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Match-up Discussion Wonder Woman Match-Up Discussion

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
Uh your standing 1 shouldn't come out before her d1 after a blocked b1...but yeah she doesn't even have to use meter off of a d1, she can do d1~spin :p but that's not confirmable. Backdash or pushblock could be best, but your parry does come in useful.
Gaaah...my bad, you know what I meant! lol

The meta looks like this to me:

She does B1. Now she's at +4. She gets the d1.

If I read the d1, I can parry. Cool.

However, instead of doing b1, she could do 3,3 and beat my parry.

So let's go back. She does b1. I think she's going for the low and I backdash. I beat out d1, 3,3, and another b1, but b2 could catch me.

Am I kind of getting it so far?
 

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
I think backdashing may be my best bet. I've known that I can use standing 1 for awhile, but if she does a d1, even though my my standing 1 comes out first, her d1 goes under me and she gets the d12 xx MB tiara, etc, etc nonsense.

I'm starting to think my best option may be just to backdash or use pushblock. I'm really emo about this.
You have a chance to fuck her up for pressing buttons on her advantage. Either interrupt or back dash. It's actually quite far imo.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
Gaaah...my bad, you know what I meant! lol

The meta looks like this to me:

She does B1. Now she's at +4. She gets the d1.

If I read the d1, I can parry. Cool.

However, instead of doing b1, she could do 3,3 and beat my parry.

So let's go back. She does b1. I think she's going for the low and I backdash. I beat out d1, 3,3, and another b1, but b2 could catch me.

Am I kind of getting it so far?
Yeah, but you're missing some things.

After blocked b1:
Parry? You beat d1, b1, b2 but lose to 33 and d3.
Backdash? You beat b1, d1, 33, and d3 but not b2.
Standing 1? You beat b1, 33 and b2 but lose to d3 and d1.
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
I think I'll need to make a flowchart or something. She reminds me of Cage, a little bit.

How about her knockdown game? Is there any way to blow up some of these oki set-ups besides just guessing?
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
I think I'll need to make a flowchart or something. She reminds me of Cage, a little bit.

How about her knockdown game? Is there any way to blow up some of these oki set-ups besides just guessing?
Lol I've left you a basic version of that above.

You mean if you're knocked down or she is?
 

Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
not too mention she could also do something like read your backdash and do a d1~lasso twirl after a forward dash.
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
Lol I've left you a basic version of that above.

You mean if you're knocked down or she is?
If you're knocked down. Mid-screen and in the corner, she has a bunch of really ambiguous, hard to deal with guessing games and set-ups. I kind of started to get the hang of her cross-up f3, but then she'll do stuff like that jump kick into divebomb shit and it's just...ugh.

Ugh. This character is so good.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
If you're knocked down. Mid-screen and in the corner, she has a bunch of really ambiguous, hard to deal with guessing games and set-ups. I kind of started to get the hang of her cross-up f3, but then she'll do stuff like that jump kick into divebomb shit and it's just...ugh.

Ugh. This character is so good.
Midscreen you've just got to guess between parry, slide (or any wakeup with enough invincibility I suppose) and block unfortunately. In the corner you can usually see which side the divebomb will hit on from the arc of her jump just before she divebombs. If she jumps straight up into divebomb it'll hit on the front, if she jumps forward then divebombs it'll hit crossup. Sometimes we'll fake out f3 with b3 because the initial startup frames look the same too and sometimes we'll use Amazonian Uppercut setups (or at least all the good WoWos will I mean it's my tech so they should be using it huehuehue) or just do normals. For j1~db3 setups you've just got to hope you blocked correctly unfortunately :/ also be careful because we could MB the divebomb but again that's going to have to be a guess on your part...

We think she's good too, but we also think she needs something better to deal with some zoning lol.
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
Midscreen you've just got to guess between parry, slide (or any wakeup with enough invincibility I suppose) and block unfortunately. In the corner you can usually see which side the divebomb will hit on from the arc of her jump just before she divebombs. If she jumps straight up into divebomb it'll hit on the front, if she jumps forward then divebombs it'll hit crossup. Sometimes we'll fake out f3 with b3 because the initial startup frames look the same too and sometimes we'll use Amazonian Uppercut setups (or at least all the good WoWos will I mean it's my tech so they should be using it huehuehue) or just do normals. For j1~db3 setups you've just got to hope you blocked correctly unfortunately :/ also be careful because we could MB the divebomb but again that's going to have to be a guess on your part...

We think she's good too, but we also think she needs something better to deal with some zoning lol.
Wait, why would she have trouble with zoning?

Can't you just walk and d3? Or jump over a projectile and punish with divebomb? or use iaDG? You really would only need to get into b2 range to start your business, right?
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
Wait, why would she have trouble with zoning?

Can't you just walk and d3? Or jump over a projectile and punish with divebomb? or use iaDG? You really would only need to get into b2 range to start your business, right?
Because she has nothing that advances forward quickly with armour or a teleport. She CAN parry stuff, but it only works to an extent.

No, d3 has too much recovery on whiff to be useful for that. It only works on things like Batman's batarangs.
If you're doing a horizontal projectile from a close enough distance that she can jump over it and punish you with divebomb then you're doing something wrong lol. IADG will get caught out by horizontal/low projectiles because although it only has about 15 frames of startup it doesn't cover distance as quickly as, say, Zod's charge. It also doesn't have armour or anything like that.
Getting into b2 distance is good, but it's getting there against the best zoners that's annoying.
AND Sinestro...and Martian too.
 

Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
do u mean jump air dash 1 into divebomb? or just normal jump,and are u talking about it oki wise?
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
on a standing opponent? or as oki?

and what is the purpose of faking a f3 with a b3? your better off cancelling it with a dash and doing d1~lasso spin if ur gonna fake someone out.
Standing, you can't whiff it I don't think.

No you are most definitely not hahaha. Why would giving up plus frames for something that's -9 be better? Faking out crossup f3 with b3 makes the opponent want to block the crossup f3 but will open them up to get hit by the b3 for full combo back into the corner.
 

Drizzle

Jump and shoot.
She doesn't need anything. The two characters who beat her badly are just too good.

First off, stop respecting Wonder Woman's frame traps so much; otherwise you're just going to get put into a 50/50 every time you block a b1. Backdash, poke out, throw out the occasional parry or just block sometimes. d12 will beat any attempt to poke and although it is possible to hit-confirm, it's very difficult to do in an actual match. The majority of the time it's done on a read. Keep in mind that the overhead option only leads to a full combo if you don't backdash and there's no way to confirm that. This applies to backdashing on wake-up as well. For guaranteed damage she has to do b2~lasso, which you can punish by ducking the second hit and releasing bats. There's an option select Batman can use by blocking b2, ducking after and mashing on 4. If WoWo does b23 then your bats won't come out, but if she does b2~lasso then they will and you'll get a combo.

Second, slide isn't as bad as you think it is. It serves its purpose of making WoWo guess after knocking you down. It's negative on hit but that doesn't matter because she gets no guaranteed pressure or punish. It also isn't fully invincible but it cannot be stuffed easily. If it happens it's really just luck.

Third, you can punish a perfectly done iaDG if you have 3 bats and block it standing. If it's done at about chest height you can punish it with 2. If the Wonder Woman player is on point then that won't come up very often but it's good to know.

Lastly, pretty much all of her mid-screen setups involving OTGs are gimmicky and beaten by holding back + tech roll. The OTG will still work but you'll be out of range for her 50/50. Cross-up f3 can be blocked on reaction once you're used to it because it never hits in front. In the corner if you see her jump forward then the divepunch will hit as a cross-up and if she jumps straight up it will hit in front. You'll get hit by stuff sometimes but it's possible to get good at blocking it most of the time.

Edit: If she jumps forward and does the divepunch as soon as possible it will still hit in front.
 
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Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
Standing, you can't whiff it I don't think.

No you are most definitely not hahaha. Why would giving up plus frames for something that's -9 be better? Faking out crossup f3 with b3 makes the opponent want to block the crossup f3 but will open them up to get hit by the b3 for full combo back into the corner.
oh...ur talking about if your right on them....i was thinking of...nvm. just curious, does b3's hitbox extend to behind it at all? cuz a lot of times when catch someone with a b3 after a bg bounce it seems to hit from behind her. is it possible to use b3 as a crossup in this way after a hard knockdown?
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
Second, slide isn't as bad as you think it is. It serves its purpose of making WoWo guess after knocking you down. It's negative on hit but that doesn't matter because she gets no guaranteed pressure or punish. It also isn't fully invincible but it cannot be stuffed easily. If it happens it's really just luck.
I haven't tested it much so far, but Amazonian Uppercut seems to do ok at stuffing it. I have a setup for stuffing it every time from a common situation :)

oh...ur talking about if your right on them....i was thinking of...nvm. just curious, does b3's hitbox extend to behind it at all? cuz a lot of times when catch someone with a b3 after a bg bounce it seems to hit from behind her. is it possible to use b3 as a crossup in this way after a hard knockdown?
B3 doesn't cross up.
 

Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
I haven't tested it much so far, but Amazonian Uppercut seems to do ok at stuffing it. I have a setup for stuffing it every time from a common situation :)


B3 doesn't cross up.
ah, alright then. but couldnt u just delay f3 to choose which side u want it on anyways? unless they have a real long ass back dash like zod, that would still be a better option that b3 wouldnt it?
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
ah, alright then. but couldnt u just delay f3 to choose which side u want it on anyways? unless they have a real long ass back dash like zod, that would still be a better option that b3 wouldnt it?
If you delay it then the opponent will just block it normally, the b3 is used for the whole kind of 50/50 thing because the startup frames are similar.
 

Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
If you delay it then the opponent will just block it normally, the b3 is used for the whole kind of 50/50 thing because the startup frames are similar.
i guess, but with f3 they'd still have to guess if u delayed it long enough or not. But i 'll have to try and see what works more.