MK n00b, need frame data HELP! :O

[The Greench]

Hey guys, short story is I'm a long time 2D (Capcom, SNK, etc) fighting game vet, except for MK, where my experience is limited. I do love the MK series if that makes sense though lol.

Anyways I get frame data for the games I've been playing forever---but I can't for the life of me figure out the frame data in this game. It has been a long time since I properly used frame data....so maybe I've just forgotten how to use it? I will admit---I'm ASSUMING this game is using the same engine as MK9, so the system for using frame data in IGAU is the same. Please correct me if I'm wrong!

Example: I main Green Lantern (Huge fan), right now I'm in training mode looking at his basic attacks. His F2 says "Hit Advantage: 22." This means, when I hit my opponent with F2, I get 22 frames of advantage/22 frames where I can act before him, no? And on block, it says, "Block Advantage: 2" meaning if he blocks the attack, I can act 2 frames before him (And negative would me he acts that many frames before me).

So how come I can't do F2, hit, then link a standing 1 (Which has 7 frames of start up). Also, I've definitely forgotten this, but does 7 frame start up mean, hits on frame 7, or hits on frame 8?

Now, I played MK9 at launch and tried my best to learn the MK system. One thing I thought I noticed, was that you...can't link moves?? Is this the reason I can't land 1 after a F2 hit? I noticed that characters can block if I tried linking, but they can't do anything else other than that during hitstun...or something x____x

If this is all in the wrong section, forgive me.

Thanks in advance for all your help!

 

[Komatose]

Okay, I guess it is the same engine... I've heard all across the forum that some frame data in the game is wrong. Hopefully they will fix it.

 

[zaf]

Its not links.

Go into move list and look at combos.

Dial those combos in, dont link them

 

[The Greench]

Its not links.

Go into move list and look at combos.

Dial those combos in, dont link them

No no no, what I'm saying is, you CAN'T link in the MK engine, is something I thought I noticed. As in, if I land a move that gives me 22 frame advantage, I can't be creative and find another basic attack that starts up before the 22 frames, and "link." I'm not saying, the combos in the move list I'm trying to link the buttons together.

 

[zaf]

no it doesnt work like that

 

[The Greench]

no it doesnt work like that

Right...that's basically what I was asking, and you're saying it doesn't, good! I have an answer.

Now, why? Is that just the MK engine?? I'm just so used to every other fighter, this is the only one I THINK I've encountered that does this (Except maybe Killer Instict?). Just curiosity I guess!

 

[The Greench]

Or, a better question, how about Frame Data and punishing. I can accept that the MK engine is new to me, so blocking after a normal or combo lands is just how MK works. But punishing....

Green Lantern's Minigun for example, is -26 on block.....-26! That's HUGE! So, I set Green Lantern dummy to reversal with Lantern's Might (10 frame startup) and I hit him with my Minigun, and have him block, point blank....and Lantern's Might reversal does NOT punish me! I can block it! What? Why? How? -26 frames, and a 10 frame move can't punish?

 

[lucky jim]

I believe the frame data is calculated in-engine, and right now there's an admitted problem with multi-hitting moves, such as the chaingun. That's not the accurate disadvantage on block.

Re: hit advantage and links.. you bring up a good point. I'm wondering if however it's calculated is completely different from usual. I do notice that if you hit someone, they actually have a longer hitstun animation than their actual hitstun. If you do nothing, the full animation plays out, but the player being hit is actually able to block/jump/move do whatever before that entire animation plays out. So maybe that hit advantage value is based on the entire hitstun animation, and not actually when the opponent can start moving again.

Logically speaking, there's really no in-engine reason why links shouldn't exist at all, I mean.. all it is is hitting someone with another move while they're in hitstun. It's just quite possible that nothing has enough hitstun to link another move, or at least nothing that's been discovered.

From what I've tested, though.. the block advantage seems to be proper for single-hitting moves.

 

[Primiera]

Logically speaking, there's really no in-engine reason why links shouldn't exist at all, I mean.. all it is is hitting someone with another move while they're in hitstun. It's just quite possible that nothing has enough hitstun to link another move, or at least nothing that's been discovered.

I think it's just part of the system that links aren't possible. I can set an opponent to get hit by 2 with Killer Frost, supposedly +22, and you can see the opponent staggered for that time, can't move or jump or attack for the duration of the stagger. They can block a simple 7F d+1 at this point no matter how fast the timing.

It's probably to prevent infinites from occurring while giving opportunities to get in on hits with frame advantage.