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You opinion on 1 or 2 for anti air.

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
I found his d1 quite good for AA and crossups.

As far as the topic, I guess I never tried 2 really. I could see 2 being better if they jump very poorly spaced and you need to hit them out of the air as they are throwing out a panicked jk. If they are pretty close I would think 1 is better though.

Combo I use is 1, 21xxRK, f32xxRK. Thinking about it F22 may be better than 21 though. Ill have to mess around with it sometime.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
I found his d1 quite good for AA and crossups.

As far as the topic, I guess I never tried 2 really. I could see 2 being better if they jump very poorly spaced and you need to hit them out of the air as they are throwing out a panicked jk. If they are pretty close I would think 1 is better though.

Combo I use is 1, 21xxRK, f32xxRK. Thinking about it F22 may be better than 21 though. Ill have to mess around with it sometime.
Can u talk about the comparisons of kenshi d1 vs cage's d1?

Can u discuss their differences when using them as AA and cross up AA?

Do you use d1 on cross up early or late? Does hit box matter here?
 

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
Antiairing both crossup and jump in with d1 felt very similar to cage.

As far as timing, I believe it is late compared to other characters. Someone like smoke you have to press it noticably earlier than kenshi or cage. However, I believe that kenshis is better vertically than cages, however worse horizontally. Smoke is an extreme example where the vertical hitbox is very great, but horizontal is lacking.

D1 antiairing non crossups is very spacing specific and only good in specific situations. It will always get blown up by jump kicks if they know you are going for it too.

Either way, it feels very natural for both characters to me, but a smoke player may have trouble adjusting.

Pig Of The Hut
 

Bildslash

Goro Lives 
Bildslash you've helped me out a lot

Do u the ability to record our games?

I wanna test this w a human (mid string)

I'm glad u noticed the connection on the d1 rk I was cringing lol

We both were effected in some areas I noticed
Vggs


Let's do more cause this was a huge help
I suppose I could record a few matches.
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
Antiairing both crossup and jump in with d1 felt very similar to cage.

As far as timing, I believe it is late compared to other characters. Someone like smoke you have to press it noticably earlier than kenshi or cage. However, I believe that kenshis is better vertically than cages, however worse horizontally. Smoke is an extreme example where the vertical hitbox is very great, but horizontal is lacking.

D1 antiairing non crossups is very spacing specific and only good in specific situations. It will always get blown up by jump kicks if they know you are going for it too.

Either way, it feels very natural for both characters to me, but a smoke player may have trouble adjusting.

Pig Of The Hut
His d1 for anti crossup is pretty good, but I THINK it`s vulnerable to characters with long reaching arms. Like I`ll anti air kabal regularly, but Kung Laos crossover punch seems to go right through. It`s weird.

As for anti airing jump in punches, I`m almost certain now that standing 2 is better than standing 1. Standing 2`s horizontal hitbox stuffs jump kicks nicely.
 

Blackula

I SEE EVERYTHING!
Under_The_Mayo Pig Of The Hut Dizzy

I use standing 2 for an anti-air.

Also, something I've been experimenting with is instead of doing 2,1 rising karma, I've been doing 2, rising karma. If you do 2,1 rising karma, f+3,2 spirit charge, you get 22% damage. If you do 2, rising karma, f+3,2 spirit charge, you get 22% damage. One of the reasons I've been experimenting with this is because as we know, the more you hit your opponent, the more meter they build. So if you have two combos from the same starter that do the same damage, why not do the one that hits the opponent less and builds less meter for him in the process.

During some matches, I found out that it can be iffy to do 2, rising karma instead of 2,1 rising karma. You can see that in this vid I recorded over this past weekend.


@ 3:52, 6:27 the rising karma misses

@7:37 I reverted back to the old 2,1 rising karma.


@ 0:52, 5:24, 7:50 the 2,rising karma connects.
@ 1:14 the rising karma misses


So I guess more experimentation needs to be done to see if it's a range dependent thing.
 

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
Blackula

Actually, I think it was posted that meter gained from damage is normalized. Meaning its based on the damage you take, not the number of hits. I believe 1 bar = 48% damage taken. It was investigated in a thread somewhere.

I think it may have been a Somberness thread.
 

Blackula

I SEE EVERYTHING!
But if you guys get the chance, do check out the videos I uploaded over the weekend dated 3/31 and 4/1.
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
Dizzy, if that's the case, then 2,1 rising karma all day. Forget doing 2, rising karma. :)
Normally I would say yes. 2 1 RK is by far the easier and most reliable anti air combo for kenshi. But the reason I started this thread in the first place was because this anti air string is death agains kung lao. You have to use a single standing jab, whether it be 1 or 2, and then follow up. That way if Lao teleports and your jab whiffs, you have time to recover and block the teleport attack. If you do 2 1 and he teleports, you get comboed.

Here`s what I personally think the best anti air options are, taking that into account:

2, f2 2 RK, F2 2 B2 (if you AA them when they are high enough in the air and close enough to you for dash F22RK to connect)

2, dash d1 RK, F2 2 B2 (if you feel like they are too far and low for a dash F22RK to connect)

These two options appear to be the most full proof of all the AA options we`ve discussed so far. I`ll be presenting them in my next video.
 

mekane

Noob
I know this is slightly off topic but it does involve dealing with jumpins.

I have a problem when they jump from real close, and they jump almost right on top of my head. I play a Jax who does this and his JK has a massive hit box, its very hard to anti air it with 1 or 2, and his JK->airthrow is pretty damaging. Is my best bet to go for EX-SC? or should I just block?
 

mekane

Noob
nice vids blackula. i notice you use ex RK for crossovers mostly. do you find it is too hard to on reaction do dash forward SC?
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
I know this is slightly off topic but it does involve dealing with jumpins.

I have a problem when they jump from real close, and they jump almost right on top of my head. I play a Jax who does this and his JK has a massive hit box, its very hard to anti air it with 1 or 2, and his JK->airthrow is pretty damaging. Is my best bet to go for EX-SC? or should I just block?
Against characters that can combo off their jumpkick like Jax with his throw, you don't want to be risking that damage by doing AA jabs. Use SC if he jumps in, and EX RK if you want combo damage. If he's very high like you're saying but his kick will still connect, do EX SC to be sure. On crossover, reverse EX RK. Forget your 1, 2, or D1 as anti air in those fights.
 

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
I found AAing with 1, 2, or anti cross up d1, doing a follow up d4 xx RK will always work regardless of height. I've been using this as my AA bnb recently and haven't seen anyone use it yet.

If you use 2, d4 xx rk it does more damage than 21 xx rk and solves the problem of getting blown up big time by a teleporter on whiff like Under_The_Mayo was saying.

I still sometimes use 1, 21 xx rk out of muscle memory, and does more damage, but if you AA pretty low to the ground, or extremely far away it will whiff at times.
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
I found AAing with 1, 2, or anti cross up d1, doing a follow up d4 xx RK will always work regardless of height. I've been using this as my AA bnb recently and haven't seen anyone use it yet.

If you use 2, d4 xx rk it does more damage than 21 xx rk and solves the problem of getting blown up big time by a teleporter on whiff like Under_The_Mayo was saying.

I still sometimes use 1, 21 xx rk out of muscle memory, and does more damage, but if you AA pretty low to the ground, or extremely far away it will whiff at times.
Ive actually been doing this but using dash d1 RK instead of d4 for the speed of it.
 

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
mekane Dash pretty much always if you hit them with AA 2. Only time you wouldn't is if they are nearly directly over your head.


Under_The_Mayo D1 also works as the filler but I've never AA'd someone and not been able to get d4 to hit so I think its a good AA combo to use. Hit them extremely far range, I've had d1 whiff due to range/hitbox/whatever. Plus it does 2% more damage, a scientist such as yourself can appreciate the extra damage :)
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
mekane Dash pretty much always if you hit them with AA 2. Only time you wouldn't is if they are nearly directly over your head.


Under_The_Mayo D1 also works as the filler but I've never AA'd someone and not been able to get d4 to hit so I think its a good AA combo to use. Hit them extremely far range, I've had d1 whiff due to range/hitbox/whatever. Plus it does 2% more damage, a scientist such as yourself can appreciate the extra damage :)
I sure can. After all this discussion, I`ve decided to go back to my standard 2 1 RK as anti air, and then against Kung Lao I`ll be using the standing 1 jab into dash D1 follow up. Here are my reasons. Kung Lao isn`t gonna be jumping in at me from a distance so I don`t need the reach of 2. 1 is a little faster, and since KL is so fast, I need my fastest jab.