Question Does Grundy Go Even Vs. Scorpion?

[Mikemetroid]

There are two things Grundy can do right in this situation... high% damages and he can also control the air. His D2 helps him vs the crossups and his armor blows right through vigorous setups when the player knows you're walking forward. Granted this is all very hard to get used too but one wrong move and scorpion could easily lose roughly 60-80% depending on the location.

Edit: please fix the god damn capitlization on my title, it is bothering me lol fuFrothyOmen Tim Static RiBBz22

 

[RiBBz22]

lol dem capz

 

[Scalabrine]

lol dem capz

Outstanding contribution to the discussion.

Yeah man i agree with everything you just posted. One thing i think hinders Grundy here is his hitbox, Scorp may be able to interrupt d2 with j1. 5-5 at the very least.

 

[RiBBz22]

Outstanding contribution to the discussion.

Yeah man i agree with everything you just posted. One thing i think hinders Grundy here is his hitbox, Scorp may be able to interrupt d2 with j1. 5-5 at the very least.

lol just a clever acknowledgement of his request that probably went over your head.

 

[Asodimazze]

Impossible....
Grundy might not suffer as some other characters against Scorpion, but the MU is not even at all, I would say at least 7-3 Scorpion.
There is no way to control the match against a "competent" Scorpion: walking corpse is useless, D2 loses nearly everytime against instant j1 and you can't throw out random air throws to get him out of the air lol.
Air to air you lose 100% of the time, MB SH is useless too because Scorpion will probably be jumping around endlessly.
He can also punish it on reaction if he stays on the ground....I really doubt any Scorpion player with a brain will throw out many hellfires - random spears just to get hit.

 

[fr stack]

i agree with mike metroid 5 frame anti air , reverse input walking corpse and just grundy in general , i have no fear of scorpion

 

[ShadowBeatz]

I was thinking this and was going to post in those ban Scorpion threads, but seeing as those things are 20 pages deep it would have gotten buried so I didn't bother

His MB-Cleaver Spin blows up all Scorp's wake-ups too, including teleport if he's in the corner

 

[1truking]

You shouldn't be using d2 against scorpion unless its to punish a ducked normal teleport even then you should be using 112 as the punish. Haven't encountered instant jump 1's but can't see it being that much of a problem. Grundy can competently stop his jump game with the AA grab its 5 frames and grundy's hit box is relatively low when ducking. its low enough to duck under some mid attacks even. you can go from crouch to f and grab scorpion before he can teleport. You want to tap the mb button too in the event that he does an instant teleport you'll end up with a cleaver mb that will lead to relatively good damage combo on him.

This is a patient match for grundy. you have to practice jumping or dashing hellfire on reaction. I'd go to training mode and record the AI doing hellfire over and over and just watching the animation. You also need to default to a low block if you do get hit by a teleport reset and practice reacting to his overheads.

I'll check out what an instant air 1 can do if anything to him but in current form I think grundy wins the scorpion match.

 

[usedcarsalesmang]

It might be 5-5 just because Grundy forces the Scorpion player to THINK during the match.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

lol no.

 

[REO]

pl said grundy beats scorp actually and its a losing mu if u play some1 who knows what they r doing.

i trust the 2 time evo champ over any of ur opinions. he also wrote a blog on how 2 deal with scorp.

 

[Scalabrine]

pl said grundy beats scorp actually and its a losing mu if u play some1 who knows what they r doing.

i trust the biased 3 time evo champ over any of ur opinions. he also wrote a blog on how 2 deal with scorp.

I fixed it for you don't worry bro.

Right now he can't be taken as a credible source for scorpion he's too biased and stubborn, unless he knows something the other pro players don't know that is.

But yeah i do agree the MU at the very least is even.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

If you have an anti air, you stand a chance.

 

[1truking]

I fixed it for you don't worry bro.

Right now he can't be taken as a credible source for scorpion he's too biased and stubborn, unless he knows something the other pro players don't know that is.

But yeah i do agree the MU at the very least is even.

REO stated that grundy beats scorpion on that podcast with tom last week. As Foxy pointed out if you have a good anti air you stand a good chance. The issue with scorpion isn't his teleport as much as its his ability to jump freely on you. jump 3 jump 1 cross ups then teleports thrown in. Typically meter burn teleports. Grundy makes this extraordinarily difficult for him by simply ducking. hold down if he leaves the ground go to f +1 you'll grab him before he can do anything and in the unlikely situation that he teleports before the grab comes out you'll reverse input a cleaver so meter burn it and you're good. He'll likely resort to a more full screen play and you can move in when he does a hellfire. Spend a couple hours in the lab and watch the animation until its second nature. its a very distinct start up on the teleport and the hellfire. You can train yourself to react to both. Well most people can some just have bad reactions but they aren't going to be doing much on fighters anyway. Jeff Schaeffer was able to dragon punch a blanka ball to start the game on street fighter 2 thats a LOT harder to do than jump a hellfire or block a teleport.

 

[Asodimazze]

Can someone here play this MU against REO's Scorpion? Let's see how it goes.

 

[1truking]

Can someone here play this MU against REO's Scorpion? Let's see how it goes.

I actually sent a pm to him asking to play. used to be friends with him so we'll see if he responds. If not I'll see if pig can set up a set against perfect legend. main issue is I'm not at the top of my game and REO is flat out better than me so is PL. i think tyrant would be the best choice to play a set like this.

I honestly think grundy will give him a hard time. 6-4 grundy or 5-5. When I play good scorpions online I usually win and my losses tend to be extraordinarily close however most are not at the same level as PL or REO.

**edit

REO responded and said we could play but said that I probably won't see scorpion for what he is since grundy can deal with his bullshit and make him play a more honestly game.

 

[K7L33THA]

There are two things Grundy can do right in this situation... high% damages and he can also control the air. His D2 helps him vs the crossups and his armor blows right through vigorous setups when the player knows you're walking forward. Granted this is all very hard to get used too but one wrong move and scorpion could easily lose roughly 60-80% depending on the location.

Edit: please fix the god damn capitlization on my title, it is bothering me lol fuFrothyOmen Tim Static RiBBz22

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

If you have an anti air, you stand a chance.

he also has free armor.... which no one else has.

I still think it is 8 kinds of not fun.... but 50% d2 combo's def. give him a punchers chance.

I'd honestly still use wonder woman though.

 

[ThatDragon]

Normally dont post on forums but I'd figured I give up this info

WCC can cover all of scorpions wakeup options if timed right.

On flipkick grundy will take the first hit and will grab like normal if timed as late as possible.
If expecting a normal teleport reverse your cancel command for a free 112 punish (Grundy walks out of the way of the punch)
Or if MB tele the first hit will whiff but you can armor trait the 2nd hit for a that free dmg

Note: It is really hard to tell if reg or MB tele is comming so its best to use the 3rd option every time so that it covers everything (just take the trait dmg instead of trying to 112 punish is the easiest option). The best thing about this is it puts scorpion back on the floor resetting the situation all over again. The High dmg of grundy and this setup I feel forces scorpion to be far less reckless then in other matchups.

Again i'm not big on posting but hopes this helps anyone

 

[1truking]

Normally dont post on forums but I'd figured I give up this info

WCC can cover all of scorpions wakeup options if timed right.

On flipkick grundy will take the first hit and will grab like normal if timed as late as possible.
If expecting a normal teleport reverse your cancel command for a free 112 punish (Grundy walks out of the way of the punch)
Or if MB tele the first hit will whiff but you can armor trait the 2nd hit for a that free dmg

Note: It is really hard to tell if reg or MB tele is comming so its best to use the 3rd option every time so that it covers everything (just take the trait dmg instead of trying to 112 punish is the easiest option). The best thing about this is it puts scorpion back on the floor resetting the situation all over again. The High dmg of grundy and this setup I feel forces scorpion to be far less reckless then in other matchups.

Again i'm not big on posting but hopes this helps anyone

Tried this a bit against REO. Its kind of difficult to do and he can simply not wake up and jump which puts you back into his vortex.

Anyway taking into account reo is much better than I am right now I'd say its 6-4 scorpion maybe 5-5. Grundy can do well but he has to play almost perfect. The biggest issue I had was jump 1 and neutral jumping. It's difficult to time an AA grab on a neutral jump consistently. The jump 1 is difficult to AA grab or d2. Its somewhat like batmans jump 2 if you've ever had a time where you ddi an AA grab and it just didn't grab him but you got hit instead except it happens a bit more consistently. Possibly scorpions hurt box changes a bit when he uses it. I dont notice the issue against jump 3 at all. REO didn't go for damage in his combo's it was almost pure meter building so he could mb teleport whenever he wanted.

In the end scorpion dictates the pace of the match even more than a deathstroke match.

I'm not sure that I'd say he's overpowered to the point of needing a ban but I think he's strong enough it may take several months to really get down how to figth a high level scorpion and win consistently.

I tried to record the matches but we played on ps3 and couldn't get my lgp to work on ps3. still not sure why on that one but there didn't seem to be a signal from the component even after I adjusted it.

 

[Asodimazze]

Tried this a bit against REO. Its kind of difficult to do and he can simply not wake up and jump which puts you back into his vortex.

Anyway taking into account reo is much better than I am right now I'd say its 6-4 scorpion maybe 5-5. Grundy can do well but he has to play almost perfect. The biggest issue I had was jump 1 and neutral jumping. It's difficult to time an AA grab on a neutral jump consistently. The jump 1 is difficult to AA grab or d2. Its somewhat like batmans jump 2 if you've ever had a time where you ddi an AA grab and it just didn't grab him but you got hit instead except it happens a bit more consistently. Possibly scorpions hurt box changes a bit when he uses it. I dont notice the issue against jump 3 at all. REO didn't go for damage in his combo's it was almost pure meter building so he could mb teleport whenever he wanted.

In the end scorpion dictates the pace of the match even more than a deathstroke match.

I'm not sure that I'd say he's overpowered to the point of needing a ban but I think he's strong enough it may take several months to really get down how to figth a high level scorpion and win consistently.

I tried to record the matches but we played on ps3 and couldn't get my lgp to work on ps3. still not sure why on that one but there didn't seem to be a signal from the component even after I adjusted it.

May I ask what was the score?
I don't think you lost only because REO is better, it just isn't a good MU in my opinion.
You cannot anti air his j1 consistently, it comes out too fast and from close distance it's unreactable; his j3 if spaced right can't be anti aired too.
He can do whatever he wants against Grundy, you can win only if you get lucky

 

[1truking]

0-15 no the match up isn't quite as bad as you're saying. there's a large skill gap right now. I"d likely go 0-15 against any of his characters though thats how bad the skill gap is right now. Gimme a couple months of sparring with pig tom and reo and we'll see if the match changes.

 

[Asodimazze]

Ok, let's see how the MU evolves in a couple of months then

 

[fr stack]

Can someone here play this MU against REO's Scorpion? Let's see how it goes.

not everyone can play like reo

 

[Sasuga]

I'm inclined to think that any character that can get a good punish off of a D1 stands a good chance. You can punish his teleport on whiff easily and you may even be able to interrupt his MB teleport. Not sure about that, tho. Have to test that.

I really start to think that when Scorpion is left untouched and people are getting the hang of the MU, he will drop down on the tier list immensly. Scorpions game will not evolve past his scrubby, random shit but the rest of the cast will evolve to deal with him.