EOTL
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Hi I'm new to Injustice and TYM. Thought I'd contribute with my first post. I'll be adding a full breakdown of 22; then the wake-up game and then anything else which needs a fair bit of testing/analysis. Most of this isn't new, I'm just trying to take the level of detail/analysis further and at least this will be good reference for any character specific info you need.
Note: I make no comment on Shazam's viability. I don't want to get grief for trying to improve a character like Tom Brady did.
The 22 string
A double mid hitting string which is -9 block so you need to special out of it or it is a free punish is free for the majority of the cast. As most of you know the beauty of it is you can cancel to Shazam's grabs on block and the gap in string will allow them to connect. This means on hit you can confirm into a combo and on block you can go for a mixup between your standing and crouching grab. However due to backdash invincibility being frame 1 and universal both options can be backdashed. Thus the mixup Shazam players should use is Herculean Might to catch standing block and Atlas Tornado to catch backdash.
For some reason reversal specials (virtually all of them) beat both of Shazam's grabs. I personally think its a bug and that reversal specials have ungrabbable frames because I tested pokes quicker than the reversal specials and they do not work. Get a tester to bring it up with NRS; Shazam would definitely be stronger without this. Anyway this is simple. Atlas tornado will beat the reversal special and grabs will lose to it.
Reversal specials are generally better for the opponent to use than backdash and duck for a couple of reasons. Firstly, specials do damage and in some cases start combos making them better than backdashers. Perhaps what is not as obvious however is that the 22 string jails standing blockers between the 2nd hit and Herculean Might. So if an opponent wants to duck the Herculean Might they have to duck on the first hit or second hit, neither of which can be done on reaction to recognising the 22 string. If they start block low by default this it opens up Shazam's overhead game with f3, f12, b23 etc. A reversal special will beat Herculean might even from standing block and so is the superior option. Thus the 4 situations which should occur are
Shazam Atlas Tornado vs Stand Block
Shazam Atlas Tornado vs Opponent interrupts with reversal special
Shazam Herculean Might vs Stand Block
Shazam Herculean Might
Punishing Shazam's Tornado
I've seen a lot of people mention that 2,2 Atlas Tornado shouldn't be used because tornado can be punished by most of the cast. This isn't entirely true. Atlas Tornado can be full combo punished by anyone if it crosses them up when they are in the corner or if the Atlas Torpedo is initiated from mid or far range. However 2,2 leaves Shazam quite close to
opponent to the point where the Atlas Tornado can only be punished by 9 out the 27 current Injustice cast without using full super meter:
Can Punish
Aquaman
f2, 1+3 (15%)
Bane
d1, bf2 (8%)
Flash
bf2 (9%)
bf2 MB, 11, b22f3xxbf2 (31%)
Green Lantern
b13xxdb1 11% (0.5)
b13xxtraitxxdb1, 223xxdb1 (22)%
b13xxdb1 MB, b3, j3, 223xxdb1 (31%)
b13xxtraixxdb1, 223xxbf1 MB, 223xxdb1 (34%)
Joker
bf2 (10%)
Lex Luthor
bf2 (9%)
Nightwing (Staff)
1xxbf3 (17%)
1xxdb2 MB, b3, j2, 3, 1xxbf3 (38%)
Superman
f23, j2, f23, f2xxdf1, 3xxbf3 (29%) [38% with trait]
f23, j2, 11xxdb2 MB, b3, j3, f2xxdf1, 3xxbf3 (38%) [49% with trait]
Sinestro
4, db2 (13%)
4, db2 MB, (20%)
4, db2 MB, 4, db2 (29%)
4, db2 MB, 4, db2, 4 (32%)
Cannot Punish
Ares
Batgirl
Batman
Black Adam
Catwoman
Cyborg
Deathstroke
Doomsday
Green Arrow
Harley Quinn
Hawkgirl
Killer Frost
Lobo
Nightwing (Escrima)
Raven
Scorpion
Shazam
Solomon Grundy
Wonder Woman (Lasso)
Wonder Woman (Sword)
Everyone can punish with reversal Super except:
Aquaman
Batgirl
Green Latern
Solomon grundy
Of the 9 characters who can punish Aquaman, Bane, Joker and Lex Luthor similar damage to tornado making the mixup still worth it it many cases. Sinestro needs trait charged and Nightwing needs to be in a specific stance. This means only 3 characters in the cast (11%) are consistently shutting down the 2,2xxAT option. If Nightwing is always in Staff stance and Sinestro always manages to charge trait before you get in then that is still 5 out of the whole cast (18.5)% . Of the 22 characters left, 20 can only punish it with a full super which leaves them weak to clash. Batgirl and Solomon Grundy just have no options.
Interrupting 2,2 follow up options.
There is a gap between 2,2 and his follow up options obviously otherwise the grabs would not work on block. So opponents have a frame or two to act before whatever option Shazam chooses.
Every can character can try to try to armor through the mixup. The universal options are just frame meter burn b3/f3 and super.
If mb b3/f3 is chosen, a shazam who chooses either grab will be hit for a full combo, a shazam who uses atlas tornado will cause the move to whiff and the opponent to waste a meter. You might be able to punish a whiff with another Atlas Tornado but I haven't tested yet.
If Super is chosen then for most characters the same situation arises except with 4 meters being gambled instead of 1. However a few characters supers catch grabs and Atlas Tornado:
Aquaman
Green Latern
HawkGirl
Scorpion
Sinestro
Superman
For some reason reversal specials (virtually all of them) beat both of Shazam's grabs. I personally think its a bug and that reversal specialshave ungrabbable frames because I tested pokes quicker than the reversal specials and they do not work. Get a tester to bring it up with NRS. Anyway this is a simple 50/50. Atlas tornado will beat the reversal special and grabs will lose
This means the 4 most likely outcomes of 2,2 against the cast are
Atlas Tornado vs Stand Block = Neutral
Atlas Tornado vs Interrupt Attempt = Shazam Wins
Herculean Might vs Stand Block = Shazam Wins
Herculean Might vs Interrupt Attempt = Opponent Wins
2,2 has 50% success rate, 25% failure rate, and 25% neutral rate. Pretty good I'd say. Pretty good I'd say. The reads are in your favour vs 80% of the cast.
General tips:
1.Flash, Superman, and Green Latern will make you cry for trying to apply pressure with this string. Pay attention to what state Nightwing and Sinestro are in. Go to town on the rest of the cast unless they have Super. Never fear Grundy or Batgirl.
2. When you use the string you need to pay attention to 3 things, its takes practice
More testing to be done in the near future:
on which characters do not have 8 frame punish for baiting interrupts
How Parries, Aquaman water shield effect 22 tech trap
More complicated mathematical analysis if opponent trys to duck for bigger punish and it you try Achilles' Clutch to counter that
analysis on how worth buffering Meter Burn AT is depending on the character specific viability of meaty Herculean Might (will be done after I cover the wake-up game.
Next Topic:
Meaty Herculean Might and the Wake-up Game
Note: I make no comment on Shazam's viability. I don't want to get grief for trying to improve a character like Tom Brady did.
The 22 string
A double mid hitting string which is -9 block so you need to special out of it or it is a free punish is free for the majority of the cast. As most of you know the beauty of it is you can cancel to Shazam's grabs on block and the gap in string will allow them to connect. This means on hit you can confirm into a combo and on block you can go for a mixup between your standing and crouching grab. However due to backdash invincibility being frame 1 and universal both options can be backdashed. Thus the mixup Shazam players should use is Herculean Might to catch standing block and Atlas Tornado to catch backdash.
For some reason reversal specials (virtually all of them) beat both of Shazam's grabs. I personally think its a bug and that reversal specials have ungrabbable frames because I tested pokes quicker than the reversal specials and they do not work. Get a tester to bring it up with NRS; Shazam would definitely be stronger without this. Anyway this is simple. Atlas tornado will beat the reversal special and grabs will lose to it.
Reversal specials are generally better for the opponent to use than backdash and duck for a couple of reasons. Firstly, specials do damage and in some cases start combos making them better than backdashers. Perhaps what is not as obvious however is that the 22 string jails standing blockers between the 2nd hit and Herculean Might. So if an opponent wants to duck the Herculean Might they have to duck on the first hit or second hit, neither of which can be done on reaction to recognising the 22 string. If they start block low by default this it opens up Shazam's overhead game with f3, f12, b23 etc. A reversal special will beat Herculean might even from standing block and so is the superior option. Thus the 4 situations which should occur are
Shazam Atlas Tornado vs Stand Block
Shazam Atlas Tornado vs Opponent interrupts with reversal special
Shazam Herculean Might vs Stand Block
Shazam Herculean Might
Punishing Shazam's Tornado
I've seen a lot of people mention that 2,2 Atlas Tornado shouldn't be used because tornado can be punished by most of the cast. This isn't entirely true. Atlas Tornado can be full combo punished by anyone if it crosses them up when they are in the corner or if the Atlas Torpedo is initiated from mid or far range. However 2,2 leaves Shazam quite close to
opponent to the point where the Atlas Tornado can only be punished by 9 out the 27 current Injustice cast without using full super meter:
Can Punish
Aquaman
f2, 1+3 (15%)
Bane
d1, bf2 (8%)
Flash
bf2 (9%)
bf2 MB, 11, b22f3xxbf2 (31%)
Green Lantern
b13xxdb1 11% (0.5)
b13xxtraitxxdb1, 223xxdb1 (22)%
b13xxdb1 MB, b3, j3, 223xxdb1 (31%)
b13xxtraixxdb1, 223xxbf1 MB, 223xxdb1 (34%)
Joker
bf2 (10%)
Lex Luthor
bf2 (9%)
Nightwing (Staff)
1xxbf3 (17%)
1xxdb2 MB, b3, j2, 3, 1xxbf3 (38%)
Superman
f23, j2, f23, f2xxdf1, 3xxbf3 (29%) [38% with trait]
f23, j2, 11xxdb2 MB, b3, j3, f2xxdf1, 3xxbf3 (38%) [49% with trait]
Sinestro
4, db2 (13%)
4, db2 MB, (20%)
4, db2 MB, 4, db2 (29%)
4, db2 MB, 4, db2, 4 (32%)
Cannot Punish
Ares
Batgirl
Batman
Black Adam
Catwoman
Cyborg
Deathstroke
Doomsday
Green Arrow
Harley Quinn
Hawkgirl
Killer Frost
Lobo
Nightwing (Escrima)
Raven
Scorpion
Shazam
Solomon Grundy
Wonder Woman (Lasso)
Wonder Woman (Sword)
Everyone can punish with reversal Super except:
Aquaman
Batgirl
Green Latern
Solomon grundy
Of the 9 characters who can punish Aquaman, Bane, Joker and Lex Luthor similar damage to tornado making the mixup still worth it it many cases. Sinestro needs trait charged and Nightwing needs to be in a specific stance. This means only 3 characters in the cast (11%) are consistently shutting down the 2,2xxAT option. If Nightwing is always in Staff stance and Sinestro always manages to charge trait before you get in then that is still 5 out of the whole cast (18.5)% . Of the 22 characters left, 20 can only punish it with a full super which leaves them weak to clash. Batgirl and Solomon Grundy just have no options.
Interrupting 2,2 follow up options.
There is a gap between 2,2 and his follow up options obviously otherwise the grabs would not work on block. So opponents have a frame or two to act before whatever option Shazam chooses.
Every can character can try to try to armor through the mixup. The universal options are just frame meter burn b3/f3 and super.
If mb b3/f3 is chosen, a shazam who chooses either grab will be hit for a full combo, a shazam who uses atlas tornado will cause the move to whiff and the opponent to waste a meter. You might be able to punish a whiff with another Atlas Tornado but I haven't tested yet.
If Super is chosen then for most characters the same situation arises except with 4 meters being gambled instead of 1. However a few characters supers catch grabs and Atlas Tornado:
Aquaman
Green Latern
HawkGirl
Scorpion
Sinestro
Superman
For some reason reversal specials (virtually all of them) beat both of Shazam's grabs. I personally think its a bug and that reversal specialshave ungrabbable frames because I tested pokes quicker than the reversal specials and they do not work. Get a tester to bring it up with NRS. Anyway this is a simple 50/50. Atlas tornado will beat the reversal special and grabs will lose
This means the 4 most likely outcomes of 2,2 against the cast are
Atlas Tornado vs Stand Block = Neutral
Atlas Tornado vs Interrupt Attempt = Shazam Wins
Herculean Might vs Stand Block = Shazam Wins
Herculean Might vs Interrupt Attempt = Opponent Wins
2,2 has 50% success rate, 25% failure rate, and 25% neutral rate. Pretty good I'd say. Pretty good I'd say. The reads are in your favour vs 80% of the cast.
General tips:
1.Flash, Superman, and Green Latern will make you cry for trying to apply pressure with this string. Pay attention to what state Nightwing and Sinestro are in. Go to town on the rest of the cast unless they have Super. Never fear Grundy or Batgirl.
2. When you use the string you need to pay attention to 3 things, its takes practice
- If hit, confirm to combo
- If stand block confirm to Herculean Might (note the opponent can predict you trying to jail them and block first hit high and 2nd hit low. Only on prediction though, not reaction)
- If low block, confirm into AT/HM mixup.
More testing to be done in the near future:
on which characters do not have 8 frame punish for baiting interrupts
How Parries, Aquaman water shield effect 22 tech trap
More complicated mathematical analysis if opponent trys to duck for bigger punish and it you try Achilles' Clutch to counter that
analysis on how worth buffering Meter Burn AT is depending on the character specific viability of meaty Herculean Might (will be done after I cover the wake-up game.
Next Topic:
Meaty Herculean Might and the Wake-up Game
