Video/Tutorial - Grandmaster Sub-Zero public service announcement

[Bildslash]

I've practiced against SZ setups in the lab and I swear if SZ just takes a small step backwards the b2 can't be punished and the opponent gets frozen because SZ's and the Clone's hitboxes no longer collide. But I'm no SZ main so I wouldn't know for sure.

 

[RM Ree]

The proposed SZ solutions to the examples Tom gave are hilarious. Take a step back as they're punishing us? GM SZ mains are like Ethiopian kids chewing on rocks Peace Corps Paulo tries to feed us and we're like, "They don't taste /that/ bad"

 

[Nate]

It really is too bad that all this crazy shit happened to Sub. I came into the game thinking I was going to be all about Takeda but ended up picking up cryomancer instead. Right away I loved everything about that variation, but saw that all the rage was about grandmaster so I decided to give that a go as well. I have a ton of fun playing it, but I noticed pretty quick that a ridiculous amount of stuff just kind of randomly pokes through it. It's frustrating for me and god knows I'm not playing on a professional level.

I also must say I had no idea the sort of hate I was walking into. Maybe I haven't been around long enough to understand it, or maybe I'm just not a huge whiner so I don't get it. I found the grandmaster match-up pretty tough (fighting against one that is), but sometimes I could pull out a win, and it felt good every time. I never felt the urge to go online and go nuts about it, I actually initially struggled with inferno scorpion for awhile, and Jax gave me a ton of problems, but my knee jerk reactions to being absolutely murdered was never "better hop online and scream". Because I know I'm not at a level where my opinion on these things is really worth much lol.

I'm a huge @Tom Brady fan, ever since I got into watching the FGC, and I think the work he's done with Sub has been amazing. It makes me cringe when I see people with what basically amounts to fuck all tournament experience compared to him, come on here and offer some of the weakest bullshit I've ever seen. Whether it's justifying why it's ok to call him a crybaby, offering some advice when even I can tell that they don't know what their talking about, for fuck sakes I've seen people say that it would be ok to make the video, but his tone of voice is what makes it bad. Like jesus fucken christ, I feel like it's a lot of Monday Morning quarterback bullshit tbh.

I gotta say, at the end of the day, for all everybody runs there mouth about him, I would much rather have NRS listen to what Tom has to say, rather than listen to a bunch of assholes who think managing to scrub out some wins online makes their opinion actually valid. Remember, just because you have an opinion doesn't mean your not an idiot, or that it's informed.

Keep doing what your doing Tom, I think a lot of us are big fans of yours, we maybe just aren't as vocal and ignorant as the people that just fling shit all over these forums. Either way, I'm rooting for you at EVO man. Make a post with new GM tech once it's over please!

 

[coolwhip]

The difference is that when people, including yourself early in the game, say he is #1 - he gets normalized. When I say something nothing happens.

This is where I end the clone talk. It is what it is. I've long moved on and completely changed up how I play because I need to play better and use the character properly. I just don't want any more nerfs that could potentially happen later in the game.

Aren't you a Predator main?

 

[I GOT HANDS]

I like how both videos basically consist of Tom pushing the false narrative that complainers got Sub nerfed when if you look at Dave's thread, the consensus, the overall majority, did NOT get clone nerfed.

But yes, continue to blame TYM. Because Paulo never makes decisions for himself.

that thread and the first 30 days were mostly people spamming NOT to nerf anything and to let it rock. sorry you got caught up in tom's narrative.

A thread doesn't make it to 30 pages of everyone just agreeing in a circlejerk. The majority may have been sensible enough, but the constant whinging and controversy surrounding Sub was quite clearly enough to get results

I was pointing out that thread as proof that many people on both sides were having a very lengthy discussion about the Ice Clone being too good.

Exactly.



If anyone is caught up in the narrative, it is he who thinks that these threads had no impact on Sub's changes. JUST A MASSIVE COINCIDENCE AYEE BOYS

 

[I GOT HANDS]

I've practiced against SZ setups in the lab and I swear if SZ just takes a small step backwards the b2 can't be punished and the opponent gets frozen because SZ's and the Clone's hitboxes no longer collide. But I'm no SZ main so I wouldn't know for sure.

Except by moving out of punish range of B2 you are now out of connect range of any low starter, making the B2 completely worthless to throw out as it will be blocked everytime by an opponent who knows the match up

 

[Evil Canadian]

the boy who cried nerf

 

[Rude]

A thread doesn't make it to 30 pages of everyone just agreeing in a circlejerk. The majority may have been sensible enough, but the constant whinging and controversy surrounding Sub was quite clearly enough to get results



Exactly.



If anyone is caught up in the narrative, it is he who thinks that these threads had no impact on Sub's changes. JUST A MASSIVE COINCIDENCE AYEE BOYS

If the majority were sensible, how would the whiners - the minority be overheard?

Makes no sense.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

If the majority were sensible, how would the whiners - the minority be overheard?

Makes no sense.

Because they took a 30 pages through debating it.

And that's acting like thats the only place they kept it all, it was flooded through shitloads of other threads as well.



Your perspective on this being completely unrelated to Sub-Zeros nerf seems detached and makes no sense to me.

 

[Rude]

Because they took a 30 pages through debating it.

And that's acting like thats the only place they kept it all, it was flooded through shitloads of other threads as well.



Your perspective on this being completely unrelated to Sub-Zeros nerf seems detached and makes no sense to me.

I think Paulo is a grown ass man who has developed video games longer than you and I have, and probably makes his own decisions.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

I think Paulo is a grown ass man who has developed video games longer than you and I have, and probably makes his own decisions.

I think he did make his own decision, and that was to squash the non-stop balance bickering Sub-Zero was getting at the release of his game. And it worked. No 30 page threads any more no matter how hard we try.

 

[Rude]

I think he did make his own decision, and that was to squash the non-stop balance bickering Sub-Zero was getting at the release of his game. And it worked. No 30 page threads any more no matter how hard we try.

You know, Full Auto Jacqui had whole Kotaku articles to how broken her guns were.

She had whole live streams dedicated to showing how cheap and broken they were.

Ed Boon's twitter was flooded with Jacqui nerf demands.

And yet...

Jacqui remained the same.

The Sub Zero outcry was nowhere near as bad.

 

[C88 Zombieekiler]

If sub just takes a step back away from the clone. He will not get hit by a normal. B2 has range. No reason to be so close. But w.e. As long as sub doesnt get nerfed ill be happy.

hes only safe off of f4 bro the rest can be armored reversal for a full combo so stop posting this absolute bullshit in the video he cant walk back he is being punished incase you dont know what punished means its when a character like sub does a move like his overhead which is -13 so if jax does f3 which is less than 13 frames because sub zero is still recovering from the b2 he gets hit

 

[XxTheGoblinX]

hes only safe off of f4 bro the rest can be armored reversal for a full combo so stop posting this absolute bullshit in the video he cant walk back he is being punished incase you dont know what punished means its when a character like sub does a move like his overhead which is -17 so if jax does f3 which is less than 17 frames because sub zero is still recovering from the b2 he gets hit

Thats cute.

 

[C88 Zombieekiler]

Thats cute.

@Everyonewhowantstostaysane boycott this utter idiots posts hes a casual who reckons hes something more when the longest set hes played is geetting the same guy in ranked twice.

 

[XxTheGoblinX]

@Everyonewhowantstostaysane boycott this utter idiots posts hes a casual who reckons hes something more when the longest set hes played is geetting the same guy in ranked twice.

Id play you ft10 and shut you up but you play on the shitbox.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

If sub just takes a step back away from the clone. He will not get hit by a normal. B2 has range. No reason to be so close. But w.e. As long as sub doesnt get nerfed ill be happy.

Nope. I'm testing it and I can't find the range where you can be in range of a B33 and a B2 and they cannot normal you through the Clone. I'm open to be proved otherwise, feel free to show me a vid. But if not, and you are only in range of a B2, then they have absolutely no reason to block low as it's not a 50/50, and you just blocked on the Overhead every single time.

You know, Full Auto Jacqui had whole Kotaku articles to how broken her guns were.

She had whole live streams dedicated to showing how cheap and broken they were.

Ed Boon's twitter was flooded with Jacqui nerf demands.

And yet...

Jacqui remained the same.

The Sub Zero outcry was nowhere near as bad.

So now your argument is that nrs NEVER listens to the community on anything when it comes to changes and nothing has ever influenced their opinion? Just because they didn't back down about Jacqui? I think the SZ issue was a little deeper and a little less clear cut than the Jacqui one.

 

[Scoot Magee]

This is what happens when you have a scrub as community and a developer that patches based on their crying. Poppy nrs will protect them.

 

[Scoot Magee]

I think we can all agree that there's been a consistent pattern when it comes to people's bitching and the changes that take place.

 

[LeoMK29]

It's all in fun until we have to slit our wrists

 

[Rude]

Nope. I'm testing it and I can't find the range where you can be in range of a B33 and a B2 and they cannot normal you through the Clone. I'm open to be proved otherwise, feel free to show me a vid. But if not, and you are only in range of a B2, then they have absolutely no reason to block low as it's not a 50/50, and you just blocked on the Overhead every single time.


So now your argument is that nrs NEVER listens to the community on anything when it comes to changes and nothing has ever influenced their opinion? Just because they didn't back down about Jacqui? I think the SZ issue was a little deeper and a little less clear cut than the Jacqui one.

I think if the impact was as big as you seem to think, it would be more consistent.

We can agree to disagree. I just don't think Paulo is this mindless drone that does whatever TYM asks.

 

[skater11]

Subzero is still very good. his standing 4, f33, f4, b33, b2.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

I think if the impact was as big as you seem to think, it would be more consistent.

We can agree to disagree. I just don't think Paulo is this mindless drone that does whatever TYM asks.

NP NP, neither of us really know for sure, it's open to interpretation as it stands

 

[RM Ree]

Id play you ft10 and shut you up but you play on the shitbox.

@Everyonewhowantstostaysane boycott this utter idiots posts hes a casual who reckons hes something more when the longest set hes played is geetting the same guy in ranked twice.

I've played Goblin in a pretty long set before. He's well versed, in a lot of different characters. Good luck.

 

[C88 Zombieekiler]

I've played Goblin in a pretty long set before. He's well versed, in a lot of different characters. Good luck.

doubt it