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Discussion - "Shut up and get better"

SaltShaker

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
HGTV Soapboxfan said:
I'm saying that you should play a character that is a balance of your strengths and viability. If your strengths are weak in the game, level up your own skills to match what is good in the game. If your only good at one thing then you are limiting yourself.
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So if I play Raven and Frost, one top 5 char and 1 viable char, that support each other well covering each others MUs with completely diff playstyles, but I lose by minimum life lead in a match I was hit by 3 robots, 2 off of hard knockdowns and one respawn from 3/4 away, that took 54% of my health, then I have 1 question.

How would I "level up" my Frost and Raven on a stage like Metro roof? Not ever get knocked down? Not ever get pushed back from a string or push blocked? Dodge EVERY single robot ever thrown with those ridiculous hit boxes against good players who know when to time their throws? Play with a char that I haven't put in 50 hours of practice and 4000 matches?

Exactly how do I level up in this situation?
 
G

Garr123

Noob
I'm not amazing at this game and I think Superman is a giant pile of unbalanced bullshit, but I've never jumped on here to create a thread demanding he be nerfed and just committed myself to learning the matchup.

But then I played Hakan in SF4 so perhaps my tolerance for actually having to learn matchups is well worn.
 
HGTV Soapboxfan

HGTV Soapboxfan

"Always a Pleasure"
SaltShaker said:
So if I play Raven and Frost, one top 5 char and 1 viable char, that support each other well covering each others MUs with completely diff playstyles, but I lose by minimum life lead in a match I was hit by 3 robots, 2 off of hard knockdowns and one respawn from 3/4 away, that took 54% of my health, then I have 1 question.

How would I "level up" my Frost and Raven on a stage like Metro roof? Not ever get knocked down? Not ever get pushed back from a string or push blocked? Dodge EVERY single robot ever thrown with those ridiculous hit boxes against good players who know when to time their throws? Play with a char that I haven't put in 50 hours of practice and 4000 matches?

Exactly how do I level up in this situation?
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putting time into either a different character or a different solution for those robots
 
Lt. Boxy Angelman

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
SaltShaker said:
So if I play Raven and Frost, one top 5 char and 1 viable char, that support each other well covering each others MUs with completely diff playstyles, but I lose by minimum life lead in a match I was hit by 3 robots, 2 off of hard knockdowns and one respawn from 3/4 away, that took 54% of my health, then I have 1 question.

How would I "level up" my Frost and Raven on a stage like Metro roof? Not ever get knocked down? Not ever get pushed back from a string or push blocked? Dodge EVERY single robot ever thrown with those ridiculous hit boxes against good players who know when to time their throws? Play with a char that I haven't put in 50 hours of practice and 4000 matches?

Exactly how do I level up in this situation?
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Pick up someone who can handle those stages either through tactics or character type.

Legit. It's not the most endearing answer, but if it's a matter of being prepared for competition, you've gotta be prepared for all walks of battle, big or small.
 
B

BlaqandMild15

Noob
HGTV Soapboxfan said:
Maybe you should have put that time into a character that doesn't get bodied 9 1, or trained a counter pick. It's no one else's fault but your own that you won't play someone else.
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I don't follow numbers man and I don't complain when I lose. And what happened at the gauntlet will have nothing to do with how I would do. Im not going to counter pick just because top jades got destroyed by the top kenshi. And like I said, I play who's style appeals to me. Im not enjoying the game if Im using a character that don't appeal appeal to me even if I were to win with him.
 
HGTV Soapboxfan

HGTV Soapboxfan

"Always a Pleasure"
Lt. Box said:
Pick up someone who can handle those stages either through tactics or character type.

Legit. It's not the most endearing answer, but if it's a matter of being prepared for competition, you've gotta be prepared for all walks of battle, big or small.
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Omg somebody else gets its.
 
HGTV Soapboxfan

HGTV Soapboxfan

"Always a Pleasure"
BlaqandMild15 said:
I don't follow numbers man and I don't complain when I lose. And what happened at the gauntlet will have nothing to do with how I would do. Im not going to counter pick just because top jades got destroyed by the top kenshi. And like I said, I play who's style appeals to me. Im not enjoying the game if Im using a character that don't appeal appeal to me even if I were to win with him.
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Okay then why are you on this competitive forum arguing about playing to win? Haha.
 
SaltShaker

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
HGTV Soapboxfan said:
putting time into either a different character or a different solution for those robots
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The only other char I can play on a competitive level is Sinestro, who I use the robots myself on a stage like Metro. But the diff between my Frost/Raven skills in comparison are a clear enough diff that I wouldn't use him against a high enough level player. I've actually been trying to get him up to speed mainly for stages like Metro and Arkham.

Solution wise, the only thing I've found that works best is to pray to God I get the Fortress with Frost and Hall of Justice with Raven. Hopefully I'll come up with a better one in the future.
 
Lt. Boxy Angelman

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
HGTV Soapboxfan said:
Omg somebody else gets its.
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:D.

The problem isn't the game, OR the people upset about its supposed imbalances.

The problem is that everyone is looking at this game through eyes that are trying to fit it into the mesh of an even close to conventional fighter, a tradition that a recent trend of the more popular games of the moment - IGAU, MK, Marvel, Persona when it first dropped, TTT2's unique and supreme tag dynamic - are beginning to veer away from. Not everything fighter related is going to be precise and calculated like SF4, balanced to almost a flatline like a KOF, and everybody seems to have this underlying fundamental perception of what a competitive fighting game is SUPPOSED to be, while seemingly completely ignoring the precedents that this genre's most popular titles have set.
Every major popular fighter has its own tier/niche of genuinely broken capability. All of them.
The old SF's, MVC2, MVC3, Kabal, Devil Jin, every memorable title had its own filth.
That didnt make them any less memorable or historic in their own rights when held against the more traditional titles.

What's wrong with it being different?

And why does that make it not competitive?
 
SaltShaker

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Lt. Box said:
Pick up someone who can handle those stages either through tactics or character type.

Legit. It's not the most endearing answer, but if it's a matter of being prepared for competition, you've gotta be prepared for all walks of battle, big or small.
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I agree, this is what it's coming down to. I'm one percent away from coming to the conclusion that if i'm playing someone on my level, or slightly lower or slightly higher, then I will lose more matches than not on the rooftop. I've got a decent sized group that plays religiously, and we had a lil 8man crash at one of the guys house Sat. night. One of the guys kept picking Metro and I swear he only won like ONE match against me in every other stage, and we split the rooftop 6Wins each or something like that. He was pretty good don't get me wrong, but I was getting hit with like 3 of those things a match!!! Needless to say, I was whining like a 2 year old.

My main issue with that is in fighters there should be stages that benefit one char type over another, but it shouldn't be THAT much of a game changer.
 
Lt. Boxy Angelman

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
SaltShaker said:
I agree, this is what it's coming down to. I'm one percent away from coming to the conclusion that if i'm playing someone on my level, or slightly lower or slightly higher, then I will lose more matches than not on the rooftop. I've got a decent sized group that plays religiously, and we had a lil 8man crash at one of the guys house Sat. night. One of the guys kept picking Metro and I swear he only won like ONE match against me in every other stage, and we split the rooftop 6Wins each or something like that. He was pretty good don't get me wrong, but I was getting hit with like 3 of those things a match!!! Needless to say, I was whining like a 2 year old.

My main issue with that is in fighters there should be stages that benefit one char type over another, but it shouldn't be THAT much of a game changer.
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Absolutely. Power VS Acrobat in and of itself can make things way too difficult in some matches.
 
DuskAlloy

DuskAlloy

You don't got the cash, You don't get the ass
Lt. Box said:
:D.

The problem isn't the game, OR the people upset about its supposed imbalances.

The problem is that everyone is looking at this game through eyes that are trying to fit it into the mesh of an even close to conventional fighter, a tradition that a recent trend of the more popular games of the moment - IGAU, MK, Marvel, Persona when it first dropped, TTT2's unique and supreme tag dynamic - are beginning to veer away from. Not everything fighter related is going to be precise and calculated like SF4, balanced to almost a flatline like a KOF, and everybody seems to have this underlying fundamental perception of what a competitive fighting game is SUPPOSED to be, while seemingly completely ignoring the precedents that this genre's most popular titles have set.
Every major popular fighter has its own tier/niche of genuinely broken capability. All of them.
The old SF's, MVC2, MVC3, Kabal, Devil Jin, every memorable title had its own filth.
That didnt make them any less memorable or historic in their own rights when held against the more traditional titles.

What's wrong with it being different?

And why does that make it not competitive?
Click to expand...
MVC2 and 3 were garbage but people played it because it was fun, I wont comment about Mk9, but I find I have a lot more fond memories of great games that were balanced then ones that had poor balance, Garou MOW is one of the best fighting games of all time, but unfortunately Third strike is more well known then it despite it being an unbalanced mess of a game
 
Swindle

Swindle

Philanthropist & Asshole
HGTV Soapboxfan said:
Player A should have played a power character. By picking a gadget or acrobat, you know you can be at a disadvantage. Now the debate over whether certain aspects of the game are good is different. But both players have access to the same tools.
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Amen, brother. A competitive player knows the game, and its match ups. The interactables are essentially part of every characters' kit, for better or worse.
 
SaltShaker

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Lt. Box said:
Absolutely. Power VS Acrobat in and of itself can make things way too difficult in some matches.
Click to expand...
O yea. I still have a hard time figuring out how to start a match with Raven on Arkham. Do I Soul Crush in fear of the TV jump, have it blocked and get combo'd for 40%?. Do I dash and risked being combo'd for 40% to start a match? Do I jump in and risk being countered to start a match? Do I stand there and let them make the 1st move and take a TV to the face? Do I jump back or dash back and take a TV to the face?

With Frost I normally take my chances with a slide and it works out well enough 9/10 times. But with Raven it's "lol take that Teen Titan". Lol

I've got to come up with something soon to deal with Arkham and Metro. I cringe when those stages win the vote and I'm playing a strong competitor.
 
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