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Discussion in 'Smoke' started by G4S KT, Apr 10, 2012.
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I don't think it is, really. It's good because of how easy it is to hitconfirm into smoke bomb on hit but I don't think it's that ideal to be be preemptively throwing out just outside footsies range. Characters like Sub-Zero and Sonya don't care about it because they have better footsies tools in their respective d4's.
Gpood whiff punish, not so much footsies, though, imo.
What a fucking scumbag, making people miss the point of the thread by mentioning "reset".
This attempt to change the community's perception might be futile but I don't give a FUCK.
Tbh, if the resets actually made that much of an impact, you'd see more Cyrax/Jax/Smoke players actually placing top 8. Fact is, you don't.
There's more to a game than just damage. There's a reason why characters like Frost in MKDA or Fei Long in ST aren't top tier despite having such consistently viable high-damage options. Shit goes way beyond that.
I reserve my right to complain about damage exploits, low hitboxes, safe armour combo launching, reset having son of a guns. Screw you all. That is all.
I would trade the reset for nothing as long as we could keep our cancelling out of the F4 normal... so annoying if this ever gets patched to the actual PS3 game.
well, sub-zero got over nerfed. I always supported him keeping his EX ground freeze reset.
I think KT should get a muffin for his attempts at rationality.
I'd trade Cyrax's resets AND 2X regular Bomb juggle combos for a low combo starter or hitbox.
If they'd nerfed his damage and kept the reset, or kept his damage and nerfed the reset, he'd be set. Taking them both made life quite difficult for Mr. Freezypop.
The difference between a regular tool like a dive kick and big ass combos is that the resets make you feel like you got screwed.
The logic that b+2 being an overhead is a non issue because no one blocks low against Smoke makes no sense. Why do you think no one blocks low against Smoke? If b+2 was special mid then everyone would block low against Smoke all day.
these characters like cyrax and smoke that don't get chip from zoning should have these super high damaging resets to make up for it imo
My favorite example is NEC. There were about a dozen known cyrax players there. You know who made top 8? Only Maxter.
Na, that thing was lame. It was a 50% 1 bar wall carry and was super hitconfirmable off his 9frame startup string. Sub-Zero is a machine when he has you in the corner, too, so it was op.
Oh man, I remember that.
There were fucking robots EVERYWHERE.
People were getting knocked out left and right by Cyrax via Krayzie, Noobe and the like, but when it came down to the wire, only Maximo emerged.
Knowing the shit we know now, it wouldn't have catapulted Sub to godliness at all.
Its not a reset if its guaranteed. idk how many time I have to say it but ill say again.
If a reset is guaranteed then its not a reset. its a damage reset combo which is bs. There are 2 ways to fix this
1) Get rid of it b/c of obv reasons
2) Give everyone in the cast guaranteed resets a.k.a damage reset combos
I don't see why people think this is ok. I do like the fact there letting this marinate to see what it does tot he meta but NO ONE is using it in the meta and people who try mess up b/c they have no practice in a real fight
That's only because other characters have too much (soap bar in my mouth) stuff and Tom Brady thinks Sub is a top 10 character again due to his OS clone stuff which very few people know about, so, in all honesty, who knows. My opinion is that all the dubious stuff should go so the game has less dirt but if all the dirt stays, then Sub's dirt might as well have stayed, too, I suppose. Sub-Zero would be a massive threat if he still had his ex groundfreeze reset. He gets plenty of 21 opportunities off his 8 frame d4, lol. I think he'd be pretty ridiculous.
Cyrax and Jax reset is consistently being performed in competitive play, and the Smoke players that can do it are (Except for Jr).
He still wouldn't be as ridiculous as the top 5. Sonya, Cage, Freddy, Kenshi, Kabal.
I think he would be because you would be incredibly hesitant to interrupt 21 pressure. If he was doing 21 pressure, and you tried to blockstring or poke out, and he crossed you up or just took a gamble on the full string into iceblast... good game. I don't know, he'd be frightening to play against.
This I know but for some reason aside from KT Smith I don't see this reset performed. Even Jr doesnt do it a lot.
Just the fact that we're having the discussion about how he "might" be as good as the top 5 means that he shouldn't have gotten nerfed.
People were and are too eager to change shit around on impulse. If it's not Ivan Ooze god tier OP it doesn't need to get nerfed until marinating in the meta game for at least 6 months.
What justification was there to nerf potentially top 5 subz into mid tier? He should have been left in his 1.03 state.
( THTB )
he goes for it a lot but drops it a lot too.
Yeah you even told me its bc he doesnt really practice it.
I'm just assuming that. The timing has always been very tricky, I just make it look easy