Question - Hellfire Converting off the blockstring

[TheArrow]

Hey guys, so i recently swapped from Inferno Scorpion, too Hellfire Scorpion. I did this because I saw someone on a stream that was fireball cancelling 2 times, then doing whatever mix up he wanted, and it just looked sick. So, here i am.

I can 214 - FBC - 214 - FBC - 214 - dash cancel - perfectly. My problem however, is actually converting off the 214 when they try and poke out of it, and get hit by the string. Because right now, im inputting the fireball command straight after the 214. So ill 214 - and fireball, thinking they will block it, the problem is when they dont. The 214 hits them, but ive already inputted the fireball command, so i cant do the basic TP into BnB's off it.

Now, this is a rare occasion, usually they just hold their block for the entire thing, and i can do whatever mix up i want once my stamina goes out, but whenever they dont block it, im missing around 30 ish % by not being able to follow up on it. Do any other Hellfire players have this problem? The online input lag doesnt help either

 

[Eddy Wang]

You can option select a teleport, as a second command, it will erase the fireball you inputed first and replace with the teleport.

Its stupid but some idiots on TYM think option selects are fair, so learn to use them

Input FBC first, if the let go block on the first or second hit and you have already inputed fire ball, input teleport to cancel the fireball and use teleport instead.


You can also option select ex teleport out of B12

Input B12~~ex tp~~BB11

On hit, ex teleport comes out and you get a full combo, on block B121 comes out and leaves you at -1, which you can teleport cancel on purpose afterwards to avoid counter poking.

Its stupid but yeah, no one should've access to such things in the game, but it seems its not going away, so might as well just let the Computer do all the work for you, the time of balsy reads are gone.

 

[TheArrow]

You can option select a teleport, as a second command, it will erase the fireball you inputed first and replace with the teleport.

Its stupid but some idiots on TYM think option selects are fair, so learn to use them

Input FBC first, if the let go block on the first or second hit and you have already inputed fire ball, input teleport to cancel the fireball and use teleport instead.


You can also option select ex teleport out of B12

Input B12~~ex tp~~BB11

On hit, ex teleport comes out and you get a full combo, on block B121 comes out and leaves you at -1, which you can teleport cancel on purpose afterwards to avoid counter poking.

Its stupid but yeah, no one should've access to such things in the game, but it seems its not going away, so might as well just let the Computer do all the work for you, the time of balsy reads are gone.

I dont really get this. It just sounds like you're saying, input the fireball, and if you notice they stop blocking, input the teleport ?

 

[Eddy Wang]

I dont really get this. It just sounds like you're saying, input the fireball, and if you notice they stop blocking, input the teleport ?

That's dumb right? That is exactly what you have to do.

If your string has not yet ended, you can erase the fireball input with teleport that is why is called option selects.

Be aware that there is a timing for it as well.

 

[Ze Dingo]

Fuck option selects. I don't care how many tournaments I travel to, I refuse to use them.

But yes, what Eddy said.

 

[Triplswing]

Wait, so your FBC is getting interrupted after 214 is blocked?

That really shouldn't happen, unless it takes over 40 frames to get your next 214 out. In which case you need more practice.

 

[TheArrow]

Wait, so your FBC is getting interrupted after 214 is blocked?

That really shouldn't happen, unless it takes over 40 frames to get your next 214 out. In which case you need more practice.

No. When i do the fireball cancel, im instantly inputting the Db1 for the fireball. Except sometimes they drop their block, so they actually get hit by the 214. except ive already inputted the fireball, so instead of TP'ing and doing a normal BnB, i just throw a fireball at nothing, and theyre knocked full screen

 

[Eddy Wang]

No. When i do the fireball cancel, im instantly inputting the Db1 for the fireball. Except sometimes they drop their block, so they actually get hit by the 214. except ive already inputted the fireball, so instead of TP'ing and doing a normal BnB, i just throw a fireball at nothing, and theyre knocked full screen

If you suspect they will drop the last hit then instead of fireball switch with ex spear.

To avoid this, input the fireball window as late as possible, so if you see connecting you can teleport on reaction instead, or you can option select fireball with teleport.

 

[Triplswing]

Taking the last hit of 214 is pretty much the best thing they can do because it messes up your hitconfirm and is less damage than taking the whole blockstring. If this happens and you already buffered the fireball you can dash cancel it and get okizeme, or hold it and see what they do on wakeup. Don't run cancel it because it's not worth the stamina and you have enough time that you don't actually need to.

If you are expecting this method of escape you can attempt to teleport, or for a safe option you can do an EX spear.

EX spear cannot be neutralducked from this string too so that's good.

 

[TheArrow]

If you suspect they will drop the last hit then instead of fireball switch with ex spear.

To avoid this, input the fireball window as late as possible, so if you see connecting you can teleport on reaction instead, or you can option select fireball with teleport.

Im still confused when you " option select '. iv'e heard the term before, and i know what it is. But you cant option select the teleport / fireball. You just have to do it on reaction

 

[Eddy Wang]

Im still confused when you " option select '. iv'e heard the term before, and i know what it is. But you cant option select the teleport / fireball. You just have to do it on reaction

Keep confused then.

 

[Triplswing]

My question is why would you bother with the extra inputs?

It's more than easy enough to buffer your fireball/teleport AFTER the hitconfirm, unless they stop blocking before the third hit. Why the need to override your inputs?

 

[Eddy Wang]

My question is why would you bother with the extra inputs?

It's more than easy enough to buffer your fireball/teleport AFTER the hitconfirm, unless they stop blocking before the third hit. Why the need to override your inputs?

What option select do is overriding inputs that you have already pressed before.

In scorpion's case, lets say you want to input B12 teleport, but you have not sure if it will hit, or if it will get blocked, so you let the CPU do the read for you, you option select ex teleport and erase it by finishing the string.

Since the game has two different of buffer window, one for blockstuns and one for hit stuns, on hit your ex teleport comes out (taking advantage of the buffer) and on block your ex teleport input is overrided with the last string of B121 that you have started the combo with.

This is the most common, yet there are strings that allows you to input a special attack very earlier than required, but the buffer windown is so big, that you can option select both so on block it comes out one special and on hit another one comes out instead.

For instance, 214 has a very big buffer window, you can either input a special much earlier, or you can input a bit later, on a match, lets say your opponent got caught blocking 214~FBC reps, now lets say they released block on the first hit of the 214 string during the second rep, but you have already input the fireball code, after the last hit scorpion will launch the fireball because you already told the system to do that.

Option selecting that would solve the problem, instead of doing on reaction which is impossible.

~~ = Option select
214~~FB~~ teleport = if they get caught by the first hit teleport comes out not Fireball, if they block the first hit, Fireball comes out
B12~~exteleport~~ BB1 = If they block ex teleport doesn't come out and finish the string, if hits, the opposite happens.
F4~~ex Teleport~~ ex Spear = if they get hit By F4 ex teleport comes out, if they block ex spear comes out.

Its not that easier either because you have to get familiar with the timing most of the time, and if you screw up, GG bro.


But the solution for him is much easier
He just needs to input either teleport or Fireball as late as possible on the cancel window, which happens between the second and third hit of 214, if the second hit gets blocked you now have to guess either with ex spear in case they let go block on the last hit, or ex fireball in case they don't.

 

[Scoot Magee]

Just don't buffer the fb motion right away when inputting 214. You have plenty of time to buffer whatever move you want so just wait a little longer and input qcb 1 if it's blocked and 3 if it hits. It's actually a very easy confirm.

 

[Triplswing]

That reminds me, I noticed something when I was recording the blockstring mixups video.

I set the AI to record 214xxFBC, b3xxspear. I had the block mode on stance block when I recorded it.

When I set the AI to playback, I'd block the 214, and he would do it, except that when I blocked the b3, he wouldn't do the spear. I didn't have any other inputs buffered, just what I said before. When b3 hit, he would cancel into spear, but on block he would kill the combo. This is probably either a peculiar mechanic relating to blockstun, or a training mode bug. I have not been able to consistently replicate this but I have done it a couple more times.

 

[Eddy Wang]

That reminds me, I noticed something when I was recording the blockstring mixups video.

I set the AI to record 214xxFBC, b3xxspear. I had the block mode on stance block when I recorded it.

When I set the AI to playback, I'd block the 214, and he would do it, except that when I blocked the b3, he wouldn't do the spear. I didn't have any other inputs buffered, just what I said before. When b3 hit, he would cancel into spear, but on block he would kill the combo. This is probably either a peculiar mechanic relating to blockstun, or a training mode bug. I have not been able to consistently replicate this but I have done it a couple more times.

Option select, its something unintended that came along with the game.

 

[Chrishaspads]

Just don't buffer the fb motion right away when inputting 214. You have plenty of time to buffer whatever move you want so just wait a little longer and input qcb 1 if it's blocked and 3 if it hits. It's actually a very easy confirm.

Wow. I was trying to react to the confirm this whole time lol. Thank you so much! Didn't even realize how long you could wait to input the db1/3