Turning Liu Kangs F43xx Tools Against Him (Short Guide)

[Mandolore1123]

I swear in this game aside from a few standout characters, characters like Sonya, Geras and Liu Kang are able to to do so many things so well, while other characters like Raiden and Kotal are able to do so many things poorly

 

[Bsb]

This doesnt help.if you will always w8 he can just do his full string and then he will do it again because he is +5 so you will eventually die from chip dmg lol this design is for braindead ppl just like geras.its ok to have 50/50 but to be able to do 50/50 and stagger and zoneing and to have safe strings and easy confirmable is op and imbalance,every char must have some good traits and some bad liu have only good...his design is just bad and aimed for casual players to win with out any effort especially online....yea you can win him but you must put 3 times the efford than him so yea bad design...

 

[M.D.]

Yes this thread should not be mistaken as a Liu Kang downplay or "how to beat Liu Kang".

He still is braindead broke as fuck and can win matches by an unmanned controller dropping down on a flight of stairs.
You still need to literally non stop guess to win and you have no hard counter to anything he does.

This thread is just a shred of hope, that before he gets nerfed into the ground, at least you don't lose 999 - 0 and you can at least do something when you get it right.

 

[lordlosh]

And of top of the others things already mentioned here, this characters have incredible easy combos, and you simply have no room for mistake, which is big.
Every time he connect, he have easy time convert to combo and easy time with the actual combo.
The other sh** thing about him its the breakaway. In his Bicycle Kick combo you cant breakaway. Also if you breakaway in his other combo he is 100% safe.
While i as Sub Zero player if i go for JK combo after Iceball, the opponent breakaway and can punish me.

And how the ** they decide to give him Low Fireball, High FireBall, Air FireBall, and he can amplify all of them + his full screen Dragon Kick, which also can be amplified.
And he can f* throw low and high Fireball at the same time, and there is no time to know if this is coming. So if you are trying to escape cheap damage with hop or jump, you will get f by his high fireball thanks to his ridiculous amplification.
And how they decide to give him super fast FB with lowest damage scaling in the game, and that he can early and late combo into it. One of the best KB in the game. And his damage is just crazy high.
Just like Magician said: "when you get close to killing him you are the one who dies."
Everytime you are below 450hp, and he is in the FB zone its just game over for you. He just need to hit you and his FB will come and its over for you buddy. His FB can land on any f**** successful attack he did.
This is just crazy.,

LawAbidingCitizen, with all due respect when you are making videos to show your point, and everyone can believe to it, when recording show the recording and the playback option you put.

In this video specifically after Liu Kang did his combo he is blocking extremely late.
Im talking about that video:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1163958203744305153

Its the second combo, its start at 0:05 seconds:
I dont understand what you are trying to show there.

And you just mention few of his option, and he have many options. He can just end the combo at F43, he can go for D2 or D3 or like ninjakilla often do go for shaolin stance, go for the low or cancel it. He can also timing his attack, and that will mess with your plan, your head and your reaction.

And the window you have to punish his mixup are very low. You have to be 100% ready and timing it perfectly.
I agree with you that there is a window, but the window it`s not huge like most punishable move in the game. Thats why a lot of pros eats a lot of KB and a lot of FB trying to punish that move. The window is very short, your timing have to be perfect, yet he have like 10 option.

This is the problem.

 

[Darkperson6]

I play LK myself and this post is what i've been telling for so long. Everyone just says "F4 everything and win". That's not the way to play him. Everytime i get the mirror online i mostly beat other LK because they over use F4. As you stated F4 is reactable stagger, most options actually get beat if you block and you practice of F.Blocking the u3. If he just goes for F43 and throws ,if you consistently block the mixups, he is still -7 giving you plenty of time to react even online. 12 is way too good and b1 and b3 are the godlike staggers. All i see from the people complaining about LK is that they dont lab at all. He is really strong top 5 for sure, but not broken. Everyone expects to learn MU's in 10 minutes. I had issues with the Baraka MU and guess what i labed and i found it more reasonable. If only people tested things before burning all of us the Kang mains

 

[Bsb]

I play LK myself and this post is what i've been telling for so long. Everyone just says "F4 everything and win". That's not the way to play him. Everytime i get the mirror online i mostly beat other LK because they over use F4. As you stated F4 is reactable stagger, most options actually get beat if you block and you practice of F.Blocking the u3. If he just goes for F43 and throws ,if you consistently block the mixups, he is still -7 giving you plenty of time to react even online. 12 is way too good and b1 and b3 are the godlike staggers. All i see from the people complaining about LK is that they dont lab at all. He is really strong top 5 for sure, but not broken. Everyone expects to learn MU's in 10 minutes. I had issues with the Baraka MU and guess what i labed and i found it more reasonable. If only people tested things before burning all of us the Kang mains

The game did not release yesterday and liu is the same as he was so let's drop the caramel about "they dont want to lab him"!they have lab him and he is a broken brain dead char.ofc you will try to find excuses so you can say to yourself that you are winning the matches but you are not liu is winning them for you!you can say what ever you want to your self to feel better but facts are facts

 

[lordlosh]

Check how many times SonicFox get hit by the famous F4....

You can watch the whole set here:
From 08:20 to 43:30

Twitch

Twitch is the world's leading video platform and community for gamers.

www.twitch.tv

 

[Hellbringer]

Oh shit its lordlosh again posting sonicfox videos. Im out

 

[Darkperson6]

The game did not release yesterday and liu is the same as he was so let's drop the caramel about "they dont want to lab him"!they have lab him and he is a broken brain dead char.ofc you will try to find excuses so you can say to yourself that you are winning the matches but you are not liu is winning them for you!you can say what ever you want to your self to feel better but facts are facts

As i said in my post Liu Kang is a top 5/ top 3 character in the game right now for sure. As you said he has been the same since launch and has been characterized as braindead from the start, i dont argue with that opinion. What i argue about is the sudden wave of people calling him BROKEN. Also my post wasnt to downplay LK just mentioning that this F4 button that is the demon for this community is not the reason why he is so good. Everything else he has makes him good.

 

[lordlosh]

I play LK myself and this post is what i've been telling for so long. Everyone just says "F4 everything and win". That's not the way to play him. Everytime i get the mirror online i mostly beat other LK because they over use F4. As you stated F4 is reactable stagger, most options actually get beat if you block and you practice of F.Blocking the u3. If he just goes for F43 and throws ,if you consistently block the mixups, he is still -7 giving you plenty of time to react even online. 12 is way too good and b1 and b3 are the godlike staggers. All i see from the people complaining about LK is that they dont lab at all. He is really strong top 5 for sure, but not broken. Everyone expects to learn MU's in 10 minutes. I had issues with the Baraka MU and guess what i labed and i found it more reasonable. If only people tested things before burning all of us the Kang mains

Nqh he is not broken:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1162211067730128902

Hellbringer, bye wont be missed.

 

[Darkperson6]

Nqh he is not broken:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1162211067730128902

Hellbringer, bye wont be missed.

12 is really good ngl. yes 12 is a frame trap, but 12 into 12 doesnt jail you since its a double high can interrupt with d1/d3. I am only talking about this clip btw before you witch hunt me. Also the endless 12 not making the game not end, is a glitch and only works when the match is over. It happens a lot i've seen online with a lot of characters, that need to get fixed. It happens with sweeps as well i think

 

[Sazbak]

While i as Sub Zero player if i go for JK combo after Iceball, the opponent breakaway and can punish me.

After freeze J3, input only b14 then wait for a possible breakaway, then input 3 bf3 and you won't get punished.

 

[lordlosh]

After freeze J3, input only b14 then wait for a possible breakaway, then input 3 bf3 and you won't get punished.

I know that, but in online matches its get f****.

 

[Darkperson6]

That is some good info and informative guide to help players struggling against him, good stuff! However, I don't really think this becomes a less lopsided 50/50 when you know your options, especially after F4.

Let's take a more in-depth look at his F4:

F4 is a 9 frame advancing mid with decent range that sits at -7 on block with very little blockstun. F43 is the extension of F4, it comes out in 13 frames and is very hit confirmable.

By the game's math, an F4 stagger followed by another F4 takes 16 frames to come out, only 3 frames more than the gapless F43. It is humanly impossible to react to an F4, as 13 frames is a barely recognizable, add to it the time to recognize and act accordingly and Liu is already at frame advantage again. You have to commit in order to beat him. You can't just wait and react, and if you are wrong, congratulations, you just took a bike kick into basically guaranteed meaty jik oki and have to guess between strike or 50/50 throw KBs with a throw loop.

F4 into D1 takes 14 frames to come out and beats highs, so if your character doesn't have a fast mid to commit to after an F4, chances are a smart Liu player will steal the turn with this move after an F4. For many characters, the only option to avoid this is to poke. In this case, if you guess right, the turn is yours, if you guess wrong, he either combos you or takes his turn back putting you in the same shitty situation.

F4 into throw comes out in 17 frames and beats any late normal. If you guess right here you can get a decent punish by ducking it, but if you guess wrong... take that full combo into same shitty spot again.

This is just his F4, I'm not even mentioning the layers on his B1, B3, F3, B2, 12, etc...

Liu and Jacqui are the only characters in the game to make you go through this amount of layers of guessing just to get your turn. You have to guess for your life to get a chance to play the game and this is not fun, not fair and not even remotely balanced.

I consider myself pretty good at playing this matchup, good at recognizing patterns, very well-versed at flawless blocking the shit out of everything this character does on hit/block/oki, but I just can't get comfortable with the amount of guessing I'm doing every time this potato touches me.

Just addresing the frame data in your post. F4 has 9f start up and -7 block advantage. That means the recovery frames last longer than the block stun by 7 frames. The recovery frames still occur thus giving more time to react. I'm not currently at home and dont remember the exact recovery frames. F4 stagger mixup is reactable and of course online depending on the ping it is unreactable. Also if you condition your opponent to always expect F43 even of they can react to F4 stagger they might still get caught. Still F4 is a really good stagger nonetheless

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

And his weakness is what exactly?

No doUbT he is top 5 but I'd say his weakness is range and can easily be outspaced and out footsied.

A good example of this is Sonics Cassie vs Ninjakilla's Liu Kang:

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

No doUbT he is top 5 but I'd say his weakness is range and can easily be outspaced and out footsied.

A good example of this is Sonics Cassie vs Ninjakilla's Liu Kang:

Main take away from their games is how deadly an auto shimmy is
It goes to show you how tech and strategy can be circular...I mean NK can just block and take his turn and likely whoop Sonic's ass in almost all of these games. But it's way more easier said than done obviously.

 

[Mandolore1123]

No doUbT he is top 5 but I'd say his weakness is range and can easily be outspaced and out footsied.

A good example of this is Sonics Cassie vs Ninjakilla's Liu Kang:

I want to say yes but I’ve been hit too many times trying to move back and whiff punish and his F43 hitbox just sucks me in. I don’t think he’s unbeatable and OP. He’s just like every other top tier in this game. He plays many things well while lower tier characters can either do one thing pretty good but suck at other aspects or they can do a little bit of everything but suck at all of them

 

[lordlosh]

Liu Kang range is more than perfect. In that particular game ninjakilla was totally outplayed. That has nothing to do with characters.
Even he said the pressure get the best of him in this match and he totally freeze.

 

[GLoRToR]

His F4 just needs to be 11f like every other mid instead of 9f like he plays mkx instead of mk11.
This unfair inconsistency is one of the reasons NRS games are considered a joke in the fgc.

 

[PreNerf_]

Oh I know you can flawless block it I just don’t know if I’ll be able to keep blocking I’m case of fireballs or parries, and also be prepared to flawless block it too. Normally I just commit to holding block or making a read that he’ll do f43u3

No , there is no point in fb it. If you do your doing the same damage as just punishing the gap and if they throw a fireball then the fire ball will hit you.

 

[PreNerf_]

His F4 just needs to be 11f like every other mid instead of 9f like he plays mkx instead of mk11.
This unfair inconsistency is one of the reasons NRS games are considered a joke in the fgc.

Dude it's not the frames on it that are the problem for people and people just f4 all day are easy to beat.

 

[ChoseDeath]

I swear in this game aside from a few standout characters, characters like Sonya, Geras and Liu Kang are able to to do so many things so well, while other characters like Raiden and Kotal are able to do so many things poorly

This is what that made me think of as a Kotal main.

 

[PreNerf_]

He literally has everything. Great staggers, great mids, great zoning, great FB, great damage, 2 throw KBs, full screen punish with dragon kick, a parry that can FULL COMBO into 500 damage. And his weakness is what exactly?

His weakness is that to play him at a high level you have to take chances with him. Cause in high level play f43 shinanigans won't work by themselves. Everything that he does with f43 I either punishable on read or on reaction. Every character in the game has shimmies and some type of plus frame or jailing, some sort of highs and lows. His best tool is his f12 and you can d2 krushing blow that.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

You're not humanly reacting to a f4 stagger

the hesitation between f4 and the 3 is just enough that you have to hard read it.

That is his stagger and it is annoying as fuck.

 

[Kanalratte]

His F4 just needs to be 11f like every other mid instead of 9f like he plays mkx instead of mk11.
This unfair inconsistency is one of the reasons NRS games are considered a joke in the fgc.

he can keep his F4 9f. it's the hitbox that is absolutely braindead dumb. i mean this is batman J2 level BS. So i guess they will never fix it.