Question A few Q's from a new SHAZAM! Player

[GuyLightning]

Hey there guys, how's it going.

Obviously here 'cause I just recently, as in this past week, decided to pick up SHAZAM! (And yes, I will type his name like that forever). I took him into practice against Luthor (Corps Charge Reversal and added Duck to movement type) Just to start to practice some stuff with him. Also took him online for a few matches just to get a basic handle on him..still rough around the edges..but I think I can get the hang of him. Have a few questions for those who used SHAZAM! longer than me.


1. Is Blocked J1 - Herculean Might a viable set up? It does work, at least in practice, that a blocked J1 can lead directly into a Herculean Might without it being countered in any way (Beats the reversal and cannot be dodged by ducking after the block). I'm wondering if this is practical.

2. Is Blocked J2/J1 - F12 a viable frame trap? Much like question one, it seems to work in practice mode against auto duck, reversal corps charge Luthor. I know D12 is safe on block..I just don't know if it is actually viable in a match.

3. Is there any blockstring/hard knockdow that makes it safe/ideal to cancel into trait? I do know that his trait helps him achieve max potential, and would like to know how to use this more often.

4. Is there any trick or method to insure that you get Herculean Might over Achilles Clutch, or is this just a practice thing? I just hate it when I think i made the full motion and get Achilles Clutch, it may just be something I have to delay the 1 when doing down-back-forward. Still not 100% sure..but doesn't mean I won't put in the time for it.


Any help is appreciated.

 

[TopTierHarley]

@Indecisive
@shinobispectre
@Heroic_Legacy
@mfkaoz
@Digit

 

[mfkaoz]

I haven't used j1 since like the first week of playing him so I can't help with those. You can activate trait safely off of 112 and f223 as well as standing 3 I think. With HM you just really gotta grind out the input. Took me a while to hit it consistently and I still mess it up from time to time.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

I can answer 4 - It's a practice thing. HM is forward so unless you press the button early you shouldn't be getting AC. It's definitely something you'll want to practice. Getting AC instead of HM at a critical moment WILL kill you.

 

[FOREVER EL1TE]

For trait setups here are a few.
B3 to f3 leads to setup where trait is safe and you can continue oki.
Cancelling f22 into trait while in his standard 1 bar bnb is good.
After a mb charge trait setup works.
Whats d12? Im pretty sure there is no string like that unless you mean, "D1, D2" @GuyLightning

 

[GuyLightning]

For trait setups here are a few.
B3 to f3 leads to setup where trait is safe and you can continue oki.
Cancelling f22 into trait while in his standard 1 bar bnb is good.
After a mb charge trait setup works.
Whats d12? Im pretty sure there is no string like that unless you mean, "D1, D2" @GuyLightning

I apologize, it's Foward 1,2. The High,Overhead chain. That is my bad.

Question at top has been changed to correct my own mistake.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

Cancelling f22 into trait while in his standard 1 bar bnb is good.

Wait you can get f22xxtrait and still continue with the reset HM?

...man, I GOTTA keep up with tech, this is criminal that I didn't know this.

 

[FOREVER EL1TE]

Wait you can get f22xxtrait and still continue with the reset HM?

...man, I GOTTA keep up with tech, this is criminal that I didn't know this.

@GuyLightning and @Mortal Komhat
You can do J2,F22 Trait HM, but this is gimmicky and can be ducked out of or possibly backdashed.
I was saying that in the middle of a combo you can do F22 trait and then a oki setup lol,
F12 is valuable in a match as it can catch people off guard waiting for the HM.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

Ah, that makes way more sense.

 

[NoobHunter420]

normal into cycle crusher, that's how the pros do it.

 

[JustPressingButtons]

Ji1~ HM is a tick throw that works on hit and block. Idk why people don't use it much.

 

[SuppaSapien3]

Welcome man!I think,(well I know) I consider myself the Shazam lord, and the best Shazam player on Earth, so let me take a earthshake at it. I can only tell you some facts based off my experience, and I don't know where exactly you are, but lets start this carnival:

1. Yes J1 into HM is a great setup and should be used by alot of shazam players especially in conjuction with his mF3 and HM in the corner for mixups. However it does have a certain amount of flaws that make it a bit inconsistent midrange.

-Its has noticeably shorter reach than his j2
..... In matchups where you are playing against good defensive characters with amazing anit-airs( ex. sinestro d2, aquaman 3 and D2) j1's range just doesnt measure up to the reach of his j2, although in these matchups you should refrain from jumping too much in neutral game. But when you do j2 the risk/reward factor just doesn't cut it for you to at attempt.

-It acually isnt a true jail string
..... Shazam is one of the characters in this game where the less you know about it, the more he can get away with. Just watch any stream with shazam, and you will see him trapping people with his 2,2 string into HM, ending blockstrings into torpedo to make it "safe", YOLO raw torpedo, canceling his d1 into torpedo for the bait, or even his j1 into HM at times. Sadly once you know what they put in the popcorn to make it so salty you dont want to eat it anymore. The problem with all these things is that NONE OF THEM ARE SAFE and can be punished by something or another. (ex. D1 into 2 is a trade depending on the matchup, or reversal uppercut punisable.) Im not saying not to do these things to play with the oppenent, as the fortune teller has to make her money, and as some of these are extremely important for Shazam's neutral, but only to not be surprised when you see a well learned person blowing up for habits that you though you could go autopilot on,when you fight good opponents. Im not gonna expose how to counter all these things because of the scouts, but if you go into practice and set shazam to j1 HM on record, you will see that you can acually Mb3 shazam out right before the grab comes out since b3's have grab invinsibility. I think you can even do a normal b3 although my tests or a bit inconsistent for this. Finally if the j1 acually ends up hitting, you end up whiffing the HM, making a wasted opportunity which Shazam can't afford to make.

2. I have the same argument for this method if you are using the j1 after the j2 to jail into HM, although I have one thing to say about this as well
-Your HM can be really inconsistent if you cross over the opponent with j1 it makes the already difficult HM a bit harder as you would have to change your controls to the other side. And also somethings the j1 doesnt consistently hit certain characters and everyone if they duck after j2.

3.Pretty much everything everyone said so far but I have a couple.
-Standing 3
..... I dont think anyone saids this but shazams standing 3 canceled into trait makes him completely safe. I tested it from reversal corps charge from lex and you get to block imediately after. The only problem is you don't really get any true pressure from it, as there's not even time to mf/b3 after, but depends on the character.
-Backgrounds
..... If you didnt know already as some people even on tis forum doen't know , anytime you do a intractable Kickback-bounce(?), it results in a hard knockdown, with means you oppenent cant tech roll and stays on the ground long enough for you to trait. You can get a 32 percent combo if you do HM-b3-j3-f1-into the bounce-trait. Benifits tremendously spending the meter on a mF3 mixup on hard knockdown afters since it gets a huge damage boost in trait.
-Stage interactables
..... I believe there is a forum on here that shows the various stages shazam can trait up on. I know on the fork of solitude stage you can combo in trait after you use
the laser extension, and on joker's/Arkham asylum if you hit opponent with ice, you have enough time to trait up, and do the guaranteed j2, into f2,2 delayed HM jail. If you need visuals maybe someone can get you the post name for that.

4. I hate that the trapeze artists preform to the same tune, but practice, Practice, PRACTICe makes the asymptote to perfect. All I can recommend is to input the forward part of down back foward 1 the same time you input the 1. Anything after that is mustle memory.

Well did you enjoy the rides??? Enjoyed the lion tamer??? If you ever need any help with Shazam, or need to play some matches to see how to better play him Im always on PSN: SupaSapien3, althoug I recommend to choose someone else because I hate the shazam mirror house match

Closing time everyone out!!!! SHAZZZZZZAM!!!!

 

[GuyLightning]

I would like to thank everyone that has given advise on this thread so far, it is much appreciated. These will help me in learning this new character.

I am on PS3 @ GuyLightning...I don't have a PS4 yet, but do plan on getting one and should be getting better internet connections in the near future. Also, when I get my Ps4...I MAY need to change my screen name (Forgot my passcode long ago and if i remember correctly, it is a hassle to get it back)

Thanks much
-Guy Lightning

 

[Mortal Komhat]

I should really post my PSN/XBL screen names to actaully play dang.

PSN : SatsuiNoHatman
XBL : Hatman EXTRA

I'll TRY and not do only Shazam mirrors but I don't know anyone else as much as I know him. In fact, hint hint, anyone wanting to steer me towards a secondary will be most welcome.

(Although right now I'm going to the Montreal weekly. I'mma get bodied )

 

[SuppaSapien3]

I should really post my PSN/XBL screen names to actaully play dang.

PSN : SatsuiNoHatman
XBL : Hatman EXTRA

I'll TRY and not do only Shazam mirrors but I don't know anyone else as much as I know him. In fact, hint hint, anyone wanting to steer me towards a secondary will be most welcome.

(Although right now I'm going to the Montreal weekly. I'mma get bodied )

Secondary? Fun answer. Either bane or lobo. They do similar things on knockdown minus teleport. Lobo has meterless high low guessing options. But bane with trait lays those hands on you for that damage baptism lol. Realistic answer ("the right anwser") Martian Manhunter

 

[GuyLightning]

Back again, few more questions.

1. Does SHAZAM! have any answers against characters with Hyper Armor properties, more specifically Max Venom Bane, Luthor, and Doomsday. Is there ANY way to deal with that or is it just playing a Magic Powered Waiting game?

2. If a SHAZAM! faces down a Zone-Spam Deathstroke, is there anything he can really do to get in, or is it just once he gets you to half screen it's lockdown?

Any advise is helpful

 

[SuppaSapien3]

Back again, few more questions.

1. Does SHAZAM! have any answers against characters with Hyper Armor properties, more specifically Max Venom Bane, Luthor, and Doomsday. Is there ANY way to deal with that or is it just playing a Magic Powered Waiting game?

2. If a SHAZAM! faces down a Zone-Spam Deathstroke, is there anything he can really do to get in, or is it just once he gets you to half screen it's lockdown?

Any advise is helpful

Well against doomsday match--ups a well timed MBb3 can hit doomsday out of his MB venom if he does it from far away. I usually just blocked banes charge in level 3 and dash back. Don't have too much matchup experience against Lex, but I think in all three of these match ups you can spam back teleport and use your bolts to control your opponent to get in range for your b2 or HM, as both doomsday and bane has no projectiles and are forced to get in. Lex once again im not sure but once you get him in a hard knockdown make sure he stays down. Death stoke aww man, I honestly believe this is the worst character you can play agaisnt with shazam; definitely my worst. His multiple projectiles completely shuts down his teleports and jump. I know rule of thumb is it takes shazam two dashes to get in, so after everytime you block any gunshots with shazam make sure you dash once. when you get around range MB F3 is really the only thing that can deal with him as his j3 beats any of shazams jumps and his HM. You literally have to turtle and inch your way in which automatically puts the advantage in his favor, as when you do get in shazam just does not have the buttons or footsies to compete with deathstoke. and about all else WATCH HIS METER. If he has meter his guns are safe on block and can blow up your dashes so be watchful. Honestly I think you should pick another character in this match up like the flash.

 

[Ray'sGoodLiquor]

If you're playing on stick, do the HM forward input until it hits the edge of the gate. When you do an AC input, just press down, then back until you hit the corner of the gate. Make sure you have release check turned off.

 

[KIllaByte]

Hold the down button down with your thumb for the entirety of the Herculean Might, then roll back, and roll forward. This is what allowed me to finally, only get Herculean Might when I need it, and it becomes a pretty quick input for me.
If you need pressure and crossup gimmicks (which work more often than not), or stage tech, ask me.

 

[Error]

I think I tested this a while ago, but F22Trait on hit on a standing opponent leaves you at enough adv to do d1xxhm, the opponent can back-dash out.

 

[Indecisive]

Back again, few more questions.

1. Does SHAZAM! have any answers against characters with Hyper Armor properties, more specifically Max Venom Bane, Luthor, and Doomsday. Is there ANY way to deal with that or is it just playing a Magic Powered Waiting game?

2. If a SHAZAM! faces down a Zone-Spam Deathstroke, is there anything he can really do to get in, or is it just once he gets you to half screen it's lockdown?

Any advise is helpful

To deal with Bane just run away and let him hang himself. Teleport away as much as you can. If he knocks you down teleport more. Punish moves that he wiffs like Venom Uppercut. Learn to Push block at the right times. Punish his dash in with Torpedo. If you grab him with HM or AC do the longest combo you can.

For DS you get a free dash after every blocked shot. If you get hit by one take a second and block the next one. If you try to dash after getting hit with one you will get shot. Respect his WU game to some extent since he can option select his sword flip and sword spin. So its hard to cross him up on WU. If he does F3 you can dash back to get out of it. Your D2 is really good and you can D2 his Ji 3 at certain heights and angles. He all he does is spam guns just be patient. You do way more damage than him. Also at Certain distances if he does a low shot you get a free Trait activation. Remember this. Hopefully this helps.

 

[jozuvloke]

You can jump in with f12, if landed cancel into triat, close distance block the wake up or go with down 1 then pressure!

 

[KIllaByte]

To deal with Bane just run away and let him hang himself. Teleport away as much as you can. If he knocks you down teleport more. Punish moves that he wiffs like Venom Uppercut. Learn to Push block at the right times. Punish his dash in with Torpedo. If you grab him with HM or AC do the longest combo you can.

For DS you get a free dash after every blocked shot. If you get hit by one take a second and block the next one. If you try to dash after getting hit with one you will get shot. Respect his WU game to some extent since he can option select his sword flip and sword spin. So its hard to cross him up on WU. If he does F3 you can dash back to get out of it. Your D2 is really good and you can D2 his Ji 3 at certain heights and angles. He all he does is spam guns just be patient. You do way more damage than him. Also at Certain distances if he does a low shot you get a free Trait activation. Remember this. Hopefully this helps.

You absolutely do not need to respect Deathstrokes wakeups, Indy.
At least, not the traditional sword oriented ones, and not after hard knockdowns.
Teleporting through Deathstroke's wakeups after a MB Atlas torpedo, or a sweep hard knockdown allows you to keep your offense going against the Stroker.
Atlas Torpedo MB > Forward Dash > Forward teleport.
After those, Sword spin will whiff, and you'll be in range for raw herculean might, or anotehr Atlas torpedo.
If Deathstroke sword flipped, he'll whiff, and be in whiff recovery for long enough for you to Atlas torpedo him again. (preferably meterburned, because it's cool, and useful.)

 

[Vengeance135]

Welcome man!I think,(well I know) I consider myself the Shazam lord, and the best Shazam player on Earth, so let me take a earthshake at it. I can only tell you some facts based off my experience, and I don't know where exactly you are, but lets start this carnival:

1. Yes J1 into HM is a great setup and should be used by alot of shazam players especially in conjuction with his mF3 and HM in the corner for mixups. However it does have a certain amount of flaws that make it a bit inconsistent midrange.

-Its has noticeably shorter reach than his j2
..... In matchups where you are playing against good defensive characters with amazing anit-airs( ex. sinestro d2, aquaman 3 and D2) j1's range just doesnt measure up to the reach of his j2, although in these matchups you should refrain from jumping too much in neutral game. But when you do j2 the risk/reward factor just doesn't cut it for you to at attempt.

-It acually isnt a true jail string
..... Shazam is one of the characters in this game where the less you know about it, the more he can get away with. Just watch any stream with shazam, and you will see him trapping people with his 2,2 string into HM, ending blockstrings into torpedo to make it "safe", YOLO raw torpedo, canceling his d1 into torpedo for the bait, or even his j1 into HM at times. Sadly once you know what they put in the popcorn to make it so salty you dont want to eat it anymore. The problem with all these things is that NONE OF THEM ARE SAFE and can be punished by something or another. (ex. D1 into 2 is a trade depending on the matchup, or reversal uppercut punisable.) Im not saying not to do these things to play with the oppenent, as the fortune teller has to make her money, and as some of these are extremely important for Shazam's neutral, but only to not be surprised when you see a well learned person blowing up for habits that you though you could go autopilot on,when you fight good opponents. Im not gonna expose how to counter all these things because of the scouts, but if you go into practice and set shazam to j1 HM on record, you will see that you can acually Mb3 shazam out right before the grab comes out since b3's have grab invinsibility. I think you can even do a normal b3 although my tests or a bit inconsistent for this. Finally if the j1 acually ends up hitting, you end up whiffing the HM, making a wasted opportunity which Shazam can't afford to make.

2. I have the same argument for this method if you are using the j1 after the j2 to jail into HM, although I have one thing to say about this as well
-Your HM can be really inconsistent if you cross over the opponent with j1 it makes the already difficult HM a bit harder as you would have to change your controls to the other side. And also somethings the j1 doesnt consistently hit certain characters and everyone if they duck after j2.

3.Pretty much everything everyone said so far but I have a couple.
-Standing 3
..... I dont think anyone saids this but shazams standing 3 canceled into trait makes him completely safe. I tested it from reversal corps charge from lex and you get to block imediately after. The only problem is you don't really get any true pressure from it, as there's not even time to mf/b3 after, but depends on the character.
-Backgrounds
..... If you didnt know already as some people even on tis forum doen't know , anytime you do a intractable Kickback-bounce(?), it results in a hard knockdown, with means you oppenent cant tech roll and stays on the ground long enough for you to trait. You can get a 32 percent combo if you do HM-b3-j3-f1-into the bounce-trait. Benifits tremendously spending the meter on a mF3 mixup on hard knockdown afters since it gets a huge damage boost in trait.
-Stage interactables
..... I believe there is a forum on here that shows the various stages shazam can trait up on. I know on the fork of solitude stage you can combo in trait after you use
the laser extension, and on joker's/Arkham asylum if you hit opponent with ice, you have enough time to trait up, and do the guaranteed j2, into f2,2 delayed HM jail. If you need visuals maybe someone can get you the post name for that.

4. I hate that the trapeze artists preform to the same tune, but practice, Practice, PRACTICe makes the asymptote to perfect. All I can recommend is to input the forward part of down back foward 1 the same time you input the 1. Anything after that is mustle memory.

Well did you enjoy the rides??? Enjoyed the lion tamer??? If you ever need any help with Shazam, or need to play some matches to see how to better play him Im always on PSN: SupaSapien3, althoug I recommend to choose someone else because I hate the shazam mirror house match

Closing time everyone out!!!! SHAZZZZZZAM!!!!

LOL MY DUDE SAID SHAZAM LORD! LMAO that had me dying, ggs i lost

 

[SuppaSapien3]

You absolutely do not need to respect Deathstrokes wakeups, Indy.
At least, not the traditional sword oriented ones, and not after hard knockdowns.
Teleporting through Deathstroke's wakeups after a MB Atlas torpedo, or a sweep hard knockdown allows you to keep your offense going against the Stroker.
Atlas Torpedo MB > Forward Dash > Forward teleport.
After those, Sword spin will whiff, and you'll be in range for raw herculean might, or anotehr Atlas torpedo.
If Deathstroke sword flipped, he'll whiff, and be in whiff recovery for long enough for you to Atlas torpedo him again. (preferably meterburned, because it's cool, and useful.)

In addition to this if you think hes gonna wake up in summary just block. You can get in a better positioning for punishing if you dont want to risk doing your torpedo late.