. Its hard to force yourself to play a character you do not have the same fun with. I hope we can soon use him in tournaments without having to say our last prayers.
 

Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
I totally understand that. Its hard to force yourself to play a character you do not have the same fun with. I hope we can soon use him in tournaments without having to say our last prayers.
I've been using him in more then 2-3 tournaments and it never turned out well. There are matches where outplaying brings me Victory but there are MU where even worse player then me in skill wise is still winning over. I dont know, we will see what future brings.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
I think hattrick is a very fun variation but The more I play the more I feel like I have to heavily rely on gimmicks. Additionally it is stupid that we also have to face inconsistencies that will give us huge trouble in certain matchups. Stuff like mids whiffing on crouching opponents or different animations on hat callbacks is something, that speaks for itself.
I am sure non of us demands a broken "plus on everything" character or even something near to it. Seriously, all we want is fixing a character so he can function the way he is supposed to.

And before all people start to claim he was fine I really urge you to play this character first, so you can realise that we do not downplay rather than stating facts. As soon as you play someone who knows the match up its actually GG :(
He is indeed pretty fun, but the inconsistencies man, the freaking inconsistencies!
You wanting to spin on a juggle combo and not connecting.
Losing a trade with spin
Having call back out and getting hit just to disappear
Juggle differences
Freaking outplay people with every pressure.
useless traps when not in front
very limited conversion options on certain angles
Opponent cannot fear if the trap isn't behind him
teleport options suck
No good backdash
very bad walkspeed
negative edge out of crouch blocking.
Having to jump back all day instead of dash backwards or walking backwards.
maaan, gg.
 

Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
He is indeed pretty fun, but the inconsistencies man, the freaking inconsistencies!
You wanting to spin on a juggle combo and not connecting.
Losing a trade with spin
Having call back out and getting hit just to disappear
Juggle differences
Freaking outplay people with every pressure.
useless traps when not in front
very limited conversion options on certain angles
Opponent cannot fear if the trap isn't behind him
teleport options suck
No good backdash
very bad walkspeed
negative edge out of crouch blocking.
Having to jump back all day instead of dash backwards or walking backwards.
maaan, gg.

You know when I see a sexy girl I cant stop to fantasize about some spicy shit. The same goes when I see Ronin, I cant stop fantasizing about Hattrick having all the buffs and fixes :D

We shall find soon enough. I hope we get Kombat Cast next week.