So... Why Did Zoning Suck in MKX?

[MKF30]

Just curious, has anyone ever used Spectral in a tourney with Ermac? If so, can you link me? I'd watch that.

 

[Wigy]

I read what you said, read what I said. Ok, so we agree that they're both zoning characters. Ok, good the rest I'll agree to disagree. That's your view, you're entitled as am I.

What? Can you read, i'm saying sektor and ermac arent and kitana etc are.

If you wanted to make this argument you should have given examples at high tournament level of characters getting properly zoned out by them, which just didnt happen.

When you start talking about online, you just insantly look stupid.

I'll leave it there

 

[Wigy]

Just curious, has anyone ever used Spectral in a tourney with Ermac? If so, can you link me?

@Nausea

 

[MKF30]

What? Can you read, i'm saying sektor and ermac arent and kitana etc are.

If you wanted to make this argument you should have given examples at high tournament level of characters getting properly zoned out by them, which just didnt happen.

When you start talking about online, you just insantly look stupid.

I'll leave it there

Yes I can read fine but you weren't that specific. Well, you're still wrong then. Sektor and Ermac are zoners and so is Kitana. Again, not talking about online you're the one who keeps bringing up online now. I'm talking the way they're meant to be played....regardless of on or offline, they're played the same offline if anything better because as you pointed out there's no shitty netcode to worry about.

When you misread what I say you look stupid. You're entitled to your opinion but I'll bet my right arm and 1000 bucks majority on here if polled would agree with me regarding Ermac and Sektor being viable zoners in MK 9 vs not. That is all.

 

[Wigy]

Yes I can read fine but you weren't that specific. Well, you're still wrong then. Sektor and Ermac are zoners and so is Kitana. Again, not talking about online you're the one who keeps bringing up online now. I'm talking the way they're meant to be played....regardless of on or offline, they're played the same offline if anything better because as you pointed out there's no shitty netcode to worry about.

When you misread what I say you look stupid. You're entitled to your opinion but I'll bet my right arm and 1000 bucks majority on here if polled would agree with me regarding Ermac and Sektor being viable zoners in MK 9 vs not. That is all.

Funny that you just misread what i said twice when it was clear.

You're unwilling to accept that online characters aren't played to the highest standard, which is common knowledge. So whatever. Your opinions are completely out of wack with legit every top player and the community in general..

 

[MKF30]

Funny that you just misread what i said twice when it was clear.

You're unwilling to accept that online characters aren't played to the highest standard, which is common knowledge. So whatever. Your opinions are completely out of wack with legit every top player and the community in general..

Starting to think you don't know what the word zoning means.

I think you're trolling me at this point because nobody can be this slow, you just refuse to admit you're wrong with Sektor and Ermac being zoning viable. It's ok, denial is normal when proven wrong. You keep talking online, online, online. Not me. I'm talking character archetype, the way they're meant to be played but you can keep believing your own little story. To further prove my point. Nope, sorry but you don't speak for everyone, like I said if I polled this topic majority would agree with me that Ermac and Sektor are among the solid viable zoners in MK 9, not to mention again I've done it at locals. You're clearly new to MK games and are attempting to ride the trend train thinking a few people who agree with you represent "the entire community" lol


Watch this and learn something please, what is flow trying to do when he gets space from KL? Do explain. Oh wait, that's right he's ZONING. Oh and btw that's offline not online. Even Teamspooky the commentators say "trying to maintain the zone" @10:05 in....

As for Sektor being zoning viable, you never heard of @PND_Ketchup have you?

 

[PooPost]

It wasn't just zoning, it was spacing as a whole. The game has the run, fast forward advancing normals, awful whiff recovery on every move, the ability to land full combos after connecting with the very tip of your hitbox off of a jump in, corner carries that go almost the whole stage, full screen presence on all the top tier characters, and overwhelming oki. The game just rewards playing very aggressively and winning the point blank game above all else.

I want to clarify that I don't think there is anything wrong with that and that doesn't mean the game isn't deep. It just has it's own set of viable play styles that can't be categorized the same as Street Fighter's or even MK9's.

 

[Espio]

Also I would not be calling others 15 when you think posting half naked pics of yourself is impressing anyone with Johnny Cage cosplay pics. Trying to audition for Jersey Shore bro? lol Jelly? No, why would I be? I'm in shape, my BMI is where I'm supposed to be I just don't feel the need to showboat about it.

Girl, is you crazy? @Wigy looks like certified USDA organic whole milk. I'm impressed and a lot of people were too. (On the real though guys, try to keep it on topic and drop the ad hom or I will have to infract/first warning).

 

[SonicNinja3532]

Girl, is you crazy? @Wigy looks like certified USDA organic whole milk. I'm impressed and a lot of people were too. (On the real though guys, try to keep it on topic and drop the ad hom or I will have to infract/first warning).

Just infract the guy anyway, probably sound biased here but after reading the mk server trash page on him and seeing his posts, the guy is a psycho. Surprised he hasn't been banned yet let alone infracted.

 

[SonicNinja3532]

On the topic of the thread though, zoning certainly is good in MK, but due to the run and the amount of anti zoning tools and just general rushdown orientation, it's just not as good. Zoning is certainly viable in mk, it's possible to keep someone out, just not all game, which to be fair is a good thing anyway.

 

[JDM]

It wasn't just zoning, it was spacing as a whole. The game has the run, fast forward advancing normals, awful whiff recovery on every move, the ability to land full combos after connecting with the very tip of your hitbox off of a jump in, corner carries that go almost the whole stage, full screen presence on all the top tier characters, and overwhelming oki. The game just rewards playing very aggressively and winning the point blank game above all else.

I want to clarify that I don't think there is anything wrong with that and that doesn't mean the game isn't deep. It just has it's own set of viable play styles that can't be categorized the same as Street Fighter's or even MK9's.

i feel like im a spacing dependent player and that's how I like to play, and MKX just didn't reward that enough for me. I could make proper reads with my spacing and get fucked for it by one slight miscalculation and lose the game to skill less 50/50s.


It took me a LONG time to get good at spacing people out, and even then I still would get rolled sometimes just by a slight miscalculation since my characters didn't really have good reversals. It was wayyyy easier to just pick Tarkatan and just rekka people to death. It was sad how much better rushdown was. Spacing and stuff got a lot better with the last patch though. Anti-airs were stronger, runs were toned down, pressure was toned down, blocking actually was viable.. But by that patch I already lost most of my drive to compete in this game.

 

[MKF30]

Girl, is you crazy? @Wigy looks like certified USDA organic whole milk. I'm impressed and a lot of people were too. (On the real though guys, try to keep it on topic and drop the ad hom or I will have to infract/first warning).

lol. No worries, I'm done with him he's on ignore. I have no interest in fighting further with him.

 

[Wigy]

I think mkx had a couple of busted characters who could get around zoning nicely and then punish the fuck out of you for it. But on the whole zoning was still there if you were good, hell go look at sonic with gunslinger vs scars sonya, that boy made some insane reads on the slow ass coin toss and kept him out all game. This was prepatch demo with sonya at her most retarded levels.

 

[JDM]

meh i wouldn't say a couple I'd say a large majority of the cast could get around zoning pretty easily. Sonya (even when she was broken) actually really wasn't one of them. Still wayyy easier than now, with the buffs to AA and nerfs to run. And even then, if you kept her out the entire game and she got a read in you were pretty much finished l u l

 

[ismael4790]

On the topic of the thread though, zoning certainly is good in MK, but due to the run and the amount of anti zoning tools and just general rushdown orientation, it's just not as good. Zoning is certainly viable in mk, it's possible to keep someone out, just not all game, which to be fair is a good thing anyway.

It's actually not a good thing, since it's possible to bully someone up close all the game.

Up close pressure and zoning should have the same power in any game that wants to be called balanced.

Also, I've read things like "zoning is good, it's just that anti-zoning tools/ pressure are better". Lol, then zoning IS NOT good, since you have to look at it in the context of the whole game, and not isolated. If the tools of the zoners get countered or surpassed by the ones other styles have, then zoning is not good in mkx. Same as you can't isolate a character from the rest to say if he's good or not, you can't do it with styles.

 

[Wigy]

It's actually not a good thing, since it's possible to bully someone up close all the game.

Up close pressure and zoning should have the same power in any game that wants to be called balanced.

Also, I've read things like "zoning is good, it's just that anti-zoning tools/ pressure are better". Lol, then zoning IS NOT good, since you have to look at it in the context of the whole game, and not isolated.

Theres a shit tonne of safe armour, you can armour interactables, you can use invincibility frames jump out into a divekick for jailing plus frames.

Theres a bunch of ways to force people off you.

Speaking of which i think those jump out interactables are actually really stupid. Why do they meterlessly have inv frames into plus frames.

 

[MKF30]

It's actually not a good thing, since it's possible to bully someone up close all the game.

Up close pressure and zoning should have the same power in any game that wants to be called balanced.

Also, I've read things like "zoning is good, it's just that anti-zoning tools/ pressure are better". Lol, then zoning IS NOT good, since you have to look at it in the context of the whole game, and not isolated. If the tools of the zoners get countered or surpassed by the ones other styles have, then zoning is not good in mkx. Same as you can't isolate a character from the rest to say if he's good or not, you can't do it with styles.

 

[ismael4790]

Theres a shit tonne of safe armour, you can armour interactables, you can use invincibility frames jump out into a divekick for jailing plus frames.

Theres a bunch of ways to force people off you.

And even with that, rushdown has proven to be immensely superior to zoning, so imagine at what point we were lol.

Actually it's super debatable if armor changes benefited defense. A pressure character will happily take one hit of a safe armor, take your meter and get in again since when he does he knows you will pay your mistakes 10x harder. Run exists. Risk reward is in his favor, he's not gonna get launched by armor anymore. Pushblock costs 2 bars.

I make a zoning character work. That doesn't mean I can't see the flaws of this style in this game, and how picking a rushdown character makes your life much easier, since this style is what is in tune with mkx mechanics.

 

[Baconlord]

Ok, I take it you're seriously asking. True Skill is the rank measured based off the skill level of opponents you face. The higher the TS rating, the better the player is. Most from here and tourney players who play online tend to be anywhere from 32-37 range. Anything below that is considered lower. The highest I ever personally got was 36 but once I stopped playing it was 34, it fluctuates based off your wins/loses to other skillful players.

ok but how is it calculated. and if this true skill rating is so accurate how come it's never returned since

 

[SonicNinja3532]

It's actually not a good thing, since it's possible to bully someone up close all the game.

Up close pressure and zoning should have the same power in any game that wants to be called balanced.

Also, I've read things like "zoning is good, it's just that anti-zoning tools/ pressure are better". Lol, then zoning IS NOT good, since you have to look at it in the context of the whole game, and not isolated. If the tools of the zoners get countered or surpassed by the ones other styles have, then zoning is not good in mkx. Same as you can't isolate a character from the rest to say if he's good or not, you can't do it with styles.

By that logic though, doesn't that mean that mid tiers are therefore shit because the higher tiers are better?

But anyway, I'm speaking more generally that zoning shouldn't mean you can keep someone away all game, and similarly you shouldn't be able to endlessly pressure someone, but you can't do either in this game because there's enough get off me tools to not be bullied up close all game.

We can agree to disagree, but imo zoning is good, just not as good as rushdown.

 

[neveradestroyer]

Zoning sucks a lot indeed.... for Lackey, Because not having any zoning tool sucks in MKXL.

 

[MKF30]

ok but how is it calculated. and if this true skill rating is so accurate how come it's never returned since

It's not in MKX? I thought they brought it back, to be honest I stopped playing MK X a year ago maybe they've made changes to the way they work too. IDK. When I played, they had a true skill system but it was implemented every differently than MK9's.

 

[ismael4790]

By that logic though, doesn't that mean that mid tiers are therefore shit because the higher tiers are better?

But anyway, I'm speaking more generally that zoning shouldn't mean you can keep someone away all game, and similarly you shouldn't be able to endlessly pressure someone, but you can't do either in this game because there's enough get off me tools to not be bullied up close all game.

We can agree to disagree, but imo zoning is good, just not as good as rushdown.

I wish the difference between rushdown and zoning was the difference between mid tiers and top tiers in this game, which by the way is still not as it should be.

Also, in a sense, the existence of differentiated tiers means a failure in balance process.

Yeah, let's agree to disagree.