Meter-building

[Predannok]

I wanted to know what u guys think about the defender building no meter while the attacker builds a buttload of meter while hes/shes using strings or specials.

With the inclusion of FBC the meter-building IMO is a little too much for the Attacker. Don't get me Wrong, I have nothing against FBC its a nice mechanic that Adds in more Mindgames but while ur blocking and hoping u could get them off u with a Blockbreaker the opponent is building just enough meter to bait ur poke or armor atempt with armor.

I'll use KK vs Kenshi as an example: During the keep away game Kenshi can build 2-3 bars pretty quick, while KK most likely will spend hes meter on mb Sunbeam or Mb Sundisc/Bladethrow to get in or heal. By the time the Emperor has got in and is able to punish ,Kenshi has already built enough meter to break and push Kahn back to continue the keep away while building meter and Kotal probably just wasted is meter during a combo that lead to nothing.

This game favors the attackers way too much and If the Defender would build meter while blocking block breakers would actually have a Usage.

 

[Jer]

This thread was made 4 years ago im sure lol.

 

[kabelfritz]

i think meter build for hitting on block and taking hits is the worst thing nrs has done. it doesnt make a sense. the defender should be rewarded with meter for blocking correctly (and the better they do, get a chance to break momentum with armor etc.) and the attacker for connecting hits. so you get meter for doing something good, not for something bad. right now it is only a casual-friendly mechanic so that they can get their xray out at some point.

 

[Predannok]

the defender should be rewarded with meter for blocking correctly (and the better they do, get a chance to break momentum with armor etc.) and the attacker for connecting hits. so you get meter for doing something good, not for something bad.

exactly especially with the Focus on 50/50s and rushdown blocking should be rewarded since its for the most part guessing.

 

[Eddy Wang]

The basic rule of MK is that chip damage builds a lot of meter, its a way to reward the attacker and a way to screw up the person blocking so they won't stay blocking forever because it gives the opponent a but load of meter.

But i agree that some characters build too much meter with little to no impact into their games, yes thunder god raiden, erron black etc etc

 

[SaltShaker]

I remember saying this a while back.

Makes no sense that I can make multiple good defense reads blocking and get nothing, but the aggressor gets both chip damage and meter. It's hard to buy into defenses of this.

 

[ando1184]

I wish it was different as well block breakers shouldn't be two bars either. This game caters wayyyy too much for the offensive player. If it was balanced between offense and defense mechanics that would be fine, but this is the third NRS game that is still following the same formula. That is very depressing when ya look at it because if NRS still follows the same track record, we won't see too many changes kenshi, Kung Lao, jax, raiden, Sonya, and erron black build way too much meter effortlessly in this game and while other characters are left in the dust.

 

[RexyWrecks]

This is what allows block breaker to be somewhat viable.

 

[Braindead]

This is build on MK9 where 50/50s were very few in the game, so blocking wasn't difficult and you shouldn't be rewarded for just sitting there blocking since it was the simpler thing to do.

The attacker was the one taking the risks trying to open you up so he was justly rewarded.

 

[Predannok]

This is build on MK9 where 50/50s were very few in the game, so blocking wasn't difficult and you shouldn't be rewarded for just sitting there blocking since it was the simpler thing to do.

The attacker was the one taking the risks trying to open you up so he was justly rewarded.

In MK9 it made sense but Not in here where Everything is about rushdown and 50/50s. When they redesign and add new mechanics they should have thought about the old mechanics and how they'd work together with the new mechanics.

This is what allows block breaker to be somewhat viable.

I disagree you will only gain meter if u attack wether the Opponent blocks or gets hit. Why should Blood God Kotal kahn waste 2 bars of meter if he needs it to inflict damage and MUST do that damage ? Look at Raiden that Mofo only needs meter for shocker but in Thunder god he builds insane amount while he can afford wasting the meter for Blockbreakers even though hes a Rushdown Character ,you see the imbalance?

 

[SaltShaker]

This is build on MK9 where 50/50s were very few in the game, so blocking wasn't difficult and you shouldn't be rewarded for just sitting there blocking since it was the simpler thing to do.

The attacker was the one taking the risks trying to open you up so he was justly rewarded.

Fast forward to MKX, and it's the complete opposite of what you said. The current system is clearly outdated.

 

[ChaosTheory]

It was the incentive to let go of block in MK9. Overhead/low options for the most part were reactable, way punishable, or both so that wasn't much of an issue. It was more about string staggers, etc. to pressure. I think the idea is great for how MK9 worked in that way. Obviously not everything built meter in a balanced way and some characters did too much chip... but the idea behind it was a great way to get people to let go of block.

The nature of MKX may or may not mesh as well. We'll see. But they know they nailed it with the meter system in MK9, so it was obvious to bring it back.

 

[haketh]

NRS's meter system is very well designed

But the meter gain system makes no fucking sense. Also can we be rid of First Attack meter Bonus Christ.

 

[Predannok]

We'll see.

are 2 mounths not enough?

 

[Awsumpossm]

Also can we be rid of First Attack meter Bonus Christ.

Whaaaat? I love the bonus granted to the first attack. Makes the opening move even more of a gambit.

 

[Eddy Wang]

NRS's meter system is very well designed

But the meter gain system makes no fucking sense. Also can we be rid of First Attack meter Bonus Christ.

The first hit bonus wasn't a thing until the last build, i don't why they change their minds into this, considering some characters are already stupid strong with a bar, i really though they would ditch this mechanic out.

It would be nice for once to get your meter to build from zero, so who made the first mistake would take some decent damage.

 

[ChaosTheory]

are 2 mounths not enough?

It really depends. In our case (going by history), we don't have the final version of the game. Significant changes could be on the horizon that changes the perception of different mechanics of the game. Even if we do have the final version of the game currently... we're not "playing" the final version yet. At this point in MK9 players weren't even anti-airing, counter-poking, or other basic fundamentals. So I take a wait-and-see approach with how it ends up being balanced, if that even changes at all.

I'm a defensive player, but I do like that the meter-build is awarded to the proactive. Keeping yourself out of situations where you have to defend pressure is an element of the game not to overlook. I just want said meter-build to be balanced and not built in an obscene way by certain strings, etc.

What I don't want is for meter to be a given. I don't like an overabundance. Gaining meter for blocking is a step in that direction.

 

[itz My Call]

I like the meter build as. It's an offensive game. Blocking is bad in this game. There is no reward for blocking outside of reducing the damage you take. It works for the rest of the design of the game.

Design principles are fine as long as there are consistent rules that are easy for the player to understand.

The thing that they need to look at is scaling of true strings and the meter reward for multi hitting attacks. Currently there is a raw value assigned for each individual hit blocked.

So Raiden holding a button that counts as 7 hits or whatever builds way more meter than a single hit that does equal damage.

The run cancel strings are a different issue. It gives too much meter and slants the reward too far into the attackers favor. Simplest solution is to scale meter gain against a series with no holes.

 

[MK_Al]

I think the meter building system is good the way it is. Building meter for blocking attacks would mean that the active player gets a penalty. That seems way more stupid to me; you'd get punished for doing what is the essence of the game (trying to take yoour oponents life). Chars with no 50/50s would have a bad time.
I think building meter for getting hit is a good enough comeback mechanic.

If Kenshi builds 2-3 meter on you during a round you might be to hesitant; he'll need 23 blocked specials to do so. KK can build good meter with whiffing the AA grab.

Currently there is a raw value assigned for each individual hit blocked. So Raiden holding a button that counts as 7 hits or whatever builds way more meter than a single hit that does equal damage.

I did some research on the meter building and made a post some weeks ago. http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/mkx-rules-for-meter-building.53010/
A string essentially builds the same meter like the individual hits would; I guess thats fine.

 

[itz My Call]

I think the meter building system is good the way it is. Building meter for blocking attacks would mean that the active player gets a penalty. That seems way more stupid to me; you'd get punished for doing what is the essence of the game (trying to take yoour oponents life). Chars with no 50/50s would have a bad time.
I think building meter for getting hit is a good enough comeback mechanic.

If Kenshi builds 2-3 meter on you during a round you might be to hesitant; he'll need 23 blocked specials to do so. KK can build good meter with whiffing the AA grab.



I did some research on the meter building and made a post some weeks ago. http://www.testyourmight.com/threads/mkx-rules-for-meter-building.53010/
A string essentially builds the same meter like the individual hits would; I guess thats fine.

You sure? It seems Raiden might be an exception. Something like b3,2 looks like it builds way more meter than a non multi hitting 2 attack string

 

[TarkatanDentist]

Not gonna lie, I hate that the vast majority of specials moves now only build up 4% of a bar of meter - very annoying.

I also don't like that you don't build up any meter for connecting with attacks - the hell is that?

 

[ChaosTheory]

Not gonna lie, I hate that the vast majority of specials moves now only build up 4% of a bar of meter - very annoying.

I also don't like that you don't build up any meter for connecting with attacks - the hell is that?

It's a balancing decision. Building meter for every non-special hit on top of dishing out 30% damage is excessive.

 

[kabelfritz]

I think the meter building system is good the way it is. Building meter for blocking attacks would mean that the active player gets a penalty. That seems way more stupid to me; you'd get punished for doing what is the essence of the game (trying to take yoour oponents life). Chars with no 50/50s would have a bad time.
I think building meter for getting hit is a good enough comeback mechanic.

why would simply "being active" be rewarded? the way it is now, characters with stupid block pressure get rewarded so that they can do even more of it, while its super hard (and probably needs meter) to get out. if their activity is good, like in opening up people, they should be rewarded with meter, but so should the opponent be for playing good defense.

 

[Zoidberg747]

The problem is that a lot of pressure characters build meter so quickly AND do a ton of chip damage. If it was one or the other it wouldnt be nearly as bad, but as it stands the defender gets punished way too hard.

 

[Wigy]

Meter building off RC needs scaled. Scorpion shouldn't get a bar from a blockstring at the end of every combo plus tonnes of chip