Breakthrough Character Specific Hitboxes

[ryublaze]

I have compiled a list of which characters can duck under 1 or F2 and which cannot. Here are situations where 1 and F2 are used:

1:
- 1, 1, 2, Red Dash, 1, 1, 4 (After a standing reset if you mistime the 1 and the opponent is in crouch block, it will whiff on some characters. If timed correctly though, it will hit on all characters.)
- 1, 1, 4, Red Dash (After 1, 1, 4, Red Dash if you do another 1, 1, 4 and the opponent is in crouch block, the 1 will whiff on some characters.)

F2:
- 1, 1, 2, EX Dagger (dash cancel), F2, 1, 2, 1+2 (After a standing reset if you use an EX Dagger and dash cancel into F2, the F2 will whiff on some characters.)

---

For every character, 1 whiffs on neutral crouch because it hits high. "Hit/Whiff" means sometimes it will hit and sometimes it will whiff. Some characters have a little note saying that you can make F2 hit on crouch block if you use an EX Dagger at jump distance, which is after a 1, 1, 2 standing reset. If you think this can be formatted better, please let me know.

Spoiler: Character List

All Characters:
1:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Scorpion:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Liu Kang:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Kung Lao:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Sub-Zero:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Sindel:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit/Whiff​

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

Note: (At touching to jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Ermac:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Reptile:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Kitana:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Johnny Cage:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Jade:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Mileena:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Nightwolf:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Cyrax:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Noob Saibot:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Smoke:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger on block makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Sektor:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Sonya:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

Jax:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Kano:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Stryker:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Shang Tsung:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Baraka:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Kabal:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Raiden:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Sheeva:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Quan Chi:
1:

Crouch Block: Whiff​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit/Whiff​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Cyber Sub-Zero:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit/Whiff​

Note: (At touching to jump distance, EX Dagger makes F2 hit if dash cancelled quickly.)

Kratos:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Skarlet:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Whiff​

Note: (At jump distance, EX Dagger makes F2 hit if cancelled quickly.)

Kenshi:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Rain:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Freddy Krueger:
1:

Crouch Block: Hit​

F2:

Neutral Crouch: Hit/Whiff​

Crouch Block: Hit​

Conclusion:
Characters 1 Hits On Neutral Crouch:
None

Characters 1 Hits On Crouch Block:
Scorpion, Liu Kang, Sub-Zero, Sindel, Ermac, Kitana (Hit/Whiff), Jade, Nightwolf, Cyrax, Noob Saibot, Smoke, Sonya, Kano, Stryker, Shang Tsung, Kabal (Hit/Whiff), Raiden, Sheeva, Cyber Sub-Zero, Kratos, Skarlet, Kenshi, Rain, Freddy Krueger

Characters F2 Hits On Neutral Crouch:
Scorpion, Liu Kang, Sub-Zero, Sindel (Hit/Whiff), Jade, Nightwolf, Noob Saibot, Smoke, Sonya, Kano, Stryker, Shang Tsung, Baraka, Kabal, Raiden, Sheeva, Quan Chi (Hit/Whiff), Cyber Sub-Zero, Kratos, Skarlet, Kenshi, Rain, Freddy Krueger (Hit/Whiff)

Characters F2 Hits On Crouch Block:
Scorpion, Liu Kang, Sindel (Hit/Whiff), Ermac (Hit/Whiff), Jade, Cyrax (Hit/Whiff), Noob Saibot, Sonya (Hit/Whiff), Stryker, Shang Tsung, Baraka, Raiden, Sheeva, Cyber Sub-Zero (Hit/Whiff), Kratos, Kenshi, Rain, Freddy Krueger

---

Characters 1 Whiffs On Neutral Crouch:
All Characters

Characters 1 Whiffs On Crouch Block:
Kung Lao, Reptile, Kitana (Hit/Whiff), Johnny Cage, Mileena, Sektor, Jax, Baraka, Kabal (Hit/Whiff), Quan Chi

Characters F2 Whiffs On Neutral Crouch:
Kung Lao, Sindel (Hit/Whiff), Ermac, Reptile, Kitana, Johnny Cage, Mileena, Cyrax, Sektor, Jax, Quan Chi (Hit/Whiff), Freddy Krueger (Hit/Whiff)

Characters F2 Whiffs On Crouch Block:
Kung Lao, Sub-Zero, Sindel (Hit/Whiff), Ermac (Hit/Whiff), Reptile, Kitana, Johnny Cage, Mileena, Nightwolf, Cyrax (Hit/Whiff), Smoke, Sektor, Sonya (Hit/Whiff), Jax, Kano, Kabal, Quan Chi, Cyber Sub-Zero (Hit/Whiff), Skarlet

 

[Skitzo]

This is really helpful! I've been wondering this for awhile. Thanks.

Also, where is Kabal on this list?

 

[Eddy Wang]

RedRaptor10, this will take a while to memorize, i use to think there is 3 kinds of hitbox characters
- Regulars: The ones who 1 on neutral crouch whiffs but f2 hits on neutral crouch
- Low hitboxes: The ones who 1 on neutral crouch or block whiffs, F2 on neutral crouch or crouch block whiffs
- High hitboxes: the ones who 1 on neutral crouch or crouch block hits, F2 on crouch block whiffs.

i used to build my traps based on this assumption, now i will have to change all back

 

[ryublaze]

This is really helpful! I've been wondering this for awhile. Thanks.

Also, where is Kabal on this list?

Lol oops I must have missed 2 characters. I'll get Kabal and Raiden later. Thanks!

 

[ryublaze]

RedRaptor10, this will take a while to memorize, i use to think there is 3 kinds of hitbox characters
- Regulars: The ones who 1 on neutral crouch whiffs but f2 hits on neutral crouch
- Low hitboxes: The ones who 1 on neutral crouch or block whiffs, F2 on neutral crouch or crouch block whiffs
- High hitboxes: the ones who 1 on neutral crouch or crouch block hits, F2 on crouch block whiffs.

i used to build my traps based on this assumption, now i will have to change all back

Yeah the hitboxes are weird in this game. I don't think you have to memorize this. Some characters are kind of obvious. If you aren't sure about the character you're fighting, you can always use B1, 1, F4.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Yeah the hitboxes are weird in this game. I don't think you have to memorize this. Some characters are kind of obvious. If you aren't sure about the character you're fighting, you can always use B1, 1, F4.

That makes sense hahahaha

 

[Skitzo]

I memorized Kabal's, I can memorize Skarlet's no prob. I'm on a mission.

 

[ryublaze]

Eddy Wang Hazezie

I think the only thing worth memorizing is which characters F2 hits/whiffs on crouch block since that is important in the standing reset into EX Dagger setup. Everything else like F2 on neutral crouch doesn't matter much.

 

[Skitzo]

Sounds good, thanks!

 

[Eddy Wang]

Eddy Wang Hazezie

I think the only thing worth memorizing is which characters F2 hits/whiffs on crouch block since that is important in the standing reset into EX Dagger setup. Everything else like F2 on neutral crouch doesn't matter much.

Yeah, so meaning, regular hitbox characters hahaha

 

[fr stack]

time to roll a a fatty an get to studyin cheers RedRaptor10 this will be very helpful

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

time to bring this back...I think these rules change after an EDC. A characters hitbox is pushed back slightly causing it to grow a little. This makes characters it would usually whiff on, hit more consistently.

I need to tes this. Can this list in the OP be put to the test a little bit more? I need to make another video but this information is vital for it.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Redraptor 10
Ninj
Eddy Wang
fr stack

 

[gdf]

Looks like I know why Kung Lao can spin dagger cancel pressure, I thought I was special .

 

[Eddy Wang]

time to bring this back...I think these rules change after an EDC. A characters hitbox is pushed back slightly causing it to grow a little. This makes characters it would usually whiff on, hit more consistently.

I need to tes this. Can this list in the OP be put to the test a little bit more? I need to make another video but this information is vital for it.

What's EDC.A?

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Eh Dagger Cancel.

A is a part of he next sentence.

 

[AssassiN]

If only I had a lot more time, would have finished my anti-pressure thread and started collecting info for stuff like this.
I know the B2 hits everyone in every state from a certain distance(=- 1 step back), no idea if this is handy to know.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Eh Dagger Cancel.

A is a part of he next sentence.

Oww, i see now thanks ^^
There is no need for testing, actually this is one of the things that has contributed for a drastic change in skarlet play style.
This one red noticed when he discovered the red pain setup i believe, and then on EGP stream and MLG anaheim scar was using downslash to cover this weakness, and this actually made them realize they have to block standing most of the time.
All the mixups possibilities that came from 112 reset in order to force someone block standing was because of this thread in particular

Those BnBs we were discussing 4 months ago that leaves skarlet in advantage after a 112 rd giving her a +9 i believe, killed the possibility of standing 1 whiff on any character of the game as they crouch to avoid the red pain pressure (114 ex dc to jail them standing).
And in addiction, Scar in EGP and MLG Anaheim was using Downslash out of resets against those players who imediatly block low to avoid red pain pressure.

I mean, on these days against a very good Skarlet player to crouch block out of resets to avoid chip damage and meter refueling, the player has to be really very good.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Oww, i see now thanks ^^
There is no need for testing, actually this is one of the things that has contributed for a drastic change in skarlet play style.
This one red noticed when he discovered the red pain setup i believe, and then on EGP stream and MLG anaheim scar was using downslash to cover this weakness, and this actually made them realize they have to block standing most of the time.
All the mixups possibilities that came from 112 reset in order to force someone block standing was because of this thread in particular

Those BnBs we were discussing 4 months ago that leaves skarlet in advantage after a 112 rd giving her a +9 i believe, killed the possibility of standing 1 whiff on any character of the game as they crouch to avoid the red pain pressure (114 ex dc to jail them standing).
And in addiction, Scar in EGP and MLG Anaheim was using Downslash out of resets against those players who imediatly block low to avoid red pain pressure.

I mean, on these days against a very good Skarlet player to crouch block out of resets to avoid chip damage and meter refueling, the player has to be really very good.

no you miss understand. Overhead slash after 112 rd is easily avoidable on reaction. no matter if you usually go for slide or overhead. They can duck instinctively and upon seeing the overhead, stand block and punish accordingly. When you play pig's mileena, Osu 16 nits kitana, Cat's Kabal, etc...they will make you pay every time and can see the overhead coming a mile away and react. Your stratagey (described above) at the highest level will not pay off.

What Im trying to figure out is after 112 EDC, which characters the f212 will hit on crouch block and which ones will whiff. This is essential when approaching certain MU and has the potential to change your BNB drastically. It is also very important when looking at her MU chart. Large hitbox characters are forced to deal with her and to alter your BNB for this is essential. This is the Next video i will make but I need confirmation on these things before I can do that.

 

[Eddy Wang]

no you miss understand. Overhead slash after 112 rd is easily avoidable on reaction. no matter if you usually go for slide or overhead. They can duck instinctively and upon seeing the overhead, stand block and punish accordingly. When you play pig's mileena, Osu 16 nits kitana, Cat's Kabal, etc...they will make you pay every time and can see the overhead coming a mile away and react. Your stratagey (described above) at the highest level will not pay off.

Every players who gets a 112 reset, fuzzy guards by instinct, or block low to bait an overhead this isn't actually surprising, its up to you to know how to disrupt your opponent guard, now matter how reactive they're. Everyone can block a DownSlash these days, but that is not what you should really do if you know they'll eventually block it if they see it miles away.

As for the test, i think i can help, but only in the comming weekend, regular days i've been kinda busy.
But wait a minute, do you want to do a 112 EDC to F212 while they crouch block? its that it?

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

But wait a minute, do you want to do a 112 EDC to F212 while they crouch block? its that it?

yes

I want to know whats guaranteed with minimal risk. reset into EDC into f212 string is no risk. I just want to know all who I can do it against.

 

[Eddy Wang]

yes

I want to know whats guaranteed with minimal risk. reset into EDC into f212 string is no risk. I just want to know all who I can do it against.

i think i'll be able to help you guys testing. just wait for a few days

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Ok so I just tested this.

Quan
Kabal
Kano
Jax
Sonya
Sektor
Smoke
Mileena
Cage
Kitana
Reptile
Lao

These are the only characters f2will whiff on when done from a combo. I never do f212 string unless from a combo reset so I tested it this way. Some characters you need to be VERY quick with your cancels but it's possible with 100% consistency with practice. I did find some cool stuff while practicing this though.

Video coming soon

 

[Alien Substance]

Even though I don't play Skarlet, I like the OP because Kratos wasn't forgotten.

Interesting how 1 hits him on crouch block and F+2 hits him on neutral crouch and crouch block when Kratos has a miniscule hitbox similar to Sub-Zero. Dem Blades of Exile must increase Kratos' hitbox size when he blocks with them.