General/Other - War God War God Suggested Changes

[Darth-Nero]

* Why B2 should be +1 ?

to be honest .. no kotal player use this move on purpose. it only comes out by accident trying to do B122 but they miss-time it and B2 comes out by accident. that's why i suggested it being +1. because no kotal player use it ... and if you see kotal players use it ... just know that they used it by accident and not on purpose ...... @TheGangstaFace , can you confirm this ?

I can personally confirm this for a 1000 years to come. Not once did i used that move on purpose lol, it always come out just like you said. 9 times out of 10 they eat it too.

 

[x-azeez]

I strongly recommend changing your dealer, that stuff is crazy strong.

my dealer is some old woman from outworld ... don't know her real name, but she runs Outworld whole underworld drug cartel. in the street, they call her Blanche .. yesterday i took a photo of her

Two bar armored launcher for Kotal Khan, and paddle can be meter burn to launch. Like predator. That's the only acceptable change he can get. Not this framedata change proposal nonsense.

This is a good idea, maybe from EX DF2 ( 26 startup ) and if i meterburn another bar, i can do a full combo ... (( Meterburning regular DF2 would be TOO OP ))

F1B2 to be -10

after reconsideration, -10 would be too OP

Post a pointless nerf (-30 on oh sword) just to mislead the viewers

making it -30 will change WG Kotal Meta entirely ...he will be less dependent on 50/50 even more.

-30 doesn't make a difference when you'd be giving yourself set-play mix

but making it -30, the opponent will most likely block low. and if he read that i'll go for an overhead, he'll block high and go for a full punish, even with the current patch, OH Sward is -18 on block and 60% of the cast can't punish it.

I like your changes suggestions, because whatever you do you'll get frozen.

if you are referring to the WG Kotal vs GM Subzero Matchup ... these changes will help WG Kotal close the gap in that matchup 6-4 for GM Sub instead of that matchup being 8-2

@TheGangstaFace do you also agree that WG vs GM is a 8-2 Matchup ? its 7-3 if its on Lin Kuei Temple and the Pit.

No.

Yes

and has some of the best wake ups in the game

i don't know if you're trolling or being serious, what so good about his Wakeups ?

His EX DB2 is 21 frames
His EX DF2 has 1 hit of armor and has 26 startup frames
His EX DB3 is around 24-26 frames

if WG Kotal is knocked down .. just jump-in punch on him, and if he woke up with a reversal, just block it on reaction.

Sun God doesn't have nearly as much of an issue

1. WG
2. SG (( has more issues than WG ))
3. BG

The issue is his reasoning behind the changes.

I listed good reasons now. i hope you agree on them.

F12 doesn't need to be plus. It gives u perfect space for d4. Back walk to wiff punish. B1 is fine how it is, no need for tweaks, it's still great for wiff punishing.
B2 crushes low so no need imo to make it plus,or even more safe

after a blocked F12, instead of a D4, i usually do nothing and react to my opponent .. if he jumped Towards me, i'll EX Air Grab him for a full combo, if he jumped Back, i'll do a F1B2 and convert it into a full combo. and ending both options with a DF2.

the opponent tend to jump a lot after a blocked F12 .. lol

for B2 being plus ... i listed new reasons in the OP ... you'll find them down at EDIT2

 

[Tanno]

if you are referring to the WG Kotal vs GM Subzero Matchup ... these changes will help WG Kotal close the gap in that matchup 6-4 for GM Sub instead of that matchup being 8-2

@TheGangstaFace do you also agree that WG vs GM is a 8-2 Matchup ? its 7-3 if its on Lin Kuei Temple and the Pit.

You didn't realize that I was trolling you there. :troll: GM is almost Kotal's worst MUs. You could have a chance against Cryomancer, since Cryo doesn't have anything to protect him from Kotal.

If you play against Unbreakable, it would be surely 6-4.

 

[x-azeez]

You didn't realize that I was trolling you there

yea i knew

 

[omooba]

@omooba B122 is indeed -7 with my suggestion, but it leaves Kotal super close to the opponent, but cancelling it with the new DF2, it will create a distance due to its pushback. and give kotal many options on how to approach next.

if kotal khan does a string with 3 potential 50/50's and doesn't spend a bar in it, his turn should end everytime

 

[x-azeez]

if kotal khan does a string with 3 potential 50/50's and doesn't spend a bar in it, his turn should end everytime

but the new overhead is -30 and everyone will be able to punish it with a full combo ... and DB2 will be -15, but the gap will be there, so option select an armor in that strings and if he did the low sword then the armor will come out, if i did the full string B122 into either DB1 (( overhead )) or the new DF2 ... the armor will not come out and you'll be safe.

but there will always be the option of not cancelling B122 and leaving kotal at -7 which will creates more mind games

 

[Jeffrey Wolf]

Not trolling at all. He has two safe wake up options and one quasi safe. If you're worried about armor breakers, use one of the two 2 hit options. Sure, he can't OH Sword wakeup anymore, but now he is much, much harder to armor break, which IMO makes his wake up options better than they've ever been and this is from a day 1 WG main. And if someone jumps over you, EX Saw is the easy answer, you can also use EX Air Grab, d1, or d3 for a full combo, or just d2, or use his great back dash.

Come on now. This character has tools for days. Kotal players went into derp mode with B1 as a mid and forgot that he played just fine before he had it. His previous weaknesses were against armor breaking pressure and zoning, and one of those has been dealt with. For the other, you either need to play patient or have an alt, which is totally normal in a fighting game.

 

[CrazyFingers]

Why do you say sungod has more issues than wargod @x-azeez

 

[Eldriken]

If you're not using b2 regularly, you're not playing this character the right way. I use that shit on purpose all the time. People always block low against Kotal. I've hit people 4-5 times in a row with it before they blocked high and then got hit with a d4 and get put right back into the same situation. lol

It's also great for crushing low wakeups. I love it. It being plus would probably be a bit busted.

 

[Indecisive]

Ima just comment on one thing. Jax's f212 is minus like 3 or 4 on block
F21 is +1
F2 is 0

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

I think the frame data is wrong, Jax's F212 might be -6 on block. I remember Cassie could always punish it when her flip was 6f

 

[omooba]

but the new overhead is -30 and everyone will be able to punish it with a full combo ... and DB2 will be -15, but the gap will be there, so option select an armor in that strings and if he did the low sword then the armor will come out, if i did the full string B122 into either DB1 (( overhead )) or the new DF2 ... the armor will not come out and you'll be safe.

but there will always be the option of not cancelling B122 and leaving kotal at -7 which will creates more mind games

1) no more armored launchers
2) armoring throw b122 is probably the hardest option select in the game
so yeah that's not enough for df2 jailing. it's just unnecessary

 

[x-azeez]

Ima just comment on one thing. Jax's f212 is minus like 3 or 4 on block
F21 is +1
F2 is 0

i forgot about F212 being -5 .. i meant F21

 

[KingJerm731]

There's a whole lot of dumb going on in here. I'm not really sure what game you're playing if you think sungod has more problems than war god. Sungod is better than it ever was and by far the strongest kotal variation.
Kotal is a footsies monster. Try actually playing neutral instead of constant rush down. His whiff punishing is some of the best in the game (with great damage). The grab is scary as shit and it's easy as hell to bait them into jumping for a 40% punish.
War god could use some buffs (maybe a two bar launcher) but a lot of this would make sungod busted as fuck. The gaps are manageable without armor launchers and you can always bait.

 

[Jeffrey Wolf]

There's a whole lot of dumb going on in here. I'm not really sure what game you're playing if you think sungod has more problems than war god. Sungod is better than it ever was and by far the strongest kotal variation.
Kotal is a footsies monster. Try actually playing neutral instead of constant rush down. His whiff punishing is some of the best in the game (with great damage). The grab is scary as shit and it's easy as hell to bait them into jumping for a 40% punish.
War god could use some buffs (maybe a two bar launcher) but a lot of this would make sungod busted as fuck. The gaps are manageable without armor launchers and you can always bait.

All of Kotal's variations are fine IMO. People just miss easy mode B1 and armored launchers. Hopefully Tekken Master will prove some of this at NEC this weekend if he's stuck with Kotal.