General/Other - Liu Kang What could be done to make Dualist Liu Kang more viable?

[Alfonso Muskedunder]

My points would be:

1. Faster recovery on Yang stance damage buff.
2. Being able to Yang stance buff yourself more after you've done it once (can't increase the damage buff if you're already on e.g. level 1)
3. Stop Yang balls, both air and ground ones, while airborne.
4. Being able to combo into Yang balls when Yang stance damage buff is fully charged.
5. Decrease in Yang stance damage buff time (Slightly to make it more viable to buff, and not being punished every single time you want to charge the buff.)

Share your opinions below, and hopefullu we can have a decent discussion on how to make this variation more viable in play.

 

[EMPR_MURK]

Updates

 

[God Confirm]

Make Orb stop have no recovery. It's not like Reptiles Acid Ball yo, it does nothing for you don't stop it, and even if you do there is a timer.

Just a start

 

[Olcadan13]

Make yin fireballs faster

Make damage buff charge faster, it's removed on hit so no need to decrease the duration. Look at cutthroat kano for example

Make ex yang balls easier to combo into

Make the yin healing actually useful, heal more health and heal faster

 

[just_2swift]

While in dark stance have him gain health based on the lvl of charged darkness when he switches to light stance. Basically allowing him to cash in since the dmg buff doesn't carry over.

Lvl one 3%

Lvl two 5%

Lvl three 7%

He needs more than this I know but at least it gives light stance more utility other than ex light ball.

 

[IrishMantis]

Make Orb stop have no recovery. It's not like Reptiles Acid Ball yo, it does nothing for you don't stop it, and even if you do there is a timer.

Just a start

Then he will have Psuedo blockstring as if your in the corner and have meter he can just keep looping you till his meter is gone as Stance f213 is stance change is really plus on block and ex White fireball is like over +10 the only way out is when he fires the orb

Edit: looks like I'm wrong, thank god somebody politely corrected me

 

[God Confirm]

Then he will have Psuedo blockstring as if your in the corner and have meter he can just keep looping you till his meter is gone as Stance f214 is stance change is really plus on block and ex White fireball is like over +10 the only way out is when he fires the orb

I just don't understand why people do what you are doing right now. You have done absolutely no testing, you have no idea how any of this works, what numbers you did post are wrong, the one string you referenced you got the inputs wrong, and you were completely wrong about his pressure. It's ok not to know every little thing in the game, but if you aren't up to speed on something, don't post a bunch of misinformation when you have literally NO idea.



F213 cancelled into Red Orb is like -25. That is BEFORE you activate the orb. So tell me again where this loopable pressure would be? You are punishable by even slowest combo openers for max damage, with absolutely no pushback either.

 

[Kickbykick]

F213 cancelled into Red Orb is like -25.

f213 orb cancel is -14

 

[God Confirm]

f213 orb cancel is -14

Why is it punishable by Predators SS then?

 

[Kickbykick]

hmmm. U tested it yet?

 

[God Confirm]

hmmm. U tested it yet?

Yeah, go into lab select Predator Warrior and put his Dread Slam on reversal. Punishes, 23f start up. Then put his reversal to Dread Launch, 29f doesn't punish, it's between these two numbers I think about -25

 

[IrishMantis]

I just don't understand why people do what you are doing right now. You have done absolutely no testing, you have no idea how any of this works, what numbers you did post are wrong, the one string you referenced you got the inputs wrong, and you were completely wrong about his pressure. It's ok not to know every little thing in the game, but if you aren't up to speed on something, don't post a bunch of misinformation when you have literally NO idea.



F213 cancelled into Red Orb is like -25. That is BEFORE you activate the orb. So tell me again where this loopable pressure would be? You are punishable by even slowest combo openers for max damage, with absolutely no pushback either.

Wow lol short fuse there buddy
Jesus I got 214 mixed with 213 and you explode

Yeah your right about the recovery buff not leading to s block string, next time just tell I'm wrong and explain why, it would do the trick
no need for explosive rage outs

The only thing I got wrong was the notations and the fire orb frames which the frame data saids it's 1 frame start lol

But I can admit when in wrong and accept so tell me I'm wrong next time and there's a good chance I'd agree and say you're right

 

[Ze Dingo]

You remove Dragon's Fire and Flame Fist

 

[God Confirm]

Wow lol short fuse there buddy
Jesus I got 214 mixed with 213 and you explode

Yeah your right about the recovery buff not leading to s block string, next time just tell I'm wrong and explain why, it would do the trick
no need for explosive rage outs

The only thing I got wrong was the notations and the fire orb frames which the frame data saids it's 1 frame start lol

But I can admit when in wrong and accept so tell me I'm wrong next time and there's a good chance I'd agree and say you're right

A, I didn't explode I calmly typed a response asking exactly why people comment on something they have no idea on as though it is fact, B, the input was the least relevant thing I mentioned in my post of the many things you got wrong, you choose to list that as the only reason because it helps you discredit what I said

People who post massive misinformation ruin this site. Do your homework before spouting it off, that's all, it's easy.

 

[IrishMantis]

A, I didn't explode I calmly typed a response asking exactly why people comment on something they have no idea on as though it is fact, B, the input was the least relevant thing I mentioned in my post of the many things you got wrong, you choose to list that as the only reason because it helps you discredit what I said

People who post massive misinformation ruin this site. Do your homework before spouting it off, that's all, it's easy.

Home works for scrubs

Just chill out next time, i have a huge history of posting helpful information

So I do t it's fair to label me as "what's wrong with this site" over one misjudged pre assumption

 

[God Confirm]

Home works for scrubs

Just chill out next time, i have a huge history of posting helpful information

So I do t it's fair to label me as "what's wrong with this site" over one misjudged pre assumption

I'm not labelling you personally as anything, I've seen you around you're all good. I'm labelling the post you made, that's all, I just wish people would lab things out before telling other people how it is, then accusing them of raging when they point out the 5 different ways you got it wrong. Every discussion there is always someone who doesn't have the knowledge insisting that something is a certain way, sometimes you can't prove it and most times they will never admit it, but you can always tell and it's frustrating as hell, I just wish people would check their facts before arguing a certain way or saying dumb shit like Quan ain't OP or Sub Zero needs nerfs etc. Yours isn't so bad it's just an issue I have with this community, nothing personal man I apologise if I was curt about it, it just grinds my gears is all lol

 

[IrishMantis]

I'm not labelling you personally as anything, I've seen you around you're all good. I'm labelling the post you made, that's all, I just wish people would lab things out before telling other people how it is, then accusing them of raging when they point out the 5 different ways you got it wrong. Every discussion there is always someone who doesn't have the knowledge insisting that something is a certain way, sometimes you can't prove it and most times they will never admit it, but you can always tell and it's frustrating as hell, I just wish people would check their facts before arguing a certain way or saying dumb shit like Quan ain't OP or Sub Zero needs nerfs etc. Yours isn't so bad it's just an issue I have with this community, nothing personal man I apologise if I was curt about it, it just grinds my gears is all lol

I got 1 thing wrong technically 2 if you count the messed notation, but you mean that as general than more direct

In anyway you where right I should checked before posting instead of basing of what I thought I remember .
point taken

And I apologise for over reacting to what I thought was an over action

 

[kaseyk]

Yin to be reworked so it is useful . I think if it worked just like yang buff 3 levels of heal could potentially be it and orb corner bugs are most important .

then i would say being able to use orb cancel as a special cancel would be huge . Being able to cancel orb in air also would be nice .

Yin fb to match or be very close to speed and recovery of other 2 variations .

Lastly not losing yang buff on hit and some sort of benefit on stance switch well buff is active .

 

[Pudding&Pie]

Give him two health bars, one in each stance. But if he loses all the health of one he loses

 

[gibster13]

Light stance projectiles not shit

Orbs have instant hitbox (think mmh)

Who cares if he will be broke. He will be well fun

 

[GLoRToR]

My points would be:

1. Faster recovery on Yang stance damage buff.
2. Being able to Yang stance buff yourself more after you've done it once (can't increase the damage buff if you're already on e.g. level 1)
3. Stop Yang balls, both air and ground ones, while airborne.
4. Being able to combo into Yang balls when Yang stance damage buff is fully charged.
5. Decrease in Yang stance damage buff time (Slightly to make it more viable to buff, and not being punished every single time you want to charge the buff.)

Share your opinions below, and hopefullu we can have a decent discussion on how to make this variation more viable in play.

Nah just nerf his other two variations so they're worse

 

[KingKhrystopher]

Solar Blasts only have knockback mid screen, none in the corner. For pressure and stuff.
Yin should bring health up 2% per second. Maybe more.
Solar Flares should have faster startup, and the ground version should have an ex version too.

This buff is gimmicky, but I'll still say it.

Add move, df3, named Shaolin Shroud. Works exactly like Tanya's Pyromancer Shroud, except there's a +3% damage buff over the course of time the Shroud is active. Only works on Light side. On the Dark side, it should just take away meter, maybe half a bar over that course of time that it's active. Just for fun.

Honestly, I would prefer if Soul Spheres had a df or db command. It would make throwing and stopping them way easier.
Stopped Soul Spheres should deal. 5% damage every second you stand in its hitbox and it doesn't explode. Maybe this is OP, but maybe if you have an orb out and a projectile hits it, both the orb and the projectile should disappear. But only it it's stopped.
Stopping orbs has like, 5,6 recovery. And if Yang Balls reach the corner, they automatically stop. This way we have no balls that connect with interactables and not with the opponent and are useless.

 

[Bruno-NeoSpace]

There is a thread about proposed dualist buffs: http://testyourmight.com/threads/dualist-liu-kang-kommunity-project-proposed-dualist-buffs.57074/

There are some buffs in that thread that I disagree, so, here is MY proposed Dualist buffs:

1 - FIX the orb's issue that make orbs explode on walls.

2 - Healing: 1% while held the animation and 3% when Liu Kang ends the animation. This way, the healing would be a high risk/high reward special move.

3 - Orb's hurtbox: increase regular orb, low orb and air orb hurtbox because they're very small.

4 - Orb's distance: decrease all orbs distance when Liu Kang puts them on screen because when Liu Kang puts them instantly on screen, they stay too far from Liu Kang.

5 - Air orb: faster recovery on air orb to make it useful. -15 on recovery would be very nice.

6 - EX orb: make the EX orb negates any projectile like EX ice ball.

7 - Frame links to combo: -1 on recovery of metamorphosis to make the frame links a little bit easy to combo. (one example: F1,2 into SS into S1 is 1 frame to link )

Here's a video showing Liu Kang's most hit/hurt boxes issues, including orbs issues:

 

[just_2swift]

Buff liu

 

[FROST_]

Light stance
1) make his start up on FB1 10f slower

2) reduce his recovery on air FB1 by 15f (so he can actually IA better)

3) make FB3 +10 on hit (jails F1, F2 and a "Just Frame" for F4)

4) Make DB3 recovery in 25f or make it a +1 cancel on F213 and -4 on F44

5) make DB3 give .75% health back and .25% of a bar of meter every second active for 4 seconds

Dark stance
1) make F213, SS +8 (F1 jails F2 is a "Just Frame")

2) make B34, SS +4

3) make the orbs be able to detonate when you want with a new input (FB1) like hunter predators trap

4) make his BD3
Level 1 do 4% more damage
Level 2 do 7% more damage
Level 3 have the orbs be unblockable and a 10% damage buff

@FOREVER EL1TE @Kickbykick @just_2swift @YOMI Zyphox @EMPR_MURK @all other lui kangs