Starfire Matchup Discussion

[Roy Arkon]

I didn't either, but when I ignore plus frames with bf2 ppl say it reminds them of hawkgirl.

Ok just came home and searched for some stuff and I think I figured it out. Hawkgirl in IJ1 also had this BF2 move that Starfire has in IJ2, same inputs and same properties, and Hawkgirl was indeed a super mobile char in IJ1. Starfire in IJ2 is indeed a super mobile char on her own, so you do need to play not just by her Zoning but also by her mobility and even her up close game, which is indeed very true, and basically the main reason why I play her. Also because I do like her character of course.

 

[TarkatanDentist]

TBF I don't think I've really fought against enough solid Hellboys/Mantas/Blue Beetles to comment much on those. As for Captain Cold being a good MU for Star... can I be honest and say I frequently forget that Captain Cold is even a character in this game? Lol.

Still, I definitely agree with you that bf2 is a deliciously disrespectful tool. It's astonishing how often folks are so afraid of MB bf2 into bf2 that they'll simply keep blocking and let you pressure them.

 

[Espio]

I really don't believe or see how she has a bunch of "I can't play Starfire, I need to counter pick match ups." She is very solid and with the added benefit of not being super hard to use. The other thing is that I feel like a lot of people latched onto a very particular play style early on with her and didn't want to deviate from that so that's why the disparities in all her match up exist among the community.

Also, Blue Beetle should realistically be winning this match up 6-4. even with her buffs it didn't really stop how he plays the match up.

With all that said, she definitely a good co-main character and I like having her to compliment Beetle in match ups these days.


She went from criminally upplayed to criminally downplayed and I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.

I didn't either, but when I ignore plus frames with bf2 ppl say it reminds them of hawkgirl.

She basically plays super identical to Hawkgirl due to her insane chip damage, charge and mobility. All her MB moves are obnoxious and safe so her being -1 with the threat of making you eat over 200 damage on MB charge into trait let's you disrespect even more, similar to Hawkgirl with wing evade 3. 2 and mace charge.

She's super irritating because she makes typical counter poking tactics ineffective and due to the range and reach of charge she can screw with typical counter zoning attacks like Cheetah's leap and what not.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Ok this is why I think starfire vs ivy is even

The zoning is pretty much damn near even against the two of them. Whoever gets it started is going to win and they both have options around it. Starfire is a Queen when it comes to chip and Ivy’s barkskin REALLY comes into the play in the MU because she can set it up in a variety of ways, especially during the zoning. Yoshi is still good in the MU as well because it can still help Ivy’s zoning and makes starfire’s zoning less effective.

Upclose is a damn near even battle as well. Both have really good neutral, good footsies, good buttons, good damage, etc.

The match up is literally turn by turn and whoever gets the life lead is pretty much going to win it. Both play their game well and both have ways to counter each other.


I play both characters and I feel like Ivy players play the MU wrong. They’re convinced it’s 7-3 on starfire’s favor and I’m just like naaaaaa lol.

If anyone did win tho, it’s starfire

 

[GJX7]

Personally I disagree with everything Tarkatan said besides Green Arrow and Atom. She either beats Fate or it's even. Starfire will come out ahead if she just uses 1/4 of her trait at a time and lands often. If Fate wants to just duck forever then you can just dust, and dust into trait or dust into another dust is a mix up.

I think she loses pretty bad to Beetle, Hellboy, Manta, Darkseid. Supergirl is probably 5-5 now since it's dumb for Supergirl to deal with her being -1 or -2, with the d1 nerf. Superman and Flash definitely lose to Starfire like that's not even debatable to me. Bf2 is just such a stupid move vs those characters. They can be hard to anti air but you just gotta space them properly.

Posion Ivy probably doesn't lose as bad as Ivy's say, but I doubt it's tricky. If she puts bark skin up she still can't do anything without taking trades.

One of the best reasons to use Starfire imo is that she goes 5-5 with Black Adam and Catwoman. I don't think Starfire is all that overall but she does do fine vs these two character, that are super relevant in the meta. Vs Catwoman just find the sweet spot where you can d2 her jump ins. You want to be right outside the range of jump 1, and where you can low profile her jump 2 enough to get your d2 off. Don't use dust a lot because Catwoman is small and really fast. Optimize your whip trip punishes and what not.

Black Adam can get frauded out a lot by bf2, also black magic is punishable on block by trait. You can read lightning preemptively with a jump and trait. He's hard to anti air though, like he'll just jump right through b2 and db3 no matter how well you time them sometimes. Make sure you're punishing f12 properly with a d1 juggled into a 113 or 21.

It was mentioned at the end that Bane is at a severe disadvantage which is not true at all imo. I also understand that there aren't really too many good Banes so I could understand the misconception. He has arguably the best forward dash and meterburn roll in the game, which are very effective against duck trait/star dust mind games. Punishing his overhead is really annoying since the patch, and he can just bulldoze your wake ups and armor through numerous gaps that are typically non-existent.

Even if you think Bane loses after playing Bio which is the only Bane in my mind, there's no way Bane is worse off than characters like Captain Cold and Green Lantern, or even joker.

Thanks! Leo's hardest matchups are Black Adam, Atom, Doctor Fate, Red Hood and Robin. So is Atom very difficult or is it winnable?

 

[Cursa]

Thanks! Leo's hardest matchups are Black Adam, Atom, Doctor Fate, Red Hood and Robin. So is Atom very difficult or is it winnable?

Kind of hard to get stardust going against Atom since it's reactable imo. Any air shot (projectile or trait) can probably also be punished since Atom can just TP in the air. Probably a good trade, like 9% for a bar of meter I think? Something really low. Conditioning is what it's for though I guess but I would say don't get too deterred by getting hit by yolo tele's.

Trades with stomp are like always in Atom's favour imo. I think her D1 whiffs against Atom's trait so he is a little free-er to go for throws and shimmies in trait instead.

Have fun never getting anti-aired ever though.

Didn't really answer your question but that's my take on it at least

 

[Jowabunga]

I've been running a ton of matches against a friend (Black Adam) over the last couple of weeks and really drilling down on the matchup. It's mostly even but I really feel like Starfire, with good reads and patience, controls the pace with her zoning and antiair tools. Pretty ironic that a supposedly shit character (see the first few pages of the thread) can hang with some of the highest-tier characters.

That said, my biggest issues at this point in the matchup are when I don't maintain good spacing and depend too much on her close-up neutral (which isn't fantastic). More specifically: 1) Her lack of a strong advancing mid has me over-reliant on F22. 2) BA's 7-frame D2 is my bane, especially on F22 or F2/1+3 on whiff which turns into roughly 25% meterless every time. I need to break myself of the F22 thing and work on my spacing and all will be well.

Thoughts on her neutral game otherwise for this matchup?

 

[Sazbak]

Hi guys!
I'm looking for an easy to play character that can demolish both Aquaman and Superman.
I was wondering how Starfire performs against these 2.
If she is not good, could you recommend me an effective and easy to use counterpick?

 

[HapHaxion]

Hi guys!
I'm looking for an easy to play character that can demolish both Aquaman and Superman.
I was wondering how Starfire performs against these 2.
If she is not good, could you recommend me an effective and easy to use counterpick?

Starfire probably 6-4s them both, but a few others like Atro, Adam, Cyborg and RH probably do as well, so you just need to find who you like playing the most out of those if the aqua-superman counterpick is the most important thing for you.

 

[Parasurama]

I really don't believe or see how she has a bunch of "I can't play Starfire, I need to counter pick match ups." She is very solid and with the added benefit of not being super hard to use. The other thing is that I feel like a lot of people latched onto a very particular play style early on with her and didn't want to deviate from that so that's why the disparities in all her match up exist among the community.

Also, Blue Beetle should realistically be winning this match up 6-4. even with her buffs it didn't really stop how he plays the match up.

With all that said, she definitely a good co-main character and I like having her to compliment Beetle in match ups these days.


She went from criminally upplayed to criminally downplayed and I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.





She basically plays super identical to Hawkgirl due to her insane chip damage, charge and mobility. All her MB moves are obnoxious and safe so her being -1 with the threat of making you eat over 200 damage on MB charge into trait let's you disrespect even more, similar to Hawkgirl with wing evade 3. 2 and mace charge.

She's super irritating because she makes typical counter poking tactics ineffective and due to the range and reach of charge she can screw with typical counter zoning attacks like Cheetah's leap and what not.

Is Starfire a bad match up for Cheetah?

 

[Espio]

Is Starfire a bad match up for Cheetah?

Absolutely. Great anti-air options with back 2 and shooting star, trait can blow up leap low profile, she goes over sweep reliably. Cheetah has no real answers for her jumping around like an idiot and gets outspaced pretty reliably and charge is also the bane of her leap stance and leap shenanigans in general because it blows up Cheetah's attempts to low profile and leads to huge chunks of damage.

Beetle doesn't beat Starfire anymore, it's maybe 5-5 because of how much damage Starfire does on her zoning, great anti-air options and comparable footsies. She out chips him as well. She keeps up or does better in too many categories to lose to Beetle in the current version of the game in my opinion. I might do a match up chart for Starfire soon.

 

[Tweedy]

I think trait stance Beetle beats her for sure. Her footsies and anti airs are really shitty vs it. Blaster stance is probably 5-5.