Accurate Frame Data

So I may or may not regret doing this lol....BUT I am willing to check for accurate frame data for whatever character you guys choose. It will be on a first come, first serve basis. As a disclaimer, I don't have the game yet(don't even have the damn PS4), but if you can email me the footage I will describe, I can check it that way.

So for this to go as smoothly as possible, please try to follow these steps for the best results. I did this for IGAU for a select few characters and it worked perfectly. Some stuff in their forums I have yet to edit, but the game is practically dead anyways...But here goes:

General Info before you start:
- Leave your button inputs on
- Please try to be offline doing this to prevent any lag that hits the training room....call me crazy, but I don't know about anyone else, for IGAU I would get lag in the lab upon signing on
- Set the AI to tech roll always (**after this, start recording for the following steps onward**)
- Always at the very start, do a few naked neutral jumps spaced a few seconds apart
- Go to the move list of said character and highlight over every move for just 2-3 seconds. Literally, just go over the very first move, count to 2 or 3 and then move down and so on until you cover all the moves.
- Just do every move and special, EX special, X-Ray at point blank range so I can check it's correct startup
- If it's a long ranged move, again first do it at point blank range, and then feel free to perform it at the distance of your choosing so I can check it
- Any hidden moves, just make a note of it for me through PM or in the email, the input of it and then follow the steps below also

For anything on hit:
- Set the AI to "jump always"
- RIGHT after you input said move/special, hold up and keep holding up until you're both airbourne for a few jumps. Then you're free to move to the next move/special. This process really shouldn't take no more than 5 seconds per move/special

For anything on block:
- In IGAU this was incredibly easy because the reversal icon was to the frame and there were various parries to test this. I assume it's the same at least for the reversal icon
- Set the AI to "block always"
- Preferably use a parry reversal such as Kitana's Assassin parry, or anything with armor(doesn't matter what character the AI is for the most part)
- For this, just wait until the AI gets out the start of said reversal and then you're free to move on to the next move/special

For cancel advantage on block:
- Now this is kinda tricky. In IGAU this was also hella easy thanks to everyone having a wall/floor bounce cancel that could be delayed. Idk 100% how to go about this in MKX, but let's try.
- Find the longest EX move in duration and even better would be if it's one that can be delayed
- Again set the AI to "block always" and to an armored reversal special. At the very least if you can't delay anything, you want to at least have it hit the armored special. If you can't delay it and its hitting the opponent before their reversal even pops up, you're just at that much advantage.
- I'm thinking using the run cancel might work but I don't know enough of it to give any solid thoughts to use it for this

For cancel advantage on hit:
- Set the AI to "jump always"
- Again, find the longest EX special in duration or one that you can delay
- So long as the AI can jump slightly before getting knocked out of their jump, that's good enough. You want to try to get them to at least jump up to waist height before getting hit so it can be as accurate as possible

****I WILL POST UNDER AND EDIT THE OP IF ANYTHING CHANGES****

I thought of doing this whole PM thing for my email, but if a lot of you will potentially be sending footage, I'll just leave it here. When you send it, make sure if it's multiple files, label what's within each one, and for the email subject, what character it is and what variation(s)

[email protected]

I haven't had some free time in a while and my laptop is running again and I'm kinda overwhelmed at all the possibilities again lol....hence why I'm bumping this again to see if anyone wants anything checked tonight

Sorry if this is a known thing, but I didn't really play Injustice, just MK9 and MKX. Was Injustice's frame data never corrected? I noticed that frame data is wrong in MKX, but I just kind of assumed NRS would patch it to correct it. Is that not the case with Injustice and therefore a terrible assumption lol?

SCK ERR0R MACR0 said:

Sorry if this is a known thing, but I didn't really play Injustice, just MK9 and MKX. Was Injustice's frame data never corrected? I noticed that frame data is wrong in MKX, but I just kind of assumed NRS would patch it to correct it. Is that not the case with Injustice and therefore a terrible assumption lol?

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Injustice was more or less accurate for normals and grounded specials. Everything else had flaws in it and it didn't cover cancel advantage. MKX is hella worse and I doubt they'll fix it any time soon, if at all

How do you even fuck up in game frame data? Is it like previous data that never got updated as they continued to develop fighters or something? To check it do you just record yourself doing the attack and play it back in adobe or something and click the next frame button over and over until it connects? If it's something that simple there's no excuse for allowing inaccurate frame data into the game. But it's fine to slap a price tag on every other piece of content. Hey maybe we'll be able to pay for accurate frame data someday.

RampaginDragon said:

How do you even fuck up in game frame data? Is it like previous data that never got updated as they continued to develop fighters or something? To check it do you just record yourself doing the attack and play it back in adobe or something and click the next frame button over and over until it connects? If it's something that simple there's no excuse for allowing inaccurate frame data into the game. But it's fine to slap a price tag on every other piece of content. Hey maybe we'll be able to pay for accurate frame data someday.

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That's basically the only way known so far. Has to be done manually. what NRS does is let the computer check it for them in which its marking down from the very first frame after impact in most cases, hence the waayyyyyy off numbers for airbourne specials/normals

@Konqrr @Youphemism @STORMS

And idk who else to tag that would be interested in this. Only being persistent with this because if I don't get enough requests, then I'll just work on another project altogether

Hmm, I don't have much free time right now but I finish on Friday and might be able to do some of this. I mean I'm not going to play online 'cause fuck that so I could work on this

Extracting record from PS4 converts the videos at 30fps, everything is reduced by half, i won't help to know some things, but general stuffs like dashes, jumps and startups can be determined faster. just my two cents

Perhaps I'm not updated on current consensus about cancelling, but we really need to know what exactly those numbers mean. Maybe it's already figured out ofc, but maybe this is our best way to finally solve it.

Youphemism said:

Hmm, I don't have much free time right now but I finish on Friday and might be able to do some of this. I mean I'm not going to play online 'cause fuck that so I could work on this

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Eddy Wang said:

Extracting record from PS4 converts the videos at 30fps, everything is reduced by half, i won't help to know some things, but general stuffs like dashes, jumps and startups can be determined faster. just my two cents

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That's perfectly fine and why I'm asking to send ME the files for the time being because

1) I have editing software that let's me control the speed of footage so I can reduce it to half speed and that way each frame played out acts like its 60fps

2) I checked enough moves in IGAU to know how to look for the startup of cancel advantage above all else, as well as the rest of the moves that need to be checked

Barrogh said:

Perhaps I'm not updated on current consensus about cancelling, but we really need to know what exactly those numbers mean. Maybe it's already figured out ofc, but maybe this is our best way to finally solve it.

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I sincerely doubt anyone has the exact numbers, only an idea of what they can and can't do which can still be off. All I'm asking in this is the footage by following the steps above. I'd take care of the rest

Akromaniac27 said:

1) I have editing software that let's me control the speed of footage so I can reduce it to half speed and that way each frame played out acts like its 60fps

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The problem is that there will be frame skips I believe.

Akromaniac27 said:

I sincerely doubt anyone has the exact numbers, only an idea of what they can and can't do which can still be off. All I'm asking in this is the footage by following the steps above. I'd take care of the rest

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Well, it's not even about accurate numbers at this point, it's possible we don't even know what exactly number in "cancel" field is supposed to mean, its accuracy notwithstanding. Unless I've missed signs that it was figured out.

Barrogh said:

The problem is that there will be frame skips I believe.


Well, it's not even about accurate numbers at this point, it's possible we don't even know what exactly number in "cancel" field is supposed to mean, its accuracy notwithstanding. Unless I've missed signs that it was figured out.

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There should only be frame skips if whatever used to record is malfunctioning. Other than that, videos sped up or slower down of the program I use stay intact. I've done for +30 different clips checking moves so thats how I know it works

And for the "cancel" field, even stuff on block is off. All the more reason to get this ball rolling because nrs is not going to fix it

Akromaniac27 said:

There should only be frame skips if whatever used to record is malfunctioning. Other than that, videos sped up or slower down of the program I use stay intact. I've done for +30 different clips checking moves so thats how I know it works

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Well, I mean, I don't know how it works for PS4, but it's unclear if original poster meant that extracted videos are saved in 30 fps while retaining original speed - meaning that every second frame is cut. Probably that's the case.

Barrogh said:

Well, I mean, I don't know how it works for PS4, but it's unclear if original poster meant that extracted videos are saved in 30 fps while retaining original speed - meaning that every second frame is cut. Probably that's the case.

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Nothing is cut. The game plays at 60fps but files are saved at 30. Reducing it to half speed let's you "roll it out" and see the game frame by frame after

Akromaniac27 said:

Nothing is cut. The game plays at 60fps but files are saved at 30. Reducing it to half speed let's you "roll it out" and see the game frame by frame after

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I think you are wrong here.

Unless I'm completely misunderstanding what you are talking about, you can't simply add 30 extra frames to the second, between the 30 frames in that second. It just doesn't work that way.

In a 30fps video, each frame takes up 1/30 a second. In a 60fps video, each frame takes up 1/60 a second. So in a 30fps video, each frame takes up 2/60 a second. There is 30 frames of data lost from the actual game data when you view a 30fps video that is of 60fps native content.

This isn't CSI.

purbeast said:

I think you are wrong here.

Unless I'm completely misunderstanding what you are talking about, you can't simply add 30 extra frames to the second, between the 30 frames in that second. It just doesn't work that way.

In a 30fps video, each frame takes up 1/30 a second. In a 60fps video, each frame takes up 1/60 a second. So in a 30fps video, each frame takes up 2/60 a second. There is 30 frames of data lost from the actual game data when you view a 30fps video that is of 60fps native content.

This isn't CSI.

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So it might be the latter. I just know that slowing down the footage to half speed does in fact play different animations frame by frame and doesn't skip anything. Playing it slower than that however does cause a few skips. Checking anything frame by frame using this method was accurate after time and time again

i have a question? why is this move -19 and says 0 in game... why does it start counting down from point of last impact? i tested it and couldnt come up with the reason but maybe cuz it has -18 recovery frames on that move... why would we not count after opponent starts blocking.

look at my thread for pics. freeze frames, and footage : http://testyourmight.com/threads/predators-b3d2-is-not-zero-on-block.54257/#post-1814836

i would appreciate an explanation very much.