Tweedy/Perfect Legend Drama, No Variations, and More - Podcast Discussion

Discussion in 'Podcasts, Shows & Archives' started by General M2Dave, Feb 16, 2019.

By General M2Dave on Feb 16, 2019 at 9:43 PM
  1. General M2Dave


    Tweedy joins the podcast to address the beef that he has with Perfect Legend while Dab goes on a huge rant about the lack of tournament standard variations in character trailers and breakdowns. "Quan Chi Master" Michaelangelo also joins to comment on Kabal and Jade.

    Time Stamps

    00:05 - Tweedy and Perfect Legend drama (Tweedy's explanation)
    12:44 - Have money matches lost their value in the NRS community? (Tom's question)
    24:10 - Everyone's thoughts on Kabal (Is he too different from Mortal Kombat 9?)
    32:05 - Lack of tournament standard variations in character trailers and breakdowns (Dab rants as everyone chimes in)
    56:25 - Prolonging Mortal Kombat 11's life span (How long will the community be playing Mortal Kombat 11)
    1:09:20 - Summit announced for Mortal Kombat 11 (Official announcement on Twitter while podcast was on air)
    1:11:18 - To whom should NRS listen more? The casual or hardcore players? (The incessant debate)


    As always, any feedback is welcome.

    A front page new article would also be greatly appreciated (@STORMS , @CrimsonShadow).

    Thank you for listening.
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 21, 2019
    SinkFla, Hara-Killer, RoGE and 11 others like this.
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Discussion in 'Podcasts, Shows & Archives' started by General M2Dave, Feb 16, 2019.

    1. General M2Dave
      General M2Dave
      If NRS answered all those questions, people would stop asking and complaining because they would understand the tournament vision that NRS has for this game. As far as special moves go, if I am a Kabal player and I want to preserve the use of a high execution character, I want to know whether the character will have the ability to cancel the nomad dash or not. We know he can, but we do not know whether this ability is an element of a variation system or part of a handful of special moves that will be deemed too powerful for competitive play. Even if your names are not Sonic Fox or Tweedy, you should care about this information because of its effects on online gameplay modes and potential unlocking of the abilities.

      Besides, everyone "theory crafts". The whole purpose of a character trailer and breakdown is to get you excited about a character that you like so you can imagine what playing him or her will be like when the game is finally released. Your opinion is in the minority. The vast majority of players, competitive or otherwise, care about this issue.
      villainous monk likes this.
    2. trufenix
      Okay dave, even you know that is untrue. You have literally never stopped complaining about NRS competitive vision, not since UMK3.
    3. Icefyre
      This is not an answer. Whether or not his nomad dash cancels will be deemed too powerful for competitive play is not something that will be fixed with the information you're asking for. We still need the game in order to assess these kinds of things. Its effects on online gameplay are, again, not something you'll know until we can actually play the game. Nothing you've said here actually makes an argument for your case.

      Here we go, the real reason. Theory crafting is fun, agreed. I don't personally feel like I need to know the information you're requesting still, but I can agree that having the information would make the theories more fun to discuss.

      Source? Because my personal perspective on this is that most people don't actually care. You bringing the issue up on the podcast was the first time I'd heard anybody complain about it.

      Love the podcast though, thanks for putting it up.
      ProudDisciple and wsj515 like this.
      I heard this somewhere in the cast but a big part of watching the reveals is trying to see who u will want to use. Right now I could give two craps about any character bc you have no clue what they can do. At least mkx gave a breakdown of variations and people had something to be excited for.

      Telling you right now. Want this game to suck and make balance impossible? Allow customization in tournament play. Imagine being a player who travels and has no means to train. Ya you play so and so and they have a good Zod or scorpion and you are able to get exp. so I have to find a player who plays every possible combination of moves to be prepared? If you think that is ok you have never traveled or had success in a fighting game.
      Rizz091 likes this.
      Icefyre .... have not heard that name before. So yep. The only people who do not think this is an issue are stream monster or people who can’t make it out of pools and maybe travel to one or two events a year. 99.9% of competitive players do not want customization and they want to know how tournament standards work. I can give two shits what sonic fox said bc 1)he is an outlier 2) he is just a shitty human being (commence the dickriders)
    6. Icefyre
      Wow. This is fun. Not only did you just ruin your entire argument with this unnecessary piece, you've shown just how skewed your perception is and your ego is on display. Lol I see why people say what they say about you now.

      I really wanted to play this game with you, but I'd have better luck convincing a flat-earther that the earth is round than actually getting anything accomplished here. Have fun suffering because you feel entitled to information that you want to cry about.


      Also, quick suggestion, the multi-quote tool is useful.
    7. DownfouralitY
      I want this explained as well. It’s bothering me that we’re almost 2 months away and still don’t have an answer for this. Of course they could still be working on it, but that’s a bit worrying if we’re that close and even they don’t know. I’m sure it’ll end up fine, but for myself, it is harder for me to get excited about my character when I don’t know exactly what moves I’ll be using if there is 3 built in variations. There’s certain Kabal moves I don’t like, like the gas blast and buzzsaw zoning, but I have no idea whether or not I’ll be stuck with one of those moves in the NDC variation or if I’ll get something I’d rather have like the parry. When you advertise the characters as if custom variations are the standard, I understand where the confusion stems from. It’s hard to talk about characters when you don’t really know exactly what they’ll play like, only knowing some tools they’ll have access to which could all change when the game comes out. Not saying it’s a huge deal or anything, but it’d be nice to get some clarification.
      Temp likes this.
      ... the earth is round? And yes I have embraced the heel. And speaking of earth, as long as there is one there will always be insignificant online forums where people argue about games. Good vs evil. Zoning vs non zoning. Competitive vs non competitive viewpoints. I can assure u nrs reads these and I can assure you they get a laugh and that’s all I’m going for. Don’t take it personal. I have not be a face since i1 days.
      StormGoddess and Icefyre like this.
    9. General M2Dave
      General M2Dave
      Wrong. NRS is making the game and streaming twice a month. The developers have plenty of time to inform the community about their visions. This argument is going in circles. Besides, 16 Bit has already posted in this thread and suggested that the information has yet to be released officially. So I assume they are finalizing whatever plans they have for tournaments. I appreciate the answer. In the mean time, the character trailers and breakdowns have limited value for competitive players.

      I have not complained about an NRS game since the early and broken versions of Mortal Kombat X that many of you fools praised so dearly. I guess those people are the same ones who are now whining about the lack of running in Mortal Kombat 11.
    10. RNLDRGN
      I completely agree with their point about variations not being set and moves not being divvied up yet. The game is about 8 WEEKS away from release and they still have no clue what moves go with what variations and have been pretty cryptic about tournament presets vs custom variations.

      I'm less worried about what I'm entitled to in these Kombat Kasts and more about this game launching as a complete mess and being patched to hell after the fact.
      Rizz091, Kroaken and Crimea like this.
    11. wsj515
      We'll have to agree to disagree because I think at this point you are just arguing your side for the sake of it, but the character trailers and breakdowns have had just as much value as they have ever had - the only value they provide is building hype for the game's release and nothing else, because you cannot think about moves, execution, or even whole variations without knowing their context within the greater game, and eventual meta.
    12. trufenix
      The trolling and prioritizing assumptions are cute, but the reality is the game isn't done. Bit and Jack literally stated on the last stream they had just gotten their hands on the new Baraka moves, ergo. . not done.

      Any assumptions that the lack of communication on the subject is based on deliberate misdirection or some sort of invisible fan bias is nonsense. The game isn't done, you're asking questions they literally cannot answer.
      villainous monk likes this.
    13. CmC_HAt
      Tweedy is a BIG star....
    14. spidey300
      if they want to keep some surprises, fine, but that cool stuff doesn't have to be moves locked away outside of ranked play. i watched all the injustice dev streams and the character trailers just to find out I can't use these cool moves. imagine my disappointment when I see red hood's sick trailer with him doing sick stuff but oh hol up, you gotta go unlock those moves you can't use in ranked anyway
    15. JBeezYBabY
    16. Under_The_Mayo
      We need more drama like this!
    17. Rathalos
      To me it seems like they weren't thinking far enough ahead or not everyone was on the same page, so they designed a pool of different moves with out thinking of how to separate them into 3 variations, so now it's awkward.
      SaltShaker and spidey300 like this.
    18. stokedAF
      Okay I see what you are saying. I don’t play injustice so I never watched it.
    19. villainous monk
      villainous monk
      I agree with @General M2Dave on his clarity of finding out if it's variations or or not. Too me this is a very valid question because years ago everyone had an opinion of it. Everyone wanted more or less or even as is. Now we're 2 months away and yet nothing about the competitive side of things. It matters greatly. So if he got some sort of answer then good.

      What I want to know is why keep it in the dark? Or say it right off the bat that it's still undecided on the various different variations. I don't think we need a slow reveal of that at all.

      Some more clarity on the competitive side should be addressed or at least mentioned soon. I question this because obviously with anxious players, to's and casuals wondering on the status of such issue shouldn't even be an issuse in the first place.

      This should've been answered in the first Q&A.
      Rizz091, Zhidoreptiloid and Circus like this.
    20. kcd117
      I can see where you are coming from but what you are saying is not necessarily the truth.

      First, fighting games should not be balanced around people that travel despite having no means to train. Just like every potential E-sports game they should reward the time you put into them. Being real, if you can’t grind like a top player you should not expect to place like a top player consistently.

      Second, having 20 different combinations of moves for every character is not a bad thing at all. It adds depth to the meta, it adds options for you to approach your matchups in different ways, and it also adds longevity to the game. Having moves locked behind a casual barrier is just bad. Kustom variations, if done right, allows players to build their character to fit their playstyle, adding a lot of variety to the game at the highest level and that keeps games alive.

      Finally, addressing the balance issues, we will have them anyway. Mkx had 3 variations and that didn’t keep It from having absurd characters like Royal Storm, Piercing, Sektor and Crystalline while also having absolute shitters like Unbreakable, Cyrax, Blood God, and Pretty Lady.
      In injustice 2, with no variations, we had top tiers like Catwoman, Black Adam, Flash, and Firestorm for years and at the same time, we had Raiden, Grodd, Raph, Joker, and Donnie...
      Balance is not gonna be perfect, but if being stuck with / dealing with pre-made variations that may be as shit as Donnie or as Broken as CW (while still being labeled as balanced by Lord Paulo) throughout an entire season of the game with no options but to adapt doesn’t scare you more than having a lot of options to build your character (while also having to learn how to deal with tons of stuff) and to counter some eventual broken stuff that is gonna come out anyway I really don’t know what to tell you.

      If a game has to have variations, I just can’t see a way that it would be in a better place with 3 pre-made options over countless customizable ones.
      Kroaken likes this.
    21. SaltShaker
      This is a pretty conflicting topic. I understand both sides pretty well.

      -On one hand it feels a bit off that two months away, one month before an announced demo, we don't know how the game will play competitively. Gives off a vibe that things are being rushed or put together last minute, which may or may not be the case. In general, the pre-release this go around seems a step behind in comparison to MKX or Inj2, or even Inj1 for that matter.

      -On the other hand, it makes sense that they advertise kustom variations as the priority. It is what much more people will be interested in when hearing info. Most people are actually hype to see built loadouts and how they can play multiple playstyles with one character.

      I dunno, a tough one here. Ultimately though I think all will be easily resolved with some sooner than later clarity on variations, ranked play, tournament standard, and the like.
      villainous monk likes this.
    22. Juggs
      No I didn’t. I said it was a more legitimate complaint than not knowing every detail about variations. Which that should tell you something. r/wooosh
    23. SubZeroIce
    24. Kroaken
      Ok. Thanks 16 :) can't blame a guy for trying.
      16 Bit likes this.
    25. General M2Dave
      General M2Dave
      If I had to guess, I would say that each character will have three variations, with some special moves only intended for customizable loadouts and thus unavailable for competitive play. I know some players are concerned about something entirely new and different such as legalizing customize loadouts, but Mortal Kombat X and Injustice 2 turned out to be very balanced and functional fighting games so everyone should give NRS the benefit of the doubt.

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